Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics Reticles, What Gives?

I have spent a lot of my idle time over the past month shopping and researching scopes. The more I research, the more I realize how ignorant I am. Let's set aside the whole SFP vs FFP discussion and talk about how folks use reticles.

I'll use this one scope as an example. There are many more like it. If you had this reticle (not manufacturer) on an exposed turret dialing scope, would you use the horizontal and vertical markings? https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-razor-hd-lht-3-15x42-riflescope.html?vortex_reticle=18351If so, how? I handled this scope and looked through it at Cabelas. It's billed as a hunting scope. It didn't naturally draw my eye to the center. Why would they not add an upper vertical crosshair? Or a punctuated circle? Or some other aid to draw the eye to center more naturally?

There was a thread here a few months ago where this reticle received high praise for those who used it. Near universal praise, and I too love it. It's natural, simple and functional. https://riflescopesinfo.wordpress.com/2014/03/05/redfield-accu-range-reticle/ For someone like me who wants something like that in a quality hunting scope, there really isn't anything.

A few questions for the masses.

Do you dial?

Do you use reticle subtensions?

Does anyone do both?

Do you have a need for all the markings on your scope?

Do you find yourself wishing for simpler reticle options?





And lastly, what the living fuhgk?

https://www.nightforceoptics.com/te...-plane/horus-tremor3-reticle-illuminated

I do both.

I don't like it too busy. Leupold PR1 is just about perfect for me.

There are competitions that require you to use holdovers and not dial. That is who extravagant Christmas trees are for.

They are not for the fuds, but a lot of flat bill fuds think they look cool.

What are examples of when you use the elevation dial and when you use subtensions on that scope?

I don't dial, shoot fairly flat cartridges and max distance is 400-450 yards or so depending on what animal. My favorite reticle is the Swaro 4a followed by the Ziess #20 Zplex. I have no need for or interest in busy reticles.
Typically I sight in 2" high at 100 yards and am good to go.

I have one rifle set up with a BDC reticle that I use for open country predator hunting. I don't dial as reaching up to dial a scope is just one more movement for a coyote to bust you with. 95% of my shots are under 200 yards so most of the time a straight duplex with a #1 and #4 German reticles my favorite. Most of my rifles are flat enough shooting to be able to hold on fur to 300 yards, 20P, 22-204, 22-250.

i like that redfield reticle. i hunt only. no need need for competition/sniping reticles ...

I dial and hold. My preference is to dial elevation and hold wind. I prefer a FFP reticle with bold outer bars and thin inner bars. I prefer an "even" reticle with the same spacing of everything on all 4 sides as it helps me subtending on broken backgrounds and in low light. Illumination is a plus if it's very low and even on all sides....the smaller the area of the reticle illuminated the the lighter the illumination the better.

These % are very close for my deer and coyote hunting over the past 10 years:
~90% of my hunting is 100 yards or less so I have no need to dial or hold.
~10% of my hunting I dial or hold elevation and hold wind.

Rough guess on my shooting for rifles. I keep a 100 yard zero. If I didn't change scopes so much the 100 yard or less shooting wouldn't be much at all:
~90% of my shooting I dial or hold elevation and hold wind for (past 100 yards)
~10% of my shooting is 100 yards or less so I don't need to dial or hold.

I use all of the following.

My favorite hunting reticle:

[/quote]

Next in line for hunting:



Third place, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides and could do without the xmas tree:



Fourth place,...again, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides:




The next reticle I'd like to try:

My absolute max shot limit is 400 yds, but I much prefer to be within 300. I also like things simple and uncomplicated especially during the stress of a shot situation. A duplex or post and crosshair, like a German #4, are all I need.

My rifles and scopes are separated at birth...my real world sporters have simple uncluttered reticles, are only checked for verified zero at the beginning of the season. I am not a game animal sniper.
The toy section has big heavy rifles with christmas tree reticles, for distant targets. In a fit of optimism a few years back, I bought a couple Zeiss Rapid Z 600's, for some reason. Haven't used the subtensions on game, so I guess I bought something I didn't need.

Next in line for hunting:



Third place, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides and could do without the xmas tree:



Fourth place,...again, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides:




The next reticle I'd like to try:



[/quote]


I like that top reticle. Like you, I prefer symmetry, but for different reasons.

Next in line for hunting:



Third place, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides and could do without the xmas tree:



Fourth place,...again, wish the bottom was the same as the top/sides:




The next reticle I'd like to try:



[/quote]


I should note, most of these FFP reticles look like a duplex from about 4x (+/-) and below. Some you can still see a little of the inner details but in use they are just duplex in use at lower powers.

I like the symmetry/even reticles for drawing my eye to the center as well as for subtending. I can use the others fine but my eye prefers even outer bars.

I hold wind, and dial and/or hold elevation, depending on the situation. Every scope I use for hunting is FFP, and I like Christmas trees. I could care less about symmetry, and don't care if there is a vertical bar above the horizontal or not...they don't really serve a purpose, but they don't get in the way, either. I do greatly prefer illumination on FFP scopes.

The Bushnell G3 is pretty perfect, and the SCR in the Burris XTRs ain't bad, either.

I get that we will all have different thoughts about the way the reticle "feels." Let's discuss the function of the G3 reticle and the circumstances under which you might use the various "functions."

What would you use the extreme lower left (for example) marking on the Christmas tree and why wouldn't you dial and use the windage markings instead?

Both. I prefer to dial ele & hold wind, but my last two ‘long range’ kills have been all holding with reticle, due to time constraints and only having two hands. But last year’s moose was basically point blank and on low power...

With the experience from those kind of scenarios, I strongly prefer a FFP MRad w/ a ‘simplified’Christmas tree reticle, with bold posts and some kind of dot or circle to help with lower power, point & click type of opportunities. Just my preference.

There are a lot of uses for the extremes in such reticles. I have shot out 1000yd several times using nothing more than holds, making solid, consistent hits.

For my .308, for example, 600yd with a 10mph full value wind, the hold is 5.5 mils up, with 2 mils wind, and that puts me square in the usable realm of the tree. If I miss my wind hold, those extended wind holds present at the extremes give me more usable real estate to make correction. At longer ranges, there may be time to dial, and just as likely not. When shooting pigs, for example, it is not uncommon to start shooting at 200, and still have time to engage runners out to 5-600yds. In these situations, there is zero time, or need, to dial.

That helped me get a better feel for how you use both. I don't have much respect for a pig, but how do you compensate for a pig running 20 MPH at a right angle from your line of sight when it's 600 yards away. How do you know how much to lead? I simply can't wrap my head around how you know which of the Christmas tree dots to use when range may be changing quickly, your wind may be howling and your target hauling ass.

It helps to view me as a skeptic who is willing to change his mind, but all of the possible variables make me question the utility of some of this stuff. It seems to me that when critters are moving too quickly to range and dial that the variables become too unmanageable to ensure a humane shot.

Don't look anything up. Snap these answers off the top of your head. Assume you are elk hunting with your favorite rifle wearing the scope with the G3 reticle. A B&C elk is it trotting for a treeline 650 yards away. He's moving at a right angle at 15 MPH with an accompanying crosswind of 10 MPH. This would seem to be the kind of situation where you use the Christmas tree right? How long does it take your bullet to reach him? How far will the elk travel in that period of time? How much will your bullet drift in that period of time. Add the wind drift and the lead real quick and apply the correct ornament on the tree?

I don't offer the questions as an antagonist, but rather to try to get a grip on something that truly baffles me.

A combination of both is faster. I killed an antelope with 1 shot @ 777 yards i was sighted in 2 MOA high at 100 yards and needed 12 3/4 MOA more elevation. My reticle had 2 MOA hash marks therefore I used line 6 and dialed 3/4 MOA elevation and 1 MOA windage
Dropped in its tracks

That helped. I appreciate it. Had you memorized your dope or did you have to look at a card.

If we are going to be truly honest....I would never take that shot on an elk or deer. On a pig, all bets are off, and I don't really care if its a humane shot...it doesn't hurt my feelings a bit when they run off in the timber and I don't have to drag them off the field. I have no issue walking shots in, and making adjustments as I go. I will typically dial to where I think I need to be, and holdover to compensate.

Pigs don't run that fast, especially when you are shooting them with a suppressed rifle. They kinda shuffle off the field....I know that all sounds very ambiguous, but its how I do things, and why I like the scope setups I do. If I were a high country elk hunter my preferences would very likely be different, but I am not and the way things look, I never will be. I would never being to assume that my choices work for anyone else, let alone everyone else.....but I sure can't see where having more data on the windshield is ever a bad thing, even if you never use it.


Edit: I see you mentioned memorizing dope. I have a pretty good rough idea in my head of what my come ups and wind holds are, but I do have a cheat sheet affixed to every rifle. Some are on the ocular scope cap, but I have come to really like the Data Card patches and stickers. They are easy to reference very quickly, and never leave the rifle.

As an aside, I have actually begun reducing my battery to fewer rifles and caliber with the intent to get really familiar with them. As I get older, it makes less sense to have a whole bunch of stuff that I know pretty well, instead having a few rifles I am intimate with.