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Joined: Nov 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 29,663 Likes: 5 |
Again, why is it important to identify an objective source for these shared values?
I think we have seen why a higher authority and source of nature’s rights is important in the argument about Constitutional rights. TJ recognizes this issue in the Declaration of Independence when he recognized natural rights that came before govt, and which govt was instituted among men to protect. When Leftists challenge our God-given right to self protection with a handgun or AR and then say “we don’t believe in God” does that, in our pluralistic society, mean we’re no longer allowed to exercise that right? Upon whose authority, the the Constitution is altered or ignored, do we have to say it’s ok? In this case I’ll point out for M9mm that this isn’t even a Christian argument but one recognized as foundational to our republican system of government even by deists like Jefferson.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
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.... but when it comes to the very young, yes they do get a pass and if they die before they reach an age of accountability they go to Heaven. Cite chapter and verse please Age of accountability has been discussed here before and Christians argued amongst themselves coz some said 7 yr old and others said around 20 yrs ...except Bible doesnt give a number ....LoL...so they make their own schit up in the usual fashion. I see the sharing of the Word not as a threat, but as a lifeline. Your motivation is known only to you.
The word is your god created and empowers Satan....a loving God really ? As a believer you need to respect his divine work no matter how sinister and diabolical it is. Would someone put their Bible decoder ring on and give a spin story how all that evil is a good thing coz it was gods creation .. Asaiah 45:7 (KJV) - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things -.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 21,890 Likes: 12 |
God is a unifying concept to help feeble men consolidate the vastness of their ignorance. I am glad of that... for my ignorance is without measurable bounds.
Religion is man's attempt to garner power for himself... very akin to the current "you are a racist" movement that is wildly popular now... for many.
My relationship with my God is mine and mine alone.
You relationship with your God (or no God) is yours and yours alone.
Of course there is overlap... same as the air we all breathe... God planned it that way.
If you are not actively engaging EVERY enemy you encounter... you are allowing another to fight for you... and that is cowardice... plain and simple.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 67,330 Likes: 51 |
For the first time in 80 years, the number of Americans with dedicated church attendance has fallen below 50%. According to a Gallup poll released Monday, only 47% of those polled confirmed that they are members of a religious body. This is quite a decline from previous years of polling, which saw the number hover around the 70% mark for several decades. Unsurprisingly, the downward trend began around the dawn of the new century.
In the past few years especially, the secular religion of politics has become an obsession. On the Left and Right, adherence to a political philosophy can overshadow, or at the very least compete with, all other long-held beliefs. While the shift didn't suddenly begin in 2008, it was certainly pushed further along by Barack Obama's presidency. In response to his eight years in office, the Right searched for an answer that would stem the tide of progressivism. President Donald Trump created his own revival among the GOP faithful. Many religious conservatives even found a deep connection between his election victory and the idea that God would save the nation through him. But political allegiance isn't the same as spiritual, no matter how closely they resemble one another.
Americans seem to be finding a religious-type fervor in things outside the walls of the church, political or otherwise. Added into the mix is a pandemic that has discouraged attendance, and churches are emptier than ever. The global health crisis upended life as usual, and even committed attendees had to change their habits for safety reasons. At the start of the pandemic, nearly every church in America shut its doors to in-person services. By the end of last year, roughly 80% had opened back up for these regular services. But attendance is still incredibly low compared to pre-pandemic levels.
According to the Pew Research Center, the percentage of Americans who consider themselves to be nonreligious or unaffiliated is now at 29%. This has been a somewhat rapid rise from the 17% who said the same in 2009. As those who identify as Protestant or Catholic decrease, the so-called nones, as Pew describes them, have risen.
Eviction moratorium is unconstitutional, federal judge rules This shift toward a less religious American landscape is a loss for society. Beyond the chief reason for church, communing with God, and meeting with those of like-mind, church attendance brings other benefits. Religious communities are important players in cities and towns. A 2019 study by Pew shows that those who attend and are actively involved in church tend to self-describe as happier and more civically involved than their counterparts. It's not a mystery as to why this is the case. Connecting with others who share similar beliefs in a regular setting brings a strong sense of belonging. The camaraderie is unlike anything else found in other community organizations.
Our national discourse is fraught with anger and tension. There has been great struggle, sacrifice, and sadness over the past year. There is uncertainty surrounding both economic and public health. With challenges still remaining, there is no better time to seek spiritual guidance and hope at places that foster relationships and fellowship.
Kimberly Ross (@SouthernKeeks) is a contributor to the Washington Examiner's Beltway Confidential blog and a columnist at Arc Digital. I hope youre at Sunrise Service RIGHT NOW. with some skin-in-the-game. Sure put my time in. For many years. Then cooked breakfast for hungry ass Boomers. Not today, I slept in. Saving up for the friggin ‘Easter egg hunt’ that happens at 11am up there. The wife has the unfortunate draw of getting “nursery duty” today. Wonder how many brats will shît their onesies. Church and Church work sucks the life out of the 10% that do all the work. That’s why not many want to go. Theyre tired of taking care of lazy pew warmers that just to be coddled and have someone read to them and make them feel good. They don’t like sermons about commitments, church edification, kingdom work, discipleship and the Great Commission. Just lolly gaggers. Checking their watch, till it’s time to go stuff their pieholes agains at the catfish house or pizza buffet.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,513 Likes: 1
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,513 Likes: 1 |
Church and Church work sucks the life out of the 10% that do all the work. That’s why not many want to go.
But isn't that true with almost any organization? Your gun club, for instance?
Don't blame me. I voted for Trump.
Democrats would burn this country to the ground, if they could rule over the ashes.
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Joined: Jul 2015
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
Hey antlers,
that is one Beautiful church you have there.
Did it cost the parishioners much to build?
I bet anyone can attend too. You sound like Judas Iscariot.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
So we blame religion on the problems of our nation. We should be getting better if that's the case since the church is losing it's influence. We've taken God out of everything for the last 60 years and we still are seeing a decline in morals. Shouldn't that trend be going the other way if it was right to do that? Maybe if we pass a law against religion it would help. It’s not taking “God” out of everything.... it’s taking common sense, decency, civility and reality out of everything. God has nothing to do with it. Exactly, these values are not the exclusive domain of Christianity and pretending they are does a major disservice toward their achievement. No, jack, those values aren't exclusive to Christianity. But the notion of inevitable suffering and the fact that suffering doesn't have to be in vain IS exclusively Christian. The rest of the World is running around chasing good times and doing all they can to avoid pain & death. When those good times end, they have nothing. They have lost their highest value. It's very sad.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
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If you can't even give God 1 hour a week, why would you want to spend eternity in worship & praise? Huh? What? Worship and Praise for Eternity?...Is that written somewhere, and if so, tell me how that sounds like a wonderful way to spend forever? Let's not put the cart before the horse. First of all, you have to understand why we are here. Why are we here, why do we exist?
Politics is War by Other Means
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 67,330 Likes: 51 |
Church and Church work sucks the life out of the 10% that do all the work. That’s why not many want to go.
But isn't that true with almost any organization? Your gun club, for instance? I guess, same for anything like that. Of note, I’ve never been part of a ‘gun club’. I can make my own schnitzel and shoot my centerfires in the backyard. 🤠👍
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,073 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,073 Likes: 4 |
So we blame religion on the problems of our nation. We should be getting better if that's the case since the church is losing it's influence. We've taken God out of everything for the last 60 years and we still are seeing a decline in morals. Shouldn't that trend be going the other way if it was right to do that? Maybe if we pass a law against religion it would help. It’s not taking “God” out of everything.... it’s taking common sense, decency, civility and reality out of everything. God has nothing to do with it. Exactly, these values are not the exclusive domain of Christianity and pretending they are does a major disservice toward their achievement. No, jack, those values aren't exclusive to Christianity. But the notion of inevitable suffering and the fact that suffering doesn't have to be in vain IS exclusively Christian. The rest of the World is running around chasing good times and doing all they can to avoid pain & death. When those good times end, they have nothing. They have lost their highest value. It's very sad. I see you don't know a thing about Buddisism.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,073 Likes: 4 |
Truth. I can even like Antelope Sniper and pray some day he'll buy me a steak dinner. What a heavenly thought. I can even pray we have that dinner in Heaven together. Yep, and with the great guy Gunner too. Well, a guy can dream, cant he? Doc, If Heaven is a steakhouse in Texas, that's possible.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
I see you don't know a thing about Buddisism. Buddhism teaches people the path they believe leads to a cessation of suffering. Christianity teaches us how to embrace suffering as part of the path to salvation. Christianity says there is no avoidance of Earthly suffering and that it's cause is our fallen nature, something we can't change. Buddhism says the cause of suffering is ignorance, attachment, and aversion. Cessation of suffering is possible through the "right" path. Buddhism says that "Nirvana" (Heaven) can be achieved through “the noble eightfold path: right views, right resolution, right speech, right action, right living, right exertion, right mindfulness, right concentration”. No word in that about embracing the Cross. About as close as Christianity gets to that is the concept of virtue leading to a better life, but not one that excludes suffering. Yes, I understand Buddhism. I studied it for several years and implemented many of it's practices before realizing that it is at heart self-centered.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 61,076 Likes: 22 |
In our neighborhood, small midwestern towns are simply drying up, and blowing away.
Many of the young people have moved away, and the old folks are dying off.
These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o "May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Church and Church work sucks the life out of the 10% that do all the work. That’s why not many want to go.
But isn't that true with almost any organization? Your gun club, for instance? Uhhh, no. LOL
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
In our neighborhood, small midwestern towns are simply drying up, and blowing away.
Many of the young people have moved away, and the old folks are dying off. ^^^Read 100 of spongehead’s posts^^^ and tell me you wanna spend two hours a week in a church. LOL
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,632 Likes: 3 |
[quote=IndyCA35]For the first time in 80 years, the number of Americans with dedicated church attendance has fallen below 50%. According to a Gallup poll released Monday, only 47% of those polled confirmed that they are members of a religious body. This is quite a decline from previous years of polling, which saw the number hover around the 70% mark for several decades. Unsurprisingly, the downward trend began around the dawn of the new century.
In the past few years especially, the secular religion of politics has become an obsession. On the Left and Right, adherence to a political philosophy can overshadow, or at the very least compete with, all other long-held beliefs. While the shift didn't suddenly begin in 2008, it was certainly pushed further along by Barack Obama's presidency. In response to his eight years in office, the Right searched for an answer that would stem the tide of progressivism. President Donald Trump created his own revival among the GOP faithful. Many religious conservatives even found a deep connection between his election victory and the idea that God would save the nation through him. But political allegiance isn't the same as spiritual, no matter how closely they resemble one another.
Americans seem to be finding a religious-type fervor in things outside the walls of the church, political or otherwise. Added into the mix is a pandemic that has discouraged attendance, and churches are emptier than ever. The global health crisis upended life as usual, and even committed attendees had to change their habits for safety reasons. At the start of the pandemic, nearly every church in America shut its doors to in-person services. By the end of last year, roughly 80% had opened back up for these regular services. But attendance is still incredibly low compared to pre-pandemic levels.
According to the Pew Research Center, the percentage of Americans who consider themselves to be nonreligious or unaffiliated is now at 29%. This has been a somewhat rapid rise from the 17% who said the same in 2009. As those who identify as Protestant or Catholic decrease, the so-called nones, as Pew describes them, have risen.
Eviction moratorium is unconstitutional, federal judge rules This shift toward a less religious American landscape is a loss for society. Beyond the chief reason for church, communing with God, and meeting with those of like-min
I hope youre at Sunrise Service RIGHT NOW. with some skin-in-the-game. Sure put my time in. For many years. Then cooked breakfast for hungry ass Boomers.
Not today, I slept in. Saving up for the friggin ‘Easter egg hunt’ that happens at 11am up there. The wife has the unfortunate draw of getting “nursery duty” today. Wonder how many brats will shît their onesies.
Church and Church work sucks the life out of the 10% that do all the work. That’s why not many want to go.
Theyre tired of taking care of lazy pew warmers that just to be coddled and have someone read to them and make them feel good. They don’t like sermons about commitments, church edification, kingdom work, discipleship and the Great Commission. Just lolly gaggers. Checking their watch, till it’s time to go stuff their pieholes agains at the catfish house or pizza buffet.
I’d say the 10% thing is a sign that there are too many programs and social business going on than the real purpose of the church. Sitting back looking at all the stuff that has nothing to do with the Gospel .... take that away .....
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 20,494 |
If you live a good, moral life, you'll end up where you're supposed to. In that, you are saying that you can "do good" yourself into heaven. If that is the case then Jesus died for nothing. In reality, there are none who can merit going to heaven without Jesus' righteousness imparted upon us None! It's the work of the cross not our own good works. No matter what you (or I) do, we will never be good enough to go. Romans 3:23 NIV ..... for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, Isaiah 64:6 ...... But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousness [good works] is as filthy rags Amen. That hits the nail on the head. Good reply.
"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23) Brother Keith
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,632 Likes: 3 |
The article laying out research my Christian Smith seems to no longer be available on the net but there are a good number of articles written concerning the article.
In the early 2000’s he did research that looked at what teens and young adults of various religions and Christian denominations understood of truth, faith, God etc. The summation of what was found up was broken down conceptually to “Moralistic Therapeutic Diesm”. It’s with reading some sound articles that can be found since the research abstract isn’t accessible today.
Most of what passes as a representation of the Christian Faith on this forum reflect what his research revealed.
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 23,686 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 23,686 Likes: 1 |
So we blame religion on the problems of our nation. We should be getting better if that's the case since the church is losing it's influence. We've taken God out of everything for the last 60 years and we still are seeing a decline in morals. Shouldn't that trend be going the other way if it was right to do that? Maybe if we pass a law against religion it would help. It’s not taking “God” out of everything.... it’s taking common sense, decency, civility and reality out of everything. God has nothing to do with it. Exactly, these values are not the exclusive domain of Christianity and pretending they are does a major disservice toward their achievement. No, jack, those values aren't exclusive to Christianity. But the notion of inevitable suffering and the fact that suffering doesn't have to be in vain IS exclusively Christian. The rest of the World is running around chasing good times and doing all they can to avoid pain & death. When those good times end, they have nothing. They have lost their highest value. It's very sad. I see you don't know a thing about Buddisism. Beat me to it... 4 noble truths: 1) Life sucks 2) It sucks because you’re materialistic and vein 3) It doesn’t have to suck 4) Quit being a materialistic self involved [bleep] and it will suck less
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 23,686 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 23,686 Likes: 1 |
So if you live a good life, help others whenever possible, do no one any harm. Raise good kids etc... but don’t accept Jesus as lord and savior, you go to hell. But you can be a murdering, child rapist and repent and accept Jesus 15 min before they throw the switch on your ass and you’ll go to heaven?
Makes total sense....
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