Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire My concerns with the vaccine

Just like "conspiracy theory" is a PSYOP, so is pegging all push back against Fluoridated public water with lunacy. The general acceptance of Fluoridated municipal water is a necessity because Fluoride is an unavoidable toxic byproduct of big industry that would otherwise need to be halted, since disposing of it safely otherwise would be economically unfeasible. Massive dilution into municipal drinking water nationwide (under the cover of being a benefit to dental health) is, therefore, the only feasible alternative. Thus the campaign to peg its opposition with nuttiness, such as we see in this clip. It's a PSYOP. There are many PSYOPs running concurrently. They are deemed necessary for the "greater good."

I'm 57 and I got the vaccine, for me it's a roll of the dice. I'm active outdoors and my primary fear is the potential long term health implications of catching the virus and dealing with lung issues, fatigue and other aliments that have been reported. I have not encouraged my three sons, all in their 20s, to get the vaccine, it's really up to them. I don't plan on having any more children but they all do and they are young so the implications are different for them. My 81 year old mother refuses to get the vaccine and her reasoning is 1) it came from a lab in China, 2) she doesn't know what's in it and 3) she doesn't trust the government. I say to her it doesn't matter where it came from, it's here, we don't know what's in most of the drugs we take but we can find out if we really care and I also don't trust the government but every government on the planet is encouraging their citizens to get vaccinated. The younger you are, the more you may have to loose with the vaccine. For my mother at 81, what does she possibly have to lose compared to what she may face with the virus. I understand it's a crap shoot at this point but what we have to loose is mostly related to our age and health. For me, I'm 51/49 % for so I got the vaccine, I'm willing to take the risk to maintain a somewhat normal lifestyle with travel and activity outside my home. My mother is betting against the casino and I've got to find a way to educate her on the odds. I understand it's a personal decision for everyone but the implications of being wrong can be severe.

I agree and the governmental overreach with the Covid is borderline if not criminal. Spain's supreme court ruled this month that their lockdowns were unconstitutional. Don't know what will happen with that, but at least one court recognized the overreach.

Alabama Gov. Kay Ivey said people are “supposed to have common sense” as she unloaded on unvaccinated people for driving coronavirus outbreaks and hospitalizations in her state.

“It’s time to start blaming the unvaccinated folks, not the regular folks. It’s the unvaccinated folks that are letting us down,” she said at a Birmingham event Thursday night that aired by the CBS WIAT affiliate.

Only about a third of Alabama’s population is fully vaccinated against COVID-19, putting it worst in the nation alongside Mississippi.


About 49% of the U.S. population is vaccinated. The rates for Alabama and Mississippi are around 34%.

The top reasons people give for not getting the shot include fearing the vaccine side effects are worse than COVID-19 and not trusting the vaccine because it only as “emergency approval” from the U.S. Food and Drug Administration

Ms. Ivey said she doesn’t understand why people would want to “mess around with temporary stuff” when the vaccine is the most long-lasting tool for wrangling the virus.

She said nearly all of the recent hospitalizations are among unvaccinated persons and deaths are “certainly” occurring among those who’ve balked at the shots.

“These folks are choosing a horrible lifestyle of self-inflicted pain. Y’all, we’ve got to get folks to take the shot. The vaccine is the greatest weapon we have to fight COVID, the data proves it,” Ms. Ivey said, noting she took the vaccine in December.

Underscoring her exasperation, she didn’t know what to tell a reporter who asked about the best way to get people off the sidelines.

“I don’t know, you tell me,” she said.

Ms. Ivey signed a bill in May that prohibits businesses and other institutions in Alabama from requiring “vaccine passports” that verify the immunization status of people as a condition for entry or services.

So just what were you implying here?
The covid vaccines received liability release under 2005 PERP Act that had to be enacted for this vaccine . Your statement implies it was covered under H.R.5546 - National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 signed by Reagan in 1988.

The liability issue is a valid issue for one to choose not to receive the jab.

It is pretty simple. The people that are claiming that their reason for not getting the vaccines due to the lack of liability is a valid reason, but it is not unique to the Covid vaccine. Don't act like something special was passed through congress to absolve liability for the Covid vaccine because it wasn't. These laws already existed and have been utilized in the past even under the PREP Act for EUA.

I have already stated it was a valid reason for someone to claim if that is what they are hanging their hat on. I don't have an issue with that which I made clear. Why is it so hard for you to understand? What I have also stated is that it isn't unique to the Covid vaccines and if the liability issue is a no go for someone then I asked the question is that what they apply to other vaccines also or not. A person's reasons are their own, but it should be made clear that there weren't any new legislation passed to absolve liability that already exists. It appears that many people didn't know that.

Everything is special the first time....so it is unique
Hence the first link I posted
We are witnessing the PREP Act in action for the first time nationwide since its passage in 2005.

No one really knows the extent of the law and how it will affect everyone in the United States, short term and long term. Most of the media has not even discussed the details of the PREP Act and how it will affect the general public.”

I’d just add that in addition to us not knowing the short and long term effects from the law, we should add the same questions about the vaccine

Yes, I stated that it was the first time it was used nationwide due to the spread of Covid nationwide as opposed to Ebola that was not. That should seem obvious to most.
You are parsing this down to a point that it becomes pointless. Every application of any existing law for the first time would be unique. My point that you keep trying to move away from is that there were no unique laws passed by congress for the Covid vaccines to absolve liability to the pharmaceutical companies.

I turned 70 in January and I'm diabetic. I had Covid-19 last year in November, my wife also. My mother which resides in a nursing home also contracted Covid-19. We all recovered without hospitalization and none of us have any lasting effects. My brother is 2 years younger and has asthma had Covid-19, he needed breathing treatments but no hospitalization and no lingering effects.


My mother took the vaccine. My wife and I will not and my brother did not

No it’s not pointless. You said originally that this vaccine was covered under The 1988 Act. It is not.

It is only covered under 2005 PERP ACT. There is a huge difference.

it was fast tracked w/o due diligence. So unless given protection status under PERP the pharmaceuticals would had been liable. And that’s because the drug isn’t vetted properly.

Very true, and thanks for posting this.

The sentiment I keep reading in this forum, and hearing from the TeeVee and real life people in the ER and on the streets is that 1) they know less actual science than a kid in 10th grade biology class knows, but 2) the minuscule knowledge they DO have makes them skeptics of the SARS-CoV2 vaccine. In other words, “I know almost nothing, but I think my judgment on this so solid.”

There has been ample information on how the Pfizer/Moderna mRNA vaccine works for at least the past 6 months, in scholarly articles for those who have the science background for it, and in various popular science press articles that explain it at a level anyone with a 9th grade education can understand. Yet people still spout nonsense that could have been dispelled by reading such articles at any time.

Rant off.




Well, we can’t say with 100% certainty what the long term effects of the CoV2 vaccines are gonna be in 2 or 5 or 10 years, cuz we ain’t there yet and prognosticating almost always makes a person look foolish when all the folks with perfect hindsight give bent to their spleen at a comfortable remove.

But that doesn’t tell the whole story.

MRNA vaccine technology was being rapidly developed in molecular biology labs at universities all over the world whe. I was still in grad school, back in the 1980’s. This isn’t “new” stuff. Once the basic biochemistry was worked out, the template for these vaccines was readily established, and virtually all mRNA vaccines today follow this same template. The beauty of this is that a vaccine for a new virus can be developed fairly quickly by plugging the genetic code for the new virus into the existing mRNA template. This is thousands, maybe millions of times faster and simpler than developing a vaccine by the old methods from the mid20th century.

The first mRNA vaccines were being tested in labs by the mid-90’s. They were trialed for veterinary use by the late 90’s, and some have been in use in veterinary applications for close to 20 years now. None of these vaccines have produced long-term problems in the populations they’re used in, and because all mRNA vaccines work by the same basic mechanism, and because human biology is very similar to bovine and murine and porcine biology, we can safely say that the CoV2 vaccine will be equally safe in the long term.

The other objection I keep hearing is that “these vaccines aren’t FDA approved”. This is true, they aren’t. But FDA approval is not a strong signifier of safety, and absence of FDA approval does not mean a treatment is unsafe. The FDA has approved a goodly number of drugs and treatments that ultimately proved to be disastrous. Thalidomide and diethylstilbestrol are two glaring examples of “FDA approved” drugs that caused horrible birth defects. Similarly, the FDA has still not approved Ivermectin or Fluvoxamine as effective treatments for COVID, despite a large body of evidence showing they are indeed very effective. You need to look at the FDA as basically the medical equivalent to the US Postal Service: they get some basic stuff right, but they’re slow, and they ain’t nowhere near cutting edge.



This is such elementary science, I am frankly embarrassed for people who think that an mRNA virus can alter human DNA. You couldn’t get a passing grade in 10th grade biology if you believed this nonsense. It’s equivalent to thinking that if you piss in the waters of the Mississippi in St Louis that you would contaminate the glaciers in Montana. It’s that stupid.

Look at it this way: the DNA, in the nucleus of a human cell, comprises the chromosomes that carry the human genetic code that makes us the species we are. Portions of the double-stranded DNA in the nucleus are copied in a simple single-strand “shorthand” form called RNA, and these copied RNA strands are the messengers that tell the rest of the cell what to do. RNA isn’t copied back into DNA form, this is a one-way railway track. Once the RNA message is delivered, the RNA is broken down into its components and the components are reused to make more RNA messages , over and over and over again.

The mRNA vaccines work by delivering a “fake” message to certain human cells that cause them to manufacture the CoV2 S-protein, which the cells of the immune system recognize as a foreign protein, and then makes antibodies to it. The vaccine does not interact with our DNA in any way whatsoever. It doesn’t even go into the nucleus (where DNA is located), but does all of its work in the outer parts of the cell in cytoplasmic structures called ribosomes. There is ZERO relationship between the vaccine mRNA and the human genetic code in your DNA. ZERO. It also (probably) interacts with the immune system ‘s T-cells, which incorporate the S-protein into the T-cell-mediated immun response, which is independent of antibodies and far longer-lasting.

After the “fake” mRNA message from the vaccine is used by the human cells for a while, the system plays out and the cells stop making S-protein, and the mRNA fragment is broken down into its components and is reused by the cells like any other piece of RNA. After a few days there are no traces of the vaccine mRNA left in the vaccinated person’s system.

I strongly suggest that folks who want to attack the science of the mRNA vaccines actually learn some science first. It won’t be easy, but with a couple days’ worth of reading textbooks, or heck, just watching decent YouTube videos on the topics of nuclei acid biology and protein synthesis, you’ll be informed enough to realize that 99% of the pseudo-scientific objections to the CoV2 vaccines are utter nonsense.

It may be a huge difference to you, but the results are the same and all vaccines are covered under the 1988 Act if they are fully approved. Which any of these would be if fully approved. I did use the 1988 Act comment prematurely without considering the EUA status and the PREP Act. I will admit that, but the fact remains the same that no new unique legislation was passed for the Covid vaccines as was being implied. It wasn't explicitly stated, but it was implied. All I was doing is pointing this out.

You also implied that the PREP act had not been used for a vaccine in the past under the EUA. It is true that it hasn't been used nationwide for the obvious reason because we haven't had a nationwide pandemic since the passage in 2005. I pointed out that it wasn't the only application of the PREP act for a vaccine (Ebola).

So your point that you are trying to make is that I applied the 1988 Act prematurely due to the EUA status of the Covid vaccines? Does that make you feel better that I acknowledge it was premature and that they are currently covered under the PREP act?

Thank you Doctor, but don't hold out much hope it will convince many.

Take the "Shot' folks or don't take it.,

😂😂😂

The number of US deaths that have been medically attributed to CoVID vaccines as of July 23, 2021, was THREE. Not 10,000, not 100, not 10: THREE.

Go peddle your B U L L S H I T somewhere else.

https://covid-101.org/science/how-many-people-have-died-from-the-vaccine-in-the-u-s/

Wabigoon, I don’t offer this information to convince the committed anti-vaxxers. Kooks like TheRealHawkeye and his misguided ilk are confirmed in their delusions past the point of any rationality. It’s an article of faith with them.

I offer this information for those who are troubled and confused by the plethora of flagrant falsehoods ( like the specious “death rate” number put up by MtnSnake just a few posts above this one) that cloud the waters, and who want some actual facts to settle their minds. I do this for folks like them. There are still a goodly number of these people who participate in this ridiculous sh i t show on these pages.

Sadly, our education system has been mired in its 1950’s era approach to science education, so almost the entire adult population of the US has less science education behind them than grade schoolers in most other developed countries. As such it is easy for anti-Vax charlatans to get an audience and sow seeds of myth and paranoia about any controversial science topic, whether it be global warming or SARS-CoV2.

Thanks Doc Rocket...I needed some 20/20 clarity in these days of dense fog.

Trust in the greater good. Your government would never lie to you…😂

Covid still has a survival rate of over 99%. It is a personal choice. Take it or don’t take it because it is up to you. But you can GFY if you think we don’t have the right to question this shot.

I am not anti vaccine but with this one I have way more questions than answers. Not one single person can say what the long term affects of this shot is going to be.

You summed up my reasons fir not taking the vaccine exactly
Plus I've already had Covid-19
Also I have 2 friends a husband and wife that both took the vaccine and both have Covid-19