|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,275
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,275 |
You're the Gold Medal Winner in the Pole Vaulting Mouse Turd's Olympic event...
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,114
Campfire Oracle
|
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 96,114 |
Life Member SCI Life Member DSC Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 2,137
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 2,137 |
Bob lives a life of invented superlatives.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,640
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,640 |
I used to come for the info - now I come for the entertainment.
WWP53D
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,542
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,542 |
I wonder what a 308 would be like in the new savage straight pull rifle
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,635
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,635 |
I used to come for the info - now I come for the entertainment. That's for sure
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,924
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,924 |
What's so moronic about a case with 56 grains of 4350 and a 180 grain bullet in it?
From a military perspective, the problem with the .30-06 is that the bore was too big and the case/OAL was too big. This was based on a combination of a mistaken belief in a need to stop cavalry charges and a mistaken belief that indirect fire from small arms was useful. The result was a cartridge that consumed at least 50% more resources than it should have to do a worse job than it could have. Interestingly both the Navy and the arsenal had clearly seen where things were going with the 6mm Navy and .276 Pedersen,. but the Army was stuck in the mud and got their way by sheer bull-headed stupidity. From a hunting perspective, there are several problems: - an inefficient shoulder and taper designed for machine gun use that increases recoil,. reduces velocity, and reduces case capacity - an overly-small diameter that gives unneeded magazine capacity in trade for loss of case capacity - an overly long case and overall length adding weight to both actions and barrels with no benefit - a low MAP caused by weak rifles and excessive taper Take that all together, and it's hard to imagine what a WORSE hunting cartridge of the same general case capacity and bore diameter would look like. I guess you could take a .30-06 and add an unnecessary belt and make it a little [bleep], but only a little. The .308 is a better hunting round - better shoulder, better taper, shortened, better MAP. The .308 AI is a step better, improving the shoulder further, and the .300 WSM better still - finally fixing the case diameter problem. After reading this I'm trading off my 30-06 immediately. The logic is irrefutable
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,759
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,759 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,032
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,032 |
You're the Gold Medal Winner in the Pole Vaulting Mouse Turd's Olympic event...
Nah, I think he came in 10th. In a field of nine. To listen to bob, the '06 is so inferior you can't kill anything with it. Yet he's enamored with the .308 AI, which (as someone already pointed out) Ackley himself said was a waste of time.
A wise man is frequently humbled.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,757
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,757 |
Wow! I never knew what a chitty cartridge the 30-06 is, probly just throw mine in the dump, seems thats about all its fit for 😁......Hb
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,924
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,924 |
Wow! I never knew what a chitty cartridge the 30-06 is, probly just throw mine in the dump, seems thats about all its fit for 😁......Hb Thats the conclusion I came to
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,845
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,845 |
I used to come for the info - now I come for the entertainment. That's for sure Agreed. An OP starts what appears to be a harmless thread extolling his opinion of the virtues of a specific cartridge and it turns into a "you suck" thread, as usual. I'll bet the OP looked at this recently, scratching his head, and thinking, "I just don't know what happened". To risk opening myself up to ridicule, it is definitely one of those which could be one's sole rifle.
_________________________________________________________________________ “Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,621
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,621 |
One of the best all-arounders. Respected everywhere & only questioned in the widest of wide open West…but with dials who even cares about that anymore.
Fine fine cartridge that simply does it’s job better than it is often expected, provided bullets are chosen appropriately of course. Plus those short little carbine rifles (Ruger 77 RL type) are the more modern version of handy & nimble like a M94 30-30 is and was.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,031
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,031 |
I used to come for the info - now I come for the entertainment. That's for sure Agreed. An OP starts what appears to be a harmless thread extolling his opinion of the virtues of a specific cartridge and it turns into a "you suck" thread, as usual. I'll bet the OP looked at this recently, scratching his head, and thinking, "I just don't know what happened". To risk opening myself up to ridicule, it is definitely one of those which could be one's sole rifle.Ones "sole" rifle cold be so many different cartridges. The 308 works fine, just as so many similar cartridges do. The 308 is like opinions and azzholes. Everyone has one..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,845
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,845 |
I used to come for the info - now I come for the entertainment. That's for sure Agreed. An OP starts what appears to be a harmless thread extolling his opinion of the virtues of a specific cartridge and it turns into a "you suck" thread, as usual. I'll bet the OP looked at this recently, scratching his head, and thinking, "I just don't know what happened". To risk opening myself up to ridicule, it is definitely one of those which could be one's sole rifle.Ones "sole" rifle cold be so many different cartridges. The 308 works fine, just as so many similar cartridges do. The 308 is like opinions and azzholes. Everyone has one.. Agreed on all counts.
_________________________________________________________________________ “Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,360
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 1,360 |
Having to mess around with a 308 AI and see no appreciable difference in ballistics over the standard is fool hardy. The 308 Win will always be useful in every way in the game field, the 30-06 will always be a bit more useful on the heaviest of game. Nothings going to change that. Going to an Ackley version in the 308 Win and saying it has the same ballistics as an 30-06 is hyperbole. The only non magnum short action .30 caliber that runs somewhat with the 30-06 is the 30-284. But just like all SA cartridges it will not achieve those goals in a 2.8-inch magazine when it comes to high BC .30 caliber length bullets seated deep. It is possible in a 3-inch magazine to achieve parallel ballistics with some bullet weights as the 30-06. If that was my desire I would never go AI as a wildcat when I could get 6.5-284 Norma Brass and utilize for the 30-284. It would achieve much more than an 308 AI with less pressure. I’ll just stick to the 308 Win, it simply lacks in nothing as a big game cartridge, same for the 30-06, which has proven itself over and over and is the benchmark of comparison for many hunters in the field.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,735
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,735 |
Carrying an M60 Pig and 2 boxes of 500rd belts ( short handed in '72-'73, no AG) up 4 flights of stairs to a post at a window ( 30 men in 30 minutes Guard drill) in Germany was my worst memory of the 308 (7.62). Shooting it at silhouettes at 1000yds was my "best" memory. NOT lugging it, shooting it in anger in Vietnam instead of Germany...priceless!
Last edited by Jim_Knight; 07/27/21.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,032
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,032 |
Going to an Ackley version in the 308 Win and saying it has the same ballistics as an 30-06 is hyperbole. LOL, hyperbole = bullshat??
A wise man is frequently humbled.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 28,760
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 28,760 |
Just ordered another one. Have so many components on hand it’ll take two rifles to use them all up before I go under.😛
What fresh Hell is this?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 563
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 563 |
or someone could have 3. one of many cartridges that can do pretty much anything.
If you're not having fun; you're not doing it right!
|
|
|
|
435 members (1Longbow, 10gaugemag, 007FJ, 160user, 17CalFan, 163bc, 46 invisible),
2,326
guests, and
1,257
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,191,627
Posts18,474,193
Members73,941
|
Most Online11,491 Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|