Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Newest M70's have one piece bolt and handle?

I read a thread in the Winchester Collectors forum

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...herweight-model-70-s-quality-quality-con

and some posters are saying that the Winchester M70's assembled in Portugal have one piece bolt/handle. This is quite a surprise to me. Can any of the M70 experts here confirm this? Redneck? RJ

I'm the poster that asserted that. The photos I posted very clearly show it is a one piece bolt. Pappy contacted Winchester and confirmed it. And I just called Winchester customer service/parts and confirmed that the Portugal guns have a one-piece bolt/handle.

I called and talked to a rep at BACO, and he confirmed that. “Just like the pre-64s” is what he said.

I have one on order. When it gets here, I’ll be an expert on that one.

Actually it shows the exact opposite. You can clearly see the cast bolt handle and collar where they meet the turned bolt body.

pappy, I saw your post where you called Winchester, but I still have a bit of doubt about what the guy you spoke said. I would like to see the number of M70 two piece bolt/handle's that actually failed compared to the number of M70's produced since 1964.As someone mentioned in the Win Collectors thread, I cannot imagine that Winchester would not jump all over the marketing opportunity to sell more rifles due to an enhancement that would for sure cost them considerable bucks to implement. If it is true, that's a good thing. Go Winchester! RJ

10 Glocks, I went back to your post on the Win Collectors forum and looked at the pic you posted of the Portugal bolt. To my eyes it sure looks like the handle and the bolt were made as 2 separate pieces. You can see the casting texture on the handle and the machined texture of the bolt where they are joined together. It looks damn fine assembly, but just like my S.C. gun's bolt. I am sure you already know this, but the Winchester bolt handle has a circular collar that is pressed over the rear splined end of the bolt body and it is brazed or silver soldered. The handle is not just tacked on the side like a Remington M700 bolt. The person you guys spoke to on the phone may have meant that the bolt was one piece in the sense that the bolt handle cannot be removed like you can with a Tikka or Savage. After looking at your picture, I'm still not convinced the bolt/handle is manufactured as one piece.. RJ

You could be right, and I could be wrong. But the bolt handle is clearly one piece with the portion of the bolt its attached to; they weren't two separate pieces brazed together, like the Remington 700. They are cast together. Now, it could be that there are two bolt sections brazed together, one piece with the handle on it. If that's the case, and I admit it could be, Winchester is doing a phenomenal job. I looked at all 4 bolts under a 90X jewelers glass and there is not the slightest hint of a gap/joint between pieces, or the 'overflow' of brazing material, which is visible on brazed joints on Remington 700s. They are perfectly mated together. As you know, the Remington 700 bolt is a three piece bolt. The head is brazed on, too. On all of my 700s, while there are no gaps between pieces, joints are evident. There is brazing material visible at the joints of the parts brazed together.

So, if I added to any misunderstanding, I apologize. I wanted to point out that the handle and the bolt are one piece (unlike the 700) but concede what I meant may not be what someone else meant by one piece. I think it's clear to anyone, though, that the design is very superior to the 700 design, and any fears that the bolt handle is somehow a weak link in the design is unfounded.

FWIW, when I talked to the guy at Winchester/BACO, I brought up the previous construction. He was pretty adamant about the new ones being one-piece. When I get my new one, I’ll try to puzzle it out. A true one-piece is preferable, but it’s not a deal-killer either way, just another raisin in my cookie. I have three 98s, a Ruger, and two Howas with one-piece bolts, so I can suffer one that’s not. In the unlikely event that I need to go into the vast Wild, I can take one of those, or get the M70 welded. All it takes is a small hole or slot where the two parts meet, then a weld, then dressing the connection.

Early Classics also had cheesy extractors you could bend into a horseshoe. A member of my club had a .458 from the Custom Shop and was headed to Africa, so he had that replaced. I read some time ago that those were now proper spring steel.

How many 98s, Springfields, and other converted military rifles have welded-on handles? How many Kimbers, Tikkas, CZ 527s, and other current models have handles attached to separate bolt bodies in various ways? Hell, even my sainted Fieldcraft has a separate handle, cleverly attached in a dovetail slot, then pinned. That pin keeps the handle in the slot, but bears none of the force.

Let’s all pray for an end to the Plague and hopefully its attendant excess of navel-gazing as well.😜

One can get a true one-piece replacement bolt for a 700 that also has a Sako-style extractor, and several choices of colors for the handle. You’ll still be stuck with the washer between the bar-stock receiver and barrel for a recoil lug and the various notoriously wonderful/terrible/suicidally-dangerous triggers though.😈

Well, if you ever read the various "sniper" sites, you would have thought the Remington 700 handles were falling off like dead ticks off a dog. I read one once from someone who wrote, "I seen five fall off today." But the complaints usually went like this, "I handloaded a .300 WM and the case got stuck in the chamber and I had to whack the bolt handle (that had an aftermarket knob welded on) with a 2x4 and it done broke off," followed by the chorus of peoples screaming "God damn Remington's quality." As far as I know, the military's a M24 sniper rifle didn't deviate from a brazed on handle and I have not see any indication they were problematic.

I think the concerns over brazed on parts is over blown. I think a lot of people tend to overstate the extent of problems, without providing the context in which the problem arose, followed by people who probably have no experience with the matter piling on.

Whether the current M70 is one piece or two pieces brazed together, don't know with 100% certainty. The man I talked to at Winchester did tell me, as well, that Winchester went back to a one piece bolt design. But who knows what that really means. What I do know is that if it is two section brazed together, they are doing a stellar job.

I will certainly agree with you guys that the assembled M70 bolt/handle unit is a superior design and it will certainly out last my old azz. I have one New Haven gun and one South Carolina gun and I am not worried about either coming apart on me.

No apology necessary 10Glocks, This has been a gentleman's discussion, sharing the way each of us see things. RJ

I used to belong to a hunt club in VA. Two members of that club had handles fall off of Remington 600s. It was sort of a running joke, actually.

Thanks. Civility is certainly conducive to learning and understanding.

Now, at the risk of blowing up some people's ability to load the page, here are some full res photos I just took of the bolt out of my .300 WM.

Edit: actually, they posted in much less than full res, but that's the best I can do.

Because the outer diameter of the bolt handle section appears to be somewhat smaller than the outer diameter of the bolt body, it very well could be pressed in, and probably is. I don't think anyone could disagree that the mating is exceptional. Not a gap or brazing material seen anywhere.

My 700 handles look glued on by comparison.

I'll try and take some photos of the bolt out of my Ruger M77 this weekend and post them for comparison.

I agree. Removing the cocking piece might give you better view, end-on, from the rear. The handle looks cast, again no big deal for this Ruger guy.

Is it an issue that it's one piece instead of two?

Only when the handle comes loose…..

True enough. Just like it is only an issue not having the flange on the bolt shroud on a New Haven gun, when you have a case rupture, as opposed to having the flange on the bolt shroud on a BACO gun. RJ