Teachers and “professors” and school administrators in the public school system think the parents ought to pay out the ass in property taxes and spend 750 billion dollars a year on it, and then take the blame for its dismal failure.
I think the issue here is you confuse teaching with lecturing. You expect to lay it out for them, then they make the effort to bridge the gap. That's not teaching. It's also nonsensical because the one holding the knowledge is the only one holding the materials with which the bridge can be made.
I provide the tools, quality tools. I lay out the materials, plenty of them. It's up to the student to do the assembly.
My kids are out of school, and now in particular I'm seeing alot of this woke stuff creep into our school that wasn't there just a few years ago. I'm thankful I don't have to be involved because there seems to be no shortage of social justice warriors moving into our little town , but I was at school board meetings and parent teacher conferences. I tried to find time for school events and recognition ceremonies when I wasn't traveling. I let my kids know what I expected and I'd have their back if they found themselves having to defend themselves over it. I'm happy to say there is a strong base of parents fighting back in our community over it. A principle was "re-assigned" after his twitter feeds came to light.
I had to meet with a school principle one time about a racial incident at school where a young urban lad and my son got in a fight and he claimed my son called him the "n-word". During her attempt to scold me in front of my son for how I raised him to be a bigot, he asked her what the n-word was. Conversation over, the young urban lad was a liar and I thanked her for taking sides without hearing the truth. I asked her if she was going to be so judgemental to the urban lad's parents for raising a liar as she was to the white racist parent. She never had much to say to me after that, but my son never dealt with that kid again.
I am a firm believer in like minded parents showing up and letting the school know what is important to them. You have to do that, especially now.
My wife is a special needs teacher. She has a job solely because parents of children who cannot function at a high school level, in many cases cannot communicate at all, demand that their children be integrated into a regular school She babysits kids all day who would be better off at a specialized school. And those school resources could be going to help the majority of students instead of the very few. I guess that is the downside of having parent heavily involved in school decisions.
Last edited by KFWA; 09/13/21.
have you paid your dues, can you moan the blues, can you bend them guitar strings
I think the issue here is you confuse teaching with lecturing. You expect to lay it out for them, then they make the effort to bridge the gap. That's not teaching. It's also nonsensical because the one holding the knowledge is the only one holding the materials with which the bridge can be made.
I provide the tools, quality tools. I lay out the materials, plenty of them. It's up to the student to do the assembly.
Bullshit. Math requires a bit of wrestling with to master.
To be plain, I don't mean make it harder than necessary, be less than clear in explanations and demonstrations or whatever. However, math isn't just a collection of facts and formulas to be remembered and demonstrated examples to be regurgitated. The student must come to understand the principles involved and their application to problems which are not just like the ones shown in class. For many if not most students this understanding comes only after a good bit of work on their part.
I earned a PhD in mathematics and I can assure you as the level of study rises so does the outside of class effort expected of the student. Most people haven't encountered five problem homework sets that eat up the best part of two weeks to complete.
I think the issue here is you confuse teaching with lecturing. You expect to lay it out for them, then they make the effort to bridge the gap. That's not teaching. It's also nonsensical because the one holding the knowledge is the only one holding the materials with which the bridge can be made.
I always thought the problem with professors not teaching, especially in upper level courses, is they usually only understood the material well enough to use it. (Think of whatever is the math equivalent of physical chemistry.) To teach you have to understand it so well as to explain it to a six year old well enough they have at least a vague understanding. That holds with what you say. When you're at the cutting edge, you just got there yourself. And then there's the need to understand people well enough to guess where they are, too, in order to bring them to understanding. It's a special skill set few have.
Not to hijack this little tete-a-tete, but to analogize this to sports: I found in coaching youth baseball that I could explain and show things to the players that would have greatly improved their game. But, I never was able to coach the desire to excel into them. They either had it or they didn't. Talent made a difference, but talent without desire only took them so far. I suspect it is similar in the classroom and that many if not most kids simply don't have the desire to learn; it isn't part of their upbringing at home, and they attach no importance to it. Carry on.
The biggest problem our country has is not systemic racism, it's systemic stupidity.
Bullshit. Math requires a bit of wrestling with to master.
To be plain, I don't mean make it harder than necessary, be less than clear in explanations and demonstrations or whatever. However, math isn't just a collection of facts and formulas to be remembered and demonstrated examples to be regurgitated. The student must come to understand the principles involved and their application to problems which are not just like the ones shown in class. For many if not most students this understanding comes only after a good bit of work on their part.
I earned a PhD in mathematics and I can assure you as the level of study rises so does the outside of class effort expected of the student. Most people haven't encountered five problem homework sets that eat up the best part of two weeks to complete.
I think the issue here is you confuse teaching with lecturing. You expect to lay it out for them, then they make the effort to bridge the gap. That's not teaching. It's also nonsensical because the one holding the knowledge is the only one holding the materials with which the bridge can be made.
I always thought the problem with professors not teaching, especially in upper level courses, is they usually only understood the material well enough to use it. (Think of whatever is the math equivalent of physical chemistry.) To teach you have to understand it so well as to explain it to a six year old well enough they have at least a vague understanding. That holds with what you say. When you're at the cutting edge, you just got there yourself. And then there's the need to understand people well enough to guess where they are, too, in order to bring them to understanding. It's a special skill set few have.
Not to hijack this little tete-a-tete, but to analogize this to sports: I found in coaching youth baseball that I could explain and show things to the players that would have greatly improved their game. But, I never was able to coach the desire to excel into them. They either had it or they didn't. Talent made a difference, but talent without desire only took them so far. I suspect it is similar in the classroom and that many if not most kids simply don't have the desire to learn; it isn't part of their upbringing at home, and they attach no importance to it. Carry on.
I stink at coaching compared to the better ones my kids have had. Those fellas have the knack for inspiration.
You touched on a big problem with government school. They browbeat the try out of them because precociousness in children makes them work too hard. How to handle them is not taught in college. You must have and develop teaching skills to handle them.
I think modern entertainment like video games are part of it. Kids grow up operating within a strict framework. So they expect to be limited with no reward for trying anything novel. I purposely set my kids up to get bored. Boredom and time with out structure is essential in their development. Government school takes too much time and leaves too little time for personal development. This is a huge difference in our generation and later generations.
Living in a world of G17s and 700s, wishing for P7s and 202s
We homeschooled and not having the distraction of other "students" who disrupted the learning process made lessons go much more quickly. As you correctly observe, this left time for them to explore their own interests. For many of our homeschooling years, the internet was not part of our lives; when it was, the connection was so slow that gaming was not feasible. All good as far as I'm concerned. The public school system has become corrupt beyond redemption. Sports and the extra cost of private/homeschool options are the only things keeping it viable.
The biggest problem our country has is not systemic racism, it's systemic stupidity.
Rare is the parent who can recognize and/or accept that his/her child is not putting in the necessary effort to learn. It is so much easier to blame the school/teachers.
Not a real member - just an ordinary guy who appreciates being able to hang around and say something once in awhile.
Happily Trapped In the Past (Thanks, Joe)
Not only a less than minimally educated person, but stupid and out of touch as well.
Rare is the parent who can recognize and/or accept that his/her child is not putting in the necessary effort to learn. It is so much easier to blame the school/teachers.
When we had a child in government school we had to teach her in the evenings because it was not happening at school. The school was more focused on getting and spending. The last year they didn't give textbooks. They expected them to use laptops and smartphones. To get time with a textbook a kid had to stay after school.
My high school calculus teacher blamed teachers who got degrees but never learned to teach. She used textbooks and a chalkboard. None of this expecting gadgets and media to do the job. She was usually teacher of the year.
There are plenty of kids who don't get the necessary parenting. Often it's because parents have to work to much to pay for a life plus high taxes. Some are indeed just animals, but that does not answer as to why the schools are failing overall for all students. It's mostly a government school system not focused on teaching
Living in a world of G17s and 700s, wishing for P7s and 202s
The public school system has become corrupt beyond redemption.
Yep. It’s a monopoly that has no incentive to be effective, efficient, accountable, or to improve because it’s all funded by taxes that parents and others pay out the ass.
Typical...the government pretty much ruins everything it touches.
I’ve currently got one in middle school and one in high school. Both get good grades and are pretty much enjoying the experience. That said, their two respective schools are a real mess. Particularly the high school. Both are very disorganized, and we see a lot of complacency with the teachers. There seems to be a significant lack of professionalism and a lack of accountability among the teachers. Elementary school was just the opposite. Some of the high school teachers just don’t give a crap.
Rare is the parent who can recognize and/or accept that his/her child is not putting in the necessary effort to learn. It is so much easier to blame the school/teachers.
A lad I knew in Florida [Senior HS] came home with paper in hand saying that he was reading on a 3rd grade level , his Mom said ''don't pay any attention to them - people will always try and put you down'' then she turned back to her google search Cocktail Recipes . <<---TRUTH LOL ,, many Parents don't give a ratzass how their kids do in school .
PRESIDENT TRUMP 2024/2028 !!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Bristoe The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
The #1 obstacle for public schools is the requirement that they "attempt" to educate every student. That then requires schools to mix those that are brighter with those that aren't, those that want to learn with those that don't. Quickly, it becomes a game of teaching to the lowest common denominator. When race comes into play, and you look at percentages of those who don't want to learn and those who disrupt class, and those that aren't capable of high performance and it becomes a racial bias thing.
The OP's link is a good read on just this.
I am yet to figure out how mathematics can be racist? Maybe it is. If it is, it seems biased toward Asian students around here. This has also lead to a GPA scale that is greater than a 4.0 scale. What was once considered normal college prep work is considered "advanced placement. Since the watered down lowest common denominator work has gread inflation, we needed to develop a new scale.
They don't work with composition, so the kids can't write a coherent paragraph. They cannot use transitions words and phrases, and have a painfully limited vocabulary. When in doubt, they use "phouc, phoucing, phoucer, or simply "mother phoucing phoucer" when at a loss for something else. The magical world of Twitter - say it in less than 280 characters.
"The Democrat Party looks like Titanic survivors. Partying and celebrating one moment, and huddled in lifeboats freezing the next". Hatari 2017
"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid." Han Solo
All they'd have to do is throw in some useful examples and many students would get it a lot faster
Yes! Had high school acquaintances that near failed everything. If they wanted to know how much force it took to push an outside mirror through a quarter mile, however, they'd figure it out.
Similarly I had a college stat prof that would dictate a table of numbers for analyses and then ask several students what their major might be. To the ag student they were calf weights. To a wildlife major they were fish lengths. Foresters it was timber yield etc. Only prof that got a standing ovation from the class at the end of his final lecture.
Sadly, the college promoted him into administration. Should have paid him bigger bucks and left him in teaching.
I certainly agree about presenting useful examples in math class when appropriate and if they can be done properly without diverting too much time/effort from the main thread of the course. Sometimes we may be limited to foreshadowing since many of the prime uses of certain parts of mathematics need the math reasonably well developed before meaningful examples can be discussed in any depth.
. <<---TRUTH LOL ,, many Parents don't give a ratzass how their kids do in school .
