Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters New Guide Gun

Well a new job opportunity has arisen for me and I'll be going to the other coast in may to guide black bear in BC's spring season, and moose, caribou, and mulies in the fall season. I've harvested many moose, black bear and whitetails here in NS. Living on the east coast my entire life we don't have mean critters that may want to eat you. I've hunted Africa, I'm familiar their dangerous game. the 9.3x62 is my favourite moose cartridge, and have shot bear with 243 to the 9.3. So if you were to start guiding in grizzly territory, what gun/cartridge would you choose and why? I'm leaning hard on buying a new 9.3, in a sako. Or find a Marlin JM .45/70 guide gun.

Once you've been amongst them, there's no such thing as "too much gun"

I'd build a .358 Norma on a M-70 action.....keeping the weight low and fit it with a 20 inch barrel to facilitate easy movement in dense cover. Since I believe the bullet you choose is more important than the cartridge, the .35 whelen will also work for you. IMO.

How about a 50 B&M Super Short.

https://m.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/50-B-M-Super-Short.html#&ui-state=dialog



https://m.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/50-B-M-Super-Short.html

In Canada there are a great many more Husqvarna rifles available. I nice Husqvarna on the small ring action in 9.3x62 would be about as good as it gets.

I've been running one for quite a few years now! Balance is perfection to me. My only grievances are the safety sticks sometimes and I've had it apart dozens of times trying to figure out why it does that and its not as accurate as I'd like it to be.

Well I have never guided hunters or hunted bears, black or grizzly, but when has that stopped people on this forum from posting on a subject.

I have a 45-70 Guide Gun Stainless SBL, a stainless Win Model 70 375 H&H, a stainless Win Model 70 35 Whelen and a Weatherby Ultralight Stainless 338-06 but with all of that I have always thought if I had to be around grizzles much I would want a stainless control round feed rifle in 9.3X62 with a dropped box magazine that would allow 5 or 6 cartridges down. The rifle would have a 21" or 22" barrel with a single blade express sight and a synthetic stock.

I've never hunted grizzlies or brown bears but I did spend a fair amount of time amongst them on two DIY moose/caribou hunts in Alaska. Both times I carried a 30-06 AI, first time with a 180g X Bullet and second time with a 200g Partition. I killed moose, caribou and elk with both bullets. I built that rifle specifically because I knew their were lots of Brownies where we were going and the bears didn't disappoint.

So I would vote for a 06 with the 200g Partition.

Find a Ruger M77 stainless with the "boat paddle" stock 338 mag or one chambered 270/30-06 and have it rebarreled for the 9.3.

.45-70.

405, 420gn hardcast WFN GC. 1500-1600fps.

380gn WFN copper solid `1700-1800fps.


12ga.

Brenneke Black Magic 600gn.

Congratulations on the new job. Sounds like a great new adventure. I’m not a guide or a gun writer, but it seems that a western guide would want a gun with 300 yard reach to stop wounded game. That would kind of rule out the 45-70. I’d think a rugged, fairly short bolt gun would be in order. Maybe one chambered in a cartridge that had some punch and was easily available in stores. A Ruger Guide Gun comes to mind. I’d probably end up with a bunch of niche guns and change constantly. But then, my guns are more like toys than work tools. Best of luck to you.

Edited to add: I see you mention the Sako. They look good to me but I’ve read about ejection issues with long action Sako 85’s. Is this a real thing? If so, it seems a shame.

I am not a gun writer, guide, nor a bear hunter. But, I do usually spend 3-4 weeks in the bush each year hunting moose. I am not overrun with grizzlies, but often catch them on the trail cam within a few hundred yards of camp. My tent is unheated and normally there is ample daily rainfall.
I would want a bolt action stainless rifle with a synthetic stock for easy of maintenance. I prefer a control round feed rifle. Prowling around through the alders, deadfalls, tall grass, and tangles, I like a 20-22” barrel. Bumping into pissed off grizzly / brown bear in that environment, I would personally prefer a .375 as a minimum, using a premium bullet.
My ideal for such would be a 416 Ruger with 350 grain TSX, 20” barrel. I find it maneuverable and controllable. This is maybe my favorite rifle for 200 meters and under. My second choice would be the same rifle in 375 Ruger with 270 TSX. My 3rd choice would be a 338 Winchester with a premium 225-250 grain bullet.
If I were hunting more open country the 338 Winchester might become 1st choice.
I like lever rifles, but prefer the simplicity of the bolt action. One or two day walk-abouts, I at times carry a stainless Marlin with a 20” barrel, currently with 420, 430, or 460 hard cast.
Best of luck on the new job and relocation.

I don't guide, but I hunt alot amongst brown bears. I'd go with the 9.3x62. I've killed brown bears, mountain goats, and a bunch of deer with mine. I used the .375 for years before I got the 9.3, have used the 9.3 for 8 years now, and cannot detect a performance difference between the two between 300 and 286gr bullets respectively. With the 9.3 you get a lighter rifle that holds more rounds. The 9.3 gives you way more versatility over a .45-70 in regards to trajectory, its an honest 300 yard gun with 286s or a 400 yard gun with 250s. If you want the ultimate in versatility, get a rifle equipped with Talley or Alaska Arms QD mounts and set up your gun to use different scopes for different loads, and a peep.

I really like lever actions, but the only way I'd consider the .45-70 is if I never hunted a place that offered a shot over 100 yards. Even then.......see above.

Since the OP is *guiding*, he is (could be, may be, perhaps) unlikely to make a 300 yard shot to back up his client.

The 45-70 is very reliable out to ~125 meters or more with certain loads.

I have never hunted Grizzly, but I did stay at a Motel 6 once. I have been intrigued by the 9.3x62 for awhile and Barsness has shown it isn't just a short range option depending on load. I would think 286g bullet would get a bears attention though.

I also drank JB’s 9.3 kool-aid. First I tried a Ruger Hawkeye African and it kicked like a sumbich. That one’s gone but, being a slow learner, I couldn’t resist a CZ 550 that crossed my path. The jury is still out on that one, but it seems much easier on my shoulder.

The bad news on CZ 550 Magnums is that they are heavy. But the weight is also good news in that it reduces recoil. My CZ .375 H&H is comfortable to shoot, but weighs over 10 lbs ready to hunt. It's also very accurate.

[quote][
The bad news on CZ 550 Magnums is that they are heavy. But the weight is also good news in that it reduces recoil. My CZ .375 H&H is comfortable to shoot, but weighs over 10 lbs ready to hunt. It's also very accurate. /quote]

while I agree with this totally, it's still a fact that the gun's weight is a Burdon to the hunter all the time he's hunting.....however the recoil reduction of the heavier gun only lasts for a few seconds.

I have hunted deer with a .375 H&H on a few occasions and can say that the recoil didn't bother me at all when actually shooting at game. It's at the bench sighting it in that hurts and I simply put a sandbag between me and the gun.....yes, it can be done.

If you are a younger fellah with plenty of strength and energy, this may not apply to you.....but as we get older the gun's weight becomes increasingly burdensome.

My (very dubious) qualifications for responding to the OP are that I have seen grizzly bears at a very safe distance and that I've carried a Marlin Guide Gun and killed a lot of deer with it. I think that rifle, with a 1 - 4 Leupold
Shotgun/Muzzle Loader scope (coarse crosswires and parallax adjusted for 75 yards,) is about the handiest long gun that can be carried for days on end in the woods. In a lot of terrain, it is short enough to be carried one-handed, muzzle down without hitting the ground (at least by a man of normal stature.) This option can go a long way toward mitigating fatigue when a rifle has to be carried for hours a day, days on end. I shoot Speer, 400 grain, flat-nosed soft points over fifty some-odd grains of Varget. It is a load that will take all the fun out of an extended session of plinking tin cans in the back yard, but on the other hand, does a lot of damage to whatever it hits. It is also a simple matter to locate the point on the magnification ring that will put the POI at the top of the point of the coarse lower section of the vertical duplex crosswire at 200 yards. I would not hesitate to use such a rifle as a back-up for grizzly hunters (but again, refer to my qualifications to advise others on that matter.) I would look for a good JM and, if a later one with the crossbolt safety, disable that abomnation.

The 9.3 will certainly work but the GG w/ XS ghost ring sight is a pleasure to carry all day. Add a Wild West follower, extractor and trigger and you have a pretty good bear country rifle.


mike r

I have been using a custom Mod. 70 "Stainless Classic" .338 Winny and a Pre-64 Mod. 70 Featherweight 30-06 for many years, loaded with heavy Nosler Partitions. In the late 80's I switched to the Barnes X bullets and now use the 225 grain TTSX in the .338 and the 168 grain TTSX in the 30-06 and would be ok with either load and rifle for use on all Alaskan game.

We also use a 338-06 and several friends use a .35 Whelen and 225 grain Accubond bullets and do well with that set up. One of my friends has a stainless Ruger with a laminated stock in .35 Whelen. It holds four or five down and has good iron sights and is pretty much ready to go as is.

My first choice would be a Mod. 70 Featherweight "Stainless Classic" action from the early 90's that was chambered for the 30-06. I would have Jess of Oregon re-bore it to the .35 Whelen and run heavy Barnes X or Nosler Partitions. Both have plenty of the right stuff for any bear.

Very hard to beat the old style Mod. 70 trigger that can be adjusted to a crisp 2.5-3 lb. pull and the 3 position safety allowing the bolt to be field stripped with out tools.

Don't forget to put a Bansners synthetic on it and a crisp 2.5 to 3 lb. trigger and a Brockman's Mod. 70 Talley rear base converted to a peep sight along with a New England Custom Guns barrel band front sight with XS white line flat top post front blade.

The Mod. 70 has a pressed on bolt sleeve, not a strong forged one piece bolt like the older ones. So ours have been welded by a gun smith to prevent breaking or having the pressed sleeve come loose. I also prefer the one piece Obendorf style bottom metal.