Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Rethinking My "Big Gun"

Teeder,

For years I was a 30-06 guy. Hunted everything with a lightish M7o and stiff loaded 168 TSXs. Mostly elk & mule deer.

3-4 years ago I got my first 6.5CM and that’s all I’ve been carrying since. I’ve taken moose, elk and mule deer with it, and been completely satisfied with its performance. In fact, it’s terminal performance has been completely indistinguishable from my 30-06. My kiddo has been hunting with a 7-08 for awhile now. I’d gladly hunt anything in NA with a good 7-08 or 6.5CM/SM.

In your shoes, I’d probably look to add a little temporary weight to your Montana 7-08, or get a new midweight rifle. Good luck!

7-08, 7x57, 280, 270 Winchester, 6.5 Swede, 260, 6.5 cm, 264 win mag (been shooting one and the recoil I think is minimal) maybe the 308 if we are keeping Bullets in the 165gr range.

I am 72 and may not have many years of hunting left but it is going to get done using a 308 loaded with my own 130 TTSX loads. I have hunted and killed a bunch of deer, several elk, two black bear and one moose with everything from a 243 to a 338 WM. I have used and owned dozens of guns. I am now down to two, a 308 and a 6.5CM and I'm getting ready to let go of the 6.5CM. YMMV.

Thanks guys. That's what I'm looking for.

Monolithics of 130 and 150 grains, and "controlled expansion" lead-core bullets of 165-180 grains--and even some cup-and-core 180s.

Among the other great virtues of the .308 (as with the 7mm-08 and 7x57) is how consistently even relatively "soft" cup-and-core bullets expand and penetrate at moderate muzzle velocities. In Africa, for instance, bullets cost a LOT more than they do here, and the hunters who cull big game for meat understand this principle very well. Which is why one of the biggest sporting goods stores I've visited in South Africa has a lot of green boxes of bullets (Sierras) for sale.

But the African PH I hunted with most and know best also culled around 500 Cape Buffalo with the .30-06 and 180-grain Nosler Partitions. This was NOT done with head-shots at night, but during daylight when herds of buffalo were driven past him by ranch workers. He never had a problem even with big bulls.

But hunters who still believe Elmer Keith knew everything about big game cartridges and calibers apparently never grasp any of this.

My large one has been the 35 Whelen with 200 grain or 250 grain bullets,whatever is called for.

Every thing else gets the 7x57 or the 270,just depends on how i feel that day.

Teeter,
I was trying to be helpful. The cartridges with least recoil in a 7 pound rifle that are reliable are 6.5 CM (260 etc) or a 25-06. The smaller 6.5’s run around 2700 but the 25-06 will do 3000+ with 100-115 bullets. In both instances be judicious about bullet selection.

Increasing the bullet weight or velocity will get you back where you don’t want to be.

John;
Good evening to you sir, I hope this finds you and Eileen well.

I'm glad that you mentioned the Cape Buffalo being taken with an '06 as it assures me that the one instance I was witness to wasn't a fluke.

I want to say I've shared this here in the past and have no concept of whether or not Kenya had a cartridge or bore restriction in 1975 or not, but it was there that I was beside a young lady who dropped what was said to be a decent sized bull with a single shot - RWS factory ammo, no clue what weight or construction.

She did shoot it again as instructed when we approached it, but it was dead and didn't twitch on taking the second hit.

Sorry I can't be absolutely sure where the bull was hit, but likely a spinal hit as it did drop when hit.

She also used the same combination to take what we were told was a good sized zebra stallion too.

My late father started hunting Saskatchewan moose with a .303, then graduated to a .250 and finally used a .308.

We grew up eating a fair bit of moose meat John, so they must have worked, you know?

All the best to you and Eileen with your remaining hunts.

Dwayne

Thanks for the information. I've heard that a lot of Cape Buffalo and other dangerous game in Africa have been taken with a .308, probably because lots of military .308 rifles and ammunition have been available there. As you mention, it was apparently not uncommon for them to be used in culling. And I imagine that a fair amount of that was done with FMJ military ammunition because of availability.

There's no doubt that relatively small bore rifles can be effective on very large game, as we know from accounts going back to WDM Bell, although the margin for error is probably considerably less than with larger cartridges.

With proper shot placement I would agree larger bores give more bang to the buck, pun intended.

A page back, my advice as well.

I've elk hunted with all the big stuff including the 30-06, 300 WSM and 338 WM (I also had a 338-06), but like you, I've gone to the 6.5 CM (built in a lightweight and midweight). I've also stayed with my favorite 308 (also a lightweight and midweight). The reason for four is these will go to my two kids when I'm done hunting. I have no need for anything else, and if it were just for me alone, I could be happy with either pairing (6.5 CM or 308 Win) and nothing more for whatever else I do in the future. Loonies love "batteries" but I think what makes the most practical sense are two rifles, of different build quality/weights, in the same cartridge.

Also, how the 7-08 is a "small" cartridge is a bit of a mystery to me. It's the modern equivalent of the 7x57, and it's beyond intelligent dispute the 7x57 is more than enough for the vast majority of game in the vast majority of locations.

I've posted this before, but my last 7-08 kill also happened to be the fastest one-shot kill I've ever seen on any elk. He went down so quickly he gored himself with his 6th point on the starboard side:

I’ve heard of a blank stare, now I’ve seen one!

There's not much going on behind the headlights

I've read that large bullet diameter is better for Africa. You want a larger blood trail if an animal runs off. The dusty African plains can quickly cover up a blood trail. Also meat can spoil quickly. Thus the larger bullet diameters needed, especially on dangerous game. W.D.M. Bell killed a lot of Elephants with 7mm Mauser by shooting FMJ bullets in the head. However a larger bullet is/was considered needed for lung/heart shots for blood trails.

Dixie Dude,

No, not really. A .30 caliber bullet that exits normally provides a sufficient blood trail.

I had to follow up only one animal in Africa, a kudu I shot at 400 yards that was trotting. I hit him a little further back than ideal. I probably should not have shot but the PH was adamant so I did. Kudu covered 120 Yards. I found him right away but let the PH and tracker sort out the blood. About 10 minutes later they stumbled into me. 150 grain Partition was plenty of blood letting.

I say load some 120 TTSX's up in the 7-08, go forth and fill arks.

I killed a heavy cow a couple of years ago with a 120 ballistic tip from a 7-08. She took a couple of steps so I gave her another, but when I cut her up I found the second one clearly wasn't necessary.



If a 7-08 with 120's is too hard on your neck/head, I'd recommend you step down below a 6.5 Creed. A 243 or 6 Creed will work too with many 6mm bullets, despite what some people here say.

Most of the folks who ranch in our part of the world killed their first elk with a 243 or 6 Remington, and a lot of those guys are still using those same rounds every year with great success.

I don't have the experience with larger big game that some do. 1 cow elk, a dfew black bears, and mostly deer and antelope.

Wanna say that I don't think I've ever done too much with a rifle that I couldn't have done with a .243. And that's going back before the advent of the non-lead monolithic bullets.
If I was the OP, I'd figure which rifle I enjoy shooting and experiment with good bullet choices til I was happy using it for everything

For my money, happiness with rifles is easy to find in .24, .25, and .26.
Rifles in .27 and .28 probably belong in that group, too, but I don't have the depth of experience with them to decide

I have an artificial right shoulder and neck arthritis. It's as much the rifle, as it is the cartridge, but my happy place is a Winchester Classic Featherweight barreled to 25-06

And I'll admit that this rifle struggles for accuracy with heavier weight bullets. Still, with the Hornady 120 hp, I can keep all my shots in a 6" circle at 200 yards from field positions.
I'd be really surprised if I wasn't at the top of the food chain anywhere I"m gonna go

Cartridge? If I missed it, sorry......