Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Killing power - where do you see the difference?

+1 on this. I have noticed more DRT shots on deer with the more potent stuff, but I hate stiff recoil, so I'm still a lot more likely to use a milder cartridge whenever possible. If DRT isn't a problem with nearby property lines, I'd take a 30-30 class cartridge every time over an '06 class. I've actually sold off all my stuff bigger than 300 Savage.

I'm not shooting anything huge or dangerous, or at particularly long distances, so I don't feel the need to punish myself much more than necessary to get the job done.

350 Rem Mag. It does thump but it illustrates Taylor's KO factor.

I knew somebody would bring up Taylor and his KO. The truth is that he NEVER meant it to apply to expanding bullets, or even smaller cartridges.

He wrote about it in his first book, BIG GAME AND BIG GAME RIFLES, explaining that it specifically applied to "solid" (non-expanding) bullets on "heavy, thick-skinned" big game--primarily concerning how long a certain cartridge/bullet would "knock out" an elephant, if the bullet only passed near the brain, instead of going through the brain.

In his second book, published the same year by a fluke of scheduling, he basically provides the same formula and information--but NEVER mentions that it only applies to solid bullets, and why. Thus generations of hunters have quoted the KO factor of their favorite cartridge, while the formula was never meant to apply to expanding bullets and smaller cartridges.

Another factor in the whole deal is that a lot of other African professional hunters think the formula is BS, even today.

John, if I lived out “there”, I’d think the 9.3 excellent for your top-end uses. While age brings some more clear-eyed reality as to the wisdom of shrinking the safe contents, loonyism doesn’t just go away.

Shotguns have found their way into my safe too. Even a rifle or two. I’ve taken the view, for now, as it applies to divesting of firearms, that one step back, for every two forward, is at least moving ahead. 😉

I’ve seen some rather poor placements on Deer put them on the ground dead rather quickly. One took out the liver, one the big artery in the hind leg and another emptied out most of the stomach.

The artery shot was mine on what looked like a quartering runner…but when the bullet arrived it wasn’t.

Scandinavian ancestry?

Some prefer 22 short behind the ear of a moose while swimming.

I rarely see a DRT with .30-30 or .30-06 unless high shoulder/spine/head shot. Lungs I fully expect the usual 30 - 60 yd. death run whether I shot them with my .223, .243, 6.5 Creed., .30-30, .308 or .30-06.

With the exception of 2, all the deer I plugged with a .270 Win were DRT with boiler room shots. Distances were generally pretty short, between 40-125 yards.

One was a drt on an accidental neck shot, and the other one just stood there looking around like nothing happened, then walked maybe 10-15 yards before keeling over from a boiler room placement.

I've been shotgun hunting the past 16 seasons, though, and aside from 1 I hit high, they're always runners with foster slugs or sabots. Everything I popped with a 44 Mag or 30/30 before ran a bit, too.

I see mostly DRT's with my 30-06 and 150 grain bullets and I'm either middle of shoulder or just behind it.

Might be a difference in the bullets I've used. Mostly 180 gr. round nose core lokts and 165 gr. Win. power points. Last few 150 grain fusions. None lung shot with any of those dropped in their tracks. If I switched to something like a 150 ballistic tip or SST I know I might see more dramatic effect but I like penetration and exit wounds. I did get one instant drop from a lung shot with a 150 gr. .30-30 years ago but it was out of the norm. I've learned that shot placement, high shoulder/spine/head is the only thing to depend on for instant drops regardless of the cartridge in the chamber.

Killing power is a difficult to define thing. I know velocity makes a difference on lung shot deer. For example, in dozens of kills a 300wby shooting non-premium 165 or 180g bullet centered in the lungs offers far more DRT kills than the same bullets out of a 30-06 at similar ranges. 400+fps seems to do that. Similarly, I’ve noticed a tendency for larger frontal area bullets at good velocity do the same. For example, a 35Whelen shooting 225g SGKs has more DRT kills than a 30-06 shooting similarly constructed 180s at similar velocities.

In addition to preferring DRT, I prefer a combination that visually rocks an animal on impact. This is particularly important for elk as all to frequently, they show no indication of being hit when shot at ranges I typically hunt at. I’ve never had an elk not visually rocked with a 340wby shooting 210 NPs at 3250fps. Close to the same experience with a 338 shooting the same bullets at 3000fps. Is a 340 or 338 necessary for elk? Of course not. The 300 mags have more than enough killing power. In fact, shooting non-premium bullets, I think they may put an elk on the ground a second or two quicker on average. Does that mean they have more killing power? No, it just means at longer range they expand more violently than 210 PTs. Would I want to use 165 or 180 g soft points at ranges measured in feet at 300wby velocity ? Absolutely not….I’ve seen first hand how non-premium bullets can fail when striking large bones.

It all depends on the combination of the size and tenacity of the game, velocity, range, bullet diameter and bullet construction. Of course, shot placement matters most of all. A 22LR in the brain will kill anything in North America at the right range.

If an animal is shot in a vital area and the bullet disrupts enough tissue and gives adequate penetration the animal will die. There is no difference in killing power. The length of time after the shot may differ but if the animal dies the difference does not exist.

So an animal that runs a half mile and one that drops dead on the spot is the same result?

dead's dead......

That’s “killing power.”

Dead may be deadbut that doesn't always matter to a Pennsylvania hunter. Here if you're animal expires on the neighboring property the landowner does not have to give you access to get your animal.

Then the shot should be placed where it will drop the animal. This has far less to do with "caliber" or "cartridge" than shot placement. I have seen deer-sized animals go 60-100 yards before dropping with typical behind-the-shoulder lung shots from cartridges up to and including the .375 H&H.

Same here. If your game crosses a property line around here, you probably aren't getting it, because the odds of getting permission to retrieve it are slim to none. People are tighter than a mouse's butthole on property access round here anymore.

Same around here