Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Rimfires not helpful

I'm getting all kinds of non-helpful results from searches - so I'll ask a few questions here.
Son got a BSA Martini 22 LR target rifle for Christmas. I've been told to use only standard velocity, non-plated ammo in this rifle. True or not?
Same question applies to my Mossberg 44US.
Also concerning the Mossberg - everything I can find points to a plastic triggerguard - mines wood. Is it original, or replacement?
Where do I find the year of manufacture for these 2 guns?

Thanks for the help, folks!

mossberg should have a plastic trigger guard, never seen a 44 with a wood trigger guard. I mostly shoot lead out of my 44, 144 and I have shot plated, not sure about the BSA can't help you out there

Since the plating is pretty much just a wash, not a jacket, and all LR ammo is lubed with either some sort of grease or wax, I don’t know what the harm would be. I’d stick with SV or SS, but for pleasant shooting and accuracy. Have no idea if either of those is limited to SV pressure, but I suppose it’s possible.

Pugs or gnoahhh would be good ones to ask.

Which model BSA Martini? Pre-war Model 12, 12/15, or 15? Or post-war International, International MkII (there was no official MkI), MkIII, etc.? If you don't know there's a website out of England that'll shed light on it. Rifleman.org.uk. It's a convoluted website reminiscent of the early days of the Internet, you'll have to patiently click your way around in it.

Essentially they're all plenty strong for any flavor ammo you care to shoot. Heck, a lot of the pre-war models are converted to centerfire, they're strong enough to hold anything that'll make the turn into the chamber. As for other considerations regarding ammo, I never heard of any cautions regarding bullet material/lube, and that's over the course of owning/shooting/competing/reading about them for about 45 years now.

I currently campaign a pre-war BSA Model 12 and a post-war BSA International. As much as I love my American falling block .22 target rifles, when the chips are down and I absolutely need to present my best effort it's one of those two that gets the nod.

The Mossberg trigger guard should be plastic. If you want a plastic one these folks here can fix you up at a reasonable price.

https://www.havlinsales.com/

drover

I agree that I can't see the bullet coating making any difference. I'd probably stick to standard velocity stuff.

As far as the Mossberg, those plastic trigger guards were bad to shrink. I'd say someone replace their poor fitting or broken original trigger guard with a homemade one.

I should think that it would be a golden opportunity for someone with a 3D printer to make stuff like this.

I'm not sure who exactly BSA was/is...some sources say it is actually a consortium of armsmakers based in Birmingham (Gnoahhh help me out here). In any case, it defies credibility that BSA ever used anything but the finest materials and workmanship. Apparently it was a huge status symbol to hold competitions between manufacturers for some kind of royal trophy(s). My main rimfire with a Martini style action is a Vickers "Special" with Vickers own 'Perfection' rear sight, and the special barrel. Vickers and BSA were fierce competitors and fielded their chosen factory teams in competitions. Vickers floated their barrels, the "perfection' sight allowed the rifle to be cleaned through the breech. The 'champion' rifle was guaranteed to shoot 1.5" at 100 yds. Not too shabby for irons. Almost all English pre-war target .22 was lubed with beeswax, some say that Eley still uses it... In any case, do not worry about the steel in the barrel or the strength of the action, one man's opinion.

Spot on. I never owned a Vickers. (C'mon, try as I might I can't have owned them all!!) One day hope to find one.

BSA was to England what Winchester was to us, in terms of mass market civilian guns. They were an industrial conglomerate with a collective philosophy of quality craftsmanship. Witness their target rifles and consistently high quality Lee-Enfield service rifles. Don't forget they also built the BSA motorcycle, a mainstay in that industry for a long time.

England really only had two main mass market miniature (small bore to us) target rifle manufacturers in the pre-war era: BSA and Vickers, with BSA being far more common. Vickers chief claim to fame was its Martini action encased in a one piece stock versus the two piece BSA stock. Debated back then and still debated, in regards to perceived advantages.

As far as providing a hole in the back of the receiver to allow barrel cleaning from the breech end, BSA wised up and started providing that feature too. No matter who made it though, you still have to drop the breech block out of the gun to utilize that feature. (Anecdote: my 1950-ish vintage BSA International MkI has that hole, and I can certainly drop the block out in about 15 seconds, but the comb on the bloody buttstock is a skinch too high to allow the cleaning rod to clear. And to make matters worse the buttstock screw is tighter than tight and won't budge, so I can't remove the stock. No matter, I use a precisely fitted bore guide with coated Parker-Hale rod and clean from the muzzle, no harm no foul.)

Thanks Gnoahhh, one other thing about the Vickies, if you don't like your barrel, you have to keep your barrel....barrel and breech are one piece.

I never knew that!

The pre-war era was a hot time for smallbore position target shooting in America. The Winchester 52 was our gold standard at the time, and the Martini (even though it was every bit as accurate as the 52) was rarely seen on the firing lines. Why? Because there was an import tariff in effect that made the Martini horribly expensive compared to the off-the-shelf price of a 52. (Ditto the Vickers.) Another reason was its underlever was kind of inconvenient for a prone shooter, especially in rapid fire stages. The Miniature Rifle Societies (smallbore clubs) in England clung to somewhat different courses of fire and also clung to their native guns. When rifle shooting in general in England became a royal pain in the ass, many Societies disbanded and their guns went on the market, the bear's share of them to the American surplus market. (Ah for the free-wheeling days of cheap surplus rifles of all types flooding the U.S. back in the 50's-70's.)

I'd love to add something but as usual Gary covered it all! Heck, he's my go to guy for these sorts of questions.

Hopefully they’d get it right. I bought a couple of single-shot adapters for CZ RFs and while they feed well, they messed up ejection. Finding the exact reason is “on The List”.

Maybe I should have said gnoahhh or Pugs😛

Can't help you with the BSA.

When I have a Mossberg question, I call Vic Havlin at 636-937-6401.

Some guys in my club that shoot old mossys just use SV CCI ammo and their rifles shoot great. Almost as well a my model 52B..

Hello again Mark,

On the Martini Target rifle. If it has a "match" barrel which it very well could be since its advertised as a "target" model. A "match" 22 chamber is reamed to closer tolerances and most match chambered barrels warn you NOT to shoot CCI Stingers because the brass is something like several thousanths longer that 22 standard ammo. I'm not sure about the CCI 22 Mini Mags but they are also hyper velocity ammo.

Do a search for .22 caliber match or target chambered barrels and you will find a wealth of info.

Just got back to this thread. His Martini is a 12/15.
We're looking for parts for the rear sight - a Parker Hale #7.
The elevation adjustment screw is broken off, and the "knob" is missing.

Ruger warns against the use of Stingers in their 10/22 CSC, which has a kinda-sorta match chamber. My CZ MTR has a CIP minimum chamber and you can feel the bullets seat in the rifling with just about any ammo. Haven’t and wouldn’t try Stingers in that one, or any other trick ammo.

I have never had much luck with Stingers in rifles - somewhat better in pistols and revolvers, but still have had better luck with mini-mag HP.
(I don't shoot targets as much as vermin and cans)