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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
You can't build cheap. You have to have the biggest names. ETc...
LMAO.
While I would part together a better gun if my life relied on it, most of the times the cheaper stuff is just fine for fun. And truth be told lots of what you pay for is profit. Lots of parts are made by some of the single big companies, bought in bulk and sold under various names...
2-3 moa with good ammo takes the cheapest barrel you can buy basically. 2-3 MOA with ball bulk ammo, the best barrel might not make it consistently.
bear creek uppers. Under 300 on Black Friday. Just shot mine. Looks like it will hold MOA basically pretty easily with the right ammo. PSA nothing wrong with either.
Odds are there will be lots of cheap bulk run through this, like most of my guns. Bear creek I’m a little leery of, heard the machine work on their barrels isn’t all that. PSA and Aero are both on my radar, I’ll check out and see if I can find one of those Model 1 somewhere So far a sample of 5 folks with bear creek all show with reloads around MOA. I don't think they are any worse than the other lower end places personally so far. Faxon sold us a skinny barrel years ago that was pretty much MOA with reloads too. Accuracy with ball ammo says usually not much more than what the ammo is.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19 |
You can't build cheap. You have to have the biggest names. ETc...
LMAO.
While I would part together a better gun if my life relied on it, most of the times the cheaper stuff is just fine for fun. And truth be told lots of what you pay for is profit. Lots of parts are made by some of the single big companies, bought in bulk and sold under various names...
2-3 moa with good ammo takes the cheapest barrel you can buy basically. 2-3 MOA with ball bulk ammo, the best barrel might not make it consistently.
bear creek uppers. Under 300 on Black Friday. Just shot mine. Looks like it will hold MOA basically pretty easily with the right ammo. PSA nothing wrong with either.
Odds are there will be lots of cheap bulk run through this, like most of my guns. Bear creek I’m a little leery of, heard the machine work on their barrels isn’t all that. PSA and Aero are both on my radar, I’ll check out and see if I can find one of those Model 1 somewhere So far a sample of 5 folks with bear creek all show with reloads around MOA. I don't think they are any worse than the other lower end places personally so far. Faxon sold us a skinny barrel years ago that was pretty much MOA with reloads too. Accuracy with ball ammo says usually not much more than what the ammo is. I guess he will keep us posted. He says he paid $180.00 for a used upper with BCG. One of my buddies offered me a complete flat top upper with old Bushmaster 20" HBAR with A2 fsp for $350.00. Says it shoots great too. Another buddy bought an old/but like new complete A2 national match Bushy upper for $200.00 a few years ago. So my question: does a person buy a used el cheapo, or go with a more proven upper for just a little more money? Also, my buddies national match loves 62gr green tip ammo, but doesn't like 55gr ball. I don't know of too many rifles that do like ball ammo. Expectations shouldn't be too high there.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,749 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,749 Likes: 2 |
You get finer sight adjustments with the NM. Other than that, it's your judgment call.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
You can't build cheap. You have to have the biggest names. ETc...
LMAO.
While I would part together a better gun if my life relied on it, most of the times the cheaper stuff is just fine for fun. And truth be told lots of what you pay for is profit. Lots of parts are made by some of the single big companies, bought in bulk and sold under various names...
2-3 moa with good ammo takes the cheapest barrel you can buy basically. 2-3 MOA with ball bulk ammo, the best barrel might not make it consistently.
bear creek uppers. Under 300 on Black Friday. Just shot mine. Looks like it will hold MOA basically pretty easily with the right ammo. PSA nothing wrong with either.
Odds are there will be lots of cheap bulk run through this, like most of my guns. Bear creek I’m a little leery of, heard the machine work on their barrels isn’t all that. PSA and Aero are both on my radar, I’ll check out and see if I can find one of those Model 1 somewhere So far a sample of 5 folks with bear creek all show with reloads around MOA. I don't think they are any worse than the other lower end places personally so far. Faxon sold us a skinny barrel years ago that was pretty much MOA with reloads too. Accuracy with ball ammo says usually not much more than what the ammo is. I guess he will keep us posted. He says he paid $180.00 for a used upper with BCG. One of my buddies offered me a complete flat top upper with old Bushmaster 20" HBAR with A2 fsp for $350.00. Says it shoots great too. Another buddy bought an old/but like new complete A2 national match Bushy upper for $200.00 a few years ago. So my question: does a person buy a used el cheapo, or go with a more proven upper for just a little more money? Also, my buddies national match loves 62gr green tip ammo, but doesn't like 55gr ball. I don't know of too many rifles that do like ball ammo. Expectations shouldn't be too high there. 62 is ball also, but sometimes shoots a bit better. Especially if you weight sort the 62s if loading em. Big PITA. before we did that we just bought thousands of 60 flat base HP instead. That said ball is often 3 moa and thats what he was sort of after. Thats out of just rack military guns. So its not going to be hard to get where he wants to go typically.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 117
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 117 |
I bought a DB upper for $230 shipped for complete 16 inch barrel model with rail and it shoots great. I found Anderson LPK's for $35 also so I have less than $400 in my build. Watch cdnnsports also for close out parts.
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,899 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,899 Likes: 7 |
I wanted to build one. Then looked at parts, and the few tools needed. Then the few more to do it right.
Then looked at PSA complete uppers/lowers.
It became obvious real quick that building cheap AR's was the same game as reloading cheap blasting ammo. (Remember then)
And also that, with careful shopping,
a high quality gun could be built relatively cheaply.
Just like loading high quality ammo.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19 |
You can't build cheap. You have to have the biggest names. ETc...
LMAO.
While I would part together a better gun if my life relied on it, most of the times the cheaper stuff is just fine for fun. And truth be told lots of what you pay for is profit. Lots of parts are made by some of the single big companies, bought in bulk and sold under various names...
2-3 moa with good ammo takes the cheapest barrel you can buy basically. 2-3 MOA with ball bulk ammo, the best barrel might not make it consistently.
bear creek uppers. Under 300 on Black Friday. Just shot mine. Looks like it will hold MOA basically pretty easily with the right ammo. PSA nothing wrong with either.
Odds are there will be lots of cheap bulk run through this, like most of my guns. Bear creek I’m a little leery of, heard the machine work on their barrels isn’t all that. PSA and Aero are both on my radar, I’ll check out and see if I can find one of those Model 1 somewhere So far a sample of 5 folks with bear creek all show with reloads around MOA. I don't think they are any worse than the other lower end places personally so far. Faxon sold us a skinny barrel years ago that was pretty much MOA with reloads too. Accuracy with ball ammo says usually not much more than what the ammo is. I guess he will keep us posted. He says he paid $180.00 for a used upper with BCG. One of my buddies offered me a complete flat top upper with old Bushmaster 20" HBAR with A2 fsp for $350.00. Says it shoots great too. Another buddy bought an old/but like new complete A2 national match Bushy upper for $200.00 a few years ago. So my question: does a person buy a used el cheapo, or go with a more proven upper for just a little more money? Also, my buddies national match loves 62gr green tip ammo, but doesn't like 55gr ball. I don't know of too many rifles that do like ball ammo. Expectations shouldn't be too high there. 62 is ball also, but sometimes shoots a bit better. Especially if you weight sort the 62s if loading em. Big PITA. before we did that we just bought thousands of 60 flat base HP instead. That said ball is often 3 moa and thats what he was sort of after. Thats out of just rack military guns. So its not going to be hard to get where he wants to go typically. I agree rost. One of the reasons I brought up the 62gr green tips as well. It is ball, but seems to be just a bit better in some rifles than the 55's.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609 |
Upper and magazines showed up today, had the unexpected surprise of the upper still having a BCG in it. Sans sights I’m in for ~$350 at this point since the BCG I bought shouldn’t be needed. Still trying to decide which iron sights to buy, but I think that it’s close to finished for less than expected. Hopefully will hit the range next week.
Last edited by ClayBelt; 01/03/22.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19 |
Figure at 180 shipped across the country for a used one that’s complete with a BCG, it’s either going to be a crapshoot I use as trade materiel or else it’ll result in a $350 AR build Upper and magazines showed up today, had the unexpected surprise of the upper still having a BCG in it. Sans sights I’m in for ~$350 at this point since the BCG I bought shouldn’t be needed. Still trying to decide which iron sights to buy, but I think that it’s close to finished for less than expected. Hopefully will hit the range next week. "unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609 |
"unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I doubt mine will be a good metric to judge BCA off of since this is a used upper.
Last edited by ClayBelt; 01/04/22.
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,555 Likes: 2
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,555 Likes: 2 |
Joe bobs is a good little site for ar parts. I couldn't find a 300bo upper anywhere and decided to build one. I went with aero upper from them, ar stoner barrel, matrix arms handguard. Of course the proper gas tube, etc and a toolcraft bcg. Had fun doing it and it shoots well.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
"unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I doubt mine will be a good metric to judge BCA off of since this is a used upper. But you gotta recall that BSA has his own personal demand of good accuracy. And recall that good accuracy is what YOU desire. As long as you report what you shot and how it shot its all perfect IMHO.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,179 Likes: 19 |
"unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I doubt mine will be a good metric to judge BCA off of since this is a used upper. But you gotta recall that BSA has his own personal demand of good accuracy. And recall that good accuracy is what YOU desire. As long as you report what you shot and how it shot its all perfect IMHO. I only give a chidt about good honest groups. Honest being the operative word. I'll also add that 3 shot groups should not apply when dealing with high capacity firearms, such as an AR15. They should also not apply to a varmint rifle or heavy barreled tactical rifle in any chambering.. Others may disagree, but those are my standards.. YMMV
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609
Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 609 |
Well, it looks like we will not find out. Pawn shop next to my work had a gew 88 that I traded them for, straight swap and it should compliment my vz98/22 well.
Last edited by ClayBelt; 01/04/22.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 9,130
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 9,130 |
"unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I doubt mine will be a good metric to judge BCA off of since this is a used upper. But you gotta recall that BSA has his own personal demand of good accuracy. And recall that good accuracy is what YOU desire. As long as you report what you shot and how it shot its all perfect IMHO. I only give a chidt about good honest groups. Honest being the operative word. I'll also add that 3 shot groups should not apply when dealing with high capacity firearms, such as an AR15. They should also not apply to a varmint rifle or heavy barreled tactical rifle in any chambering.. Others may disagree, but those are my standards.. YMMV Its not all about you..........
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,252 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,252 Likes: 4 |
"unexpected surprise" huh? AS was expecting a good range report. Is it going to be factual? Some things in this thread, make you go hmmm...
I doubt mine will be a good metric to judge BCA off of since this is a used upper. But you gotta recall that BSA has his own personal demand of good accuracy. And recall that good accuracy is what YOU desire. As long as you report what you shot and how it shot its all perfect IMHO. I only give a chidt about good honest groups. Honest being the operative word. I'll also add that 3 shot groups should not apply when dealing with high capacity firearms, such as an AR15. They should also not apply to a varmint rifle or heavy barreled tactical rifle in any chambering.. Others may disagree, but those are my standards.. YMMV Good logic. kwg
For liberals and anarchists, power and control is opium, selling envy is the fastest and easiest way to get it. TRR. American conservative. Never trust a white liberal. Malcom X Current NRA member.
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,509
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,509 |
Any of you guys hear of KM Tactical? They sell a lot of inexpensive parts. I bought some inexpensive handguards from them. A local shop had some for $59, so I figured what the heck. Look exactly like my $270 Noveske NSR's, but a lot less money, and they work very well. Seem to be very rigid and accuracy stays the same: Can you figure out which one is not a NSR? They have some very light M-lok rails on sale right now. The op may want to check them out: KM Tactical M-Lok skinny rail on sale: $39.95Well I will be the Guinea pig lol I ordered everything from them minus barrel and Lower. Grand total was $292 which included shipping.
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego. Suckin' on my titties like you wanted me.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
Any of you guys hear of KM Tactical? They sell a lot of inexpensive parts. I bought some inexpensive handguards from them. A local shop had some for $59, so I figured what the heck. Look exactly like my $270 Noveske NSR's, but a lot less money, and they work very well. Seem to be very rigid and accuracy stays the same: Can you figure out which one is not a NSR? They have some very light M-lok rails on sale right now. The op may want to check them out: KM Tactical M-Lok skinny rail on sale: $39.95Well I will be the Guinea pig lol I ordered everything from them minus barrel and Lower. Grand total was $292 which included shipping. I believe all their stuff is Chinese made.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,509
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,509 |
Any of you guys hear of KM Tactical? They sell a lot of inexpensive parts. I bought some inexpensive handguards from them. A local shop had some for $59, so I figured what the heck. Look exactly like my $270 Noveske NSR's, but a lot less money, and they work very well. Seem to be very rigid and accuracy stays the same: Can you figure out which one is not a NSR? They have some very light M-lok rails on sale right now. The op may want to check them out: KM Tactical M-Lok skinny rail on sale: $39.95Well I will be the Guinea pig lol I ordered everything from them minus barrel and Lower. Grand total was $292 which included shipping. I believe all their stuff is Chinese made. Cool like 90% of the stuff sold in this country…. Their BCG advertised made in America, along with their uppers. Now there float tubes different story probably.
Last edited by 79S; 01/07/22.
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego. Suckin' on my titties like you wanted me.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
Any of you guys hear of KM Tactical? They sell a lot of inexpensive parts. I bought some inexpensive handguards from them. A local shop had some for $59, so I figured what the heck. Look exactly like my $270 Noveske NSR's, but a lot less money, and they work very well. Seem to be very rigid and accuracy stays the same: Can you figure out which one is not a NSR? They have some very light M-lok rails on sale right now. The op may want to check them out: KM Tactical M-Lok skinny rail on sale: $39.95Well I will be the Guinea pig lol I ordered everything from them minus barrel and Lower. Grand total was $292 which included shipping. I believe all their stuff is Chinese made. Cool like 90% of the stuff sold in this country…. Their BCG advertised made in America, along with their uppers. Now there float tubes different story probably. I don't buy Chinese made goods when there are viable alternatives made in the US or made in countries that share our values and respect intellectual property rights. There are scathing reviews of KM Tactical's BCGs on ARF. Whether these reviews apply to their current crop, I don't know. With the shortages of the last two years, I've frequently contacted suppliers to ensure that I'm not buying Chinese made parts. With the exception of a very small window around the time of the Biden Bucks Covid stimulus, at no time has the parts supply compelled me to reevaluate my stance—I've not needed to accept Chinese made parts due to lack of alternatives or the wildly escalated pricing of alternatives. Granted all this hinges on my own personal values and my individual choice to prioritize not supporting the economies of my enemies. I don't presume that these must necessarily also be your priorities, but would certainly understand if they were.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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