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I just did a comparison of a Leupold VX5 3-15x56, TT 315 Hunter and the S&B Polar 3-12x54. Had them all in hand and the Polar had the best overall glass I've ever seen to my eyes. I did end up sending it back though since the Tangent was so very close optically and there was nothing I couldn't shoot with one vs the other. The Tangent was a better match for my hunting set up due to the tube size (30mm vs 34mm) and the turrets clicks.

Best of luck.

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I haven't used the Polar but I've been using a Tangent Theta 3-15 LRH for much of my last light hunting this year and it's very, very good.

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Originally Posted by MosesTucker
I know this topic and discussion has been thoroughly covered and at times worn out. But I need some help. The short of it is I need opinions based on experience on the absolute best glass for low light field hunting in the south. Whitetail, hogs and coyotes.

On an extremely overcast evening a couple weeks ago I was unable to identify what buck I was looking at through my scope about three minutes before legal shooting light ended. I have three good bucks on Camera and only one that I wanted to shoot this year. The others need one more year. Hunting a food plot field I could not distinguish what buck I was looking at and the edge of the woods 200 yards away.

I have $1300 set aside for glass on a new rifle I am having built. But I would be willing to save a little more over the course of the spring if it would make a huge difference. I currently have a VX5 3-15x44 with a fire or not and have been pleased with it and still am, but that was the scope I was looking through on the evening I couldn’t make out the buck. I’m trying to figure out what route to go to give me the absolute best low light performance. That is probably the biggest priority for me as a southern Whitetail hunter looking at fields and powerlines. I elk hunt once a year but that is typically an archery hunt. I have a solid set up for elk hunting with a rifle so the scope I am shopping for right now is a dedicated low lot field hunting scope. I’m fine with large objectives and like the idea of twisting turrets out to 600 yards for practice.

I’ve been reading about Z6, V6, and and some of the offerings from S&B, Tract and Leica. willing to put up extra money to go in this type of direction if it’s worth it and I get an extra 10 minutes.

Sorry for the long epistle but hoping someone can steer me in the right direction. Thanks


I have gone through your same quest but I did not want to pack around a 56mm star scope on my deer rifle. So I went with a lighter and smaller 1" 42mm Z3 Swaro, which alone has excellent low light capability. However when I cant see horns with my scope I can see them clearly thru my Swaro 10x42 binos. So I use them to first scan and id horns etc in low light. Yeah I know they are 2k binos but with your existing good scope you might want to instead look at putting the 1200 bucks into some top quality glass. Maybe check out the Toric line as they supposedly have euro glass but at less than 1/2 price of name brand ones. You can always try out and return if you handle them delicately.
I am not a rich guy but did treat myself to a pair of top of the line binos some years back. If I got in a bind I would sell one of my fav rifles before I sold those binos.

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Many things need to be factored to find the right low light scope for yourself, but if just talking glass, then the S&B Polar is indeed at the top of the heap. I've found nothing better.

With that being said, and the fact you have $1300 set aside right now, I'd take a hard look at the Minox All-Rounder. It comes very close to the Polar in performance, has the option of setting the illumination to a darker curve (you'll want to do that) and affords resolution that rivals anything out there. The All-Rounder is the culmination of improving and streamlining/simplifying the excellent ZE5i series. The series hasn't been heavily marketed but is definitely worth a look.

Right now, Optics Trade EU from Slovenia has them in stock, and with shipping/customs fees, the 2.5-10x50 will run you just over $1300. The 3-15x56 is about $80 bucks more. Don't worry about int'l shipping; it's quicker than ground here in the US lol. A scope I recently bought from them arrived in 3 business days.

Here is a link:
Minox page at Optics Trade EU

There are a number of other excellent optics that would serve your purpose. But sadly, a number of them -- like the Kahles Helia scopes -- can't be purchased here any longer and can't be imported, either. Hunting in Europe is often a low-light activity, and scopes available there often vary greatly compared to what is served up to the US market. The Steiner Ranger 4 and 6 (not sold here but can be imported) are perfect examples when compared to the Steiner models sold here in the US, all of which have far too bright of illumination and reticles which aren't the best for low light applications.

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Best - S&B Polar

Close 2nd - Zeiss Victory HT & Leica Magnus

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Originally Posted by BobbyTomek
Many things need to be factored to find the right low light scope for yourself, but if just talking glass, then the S&B Polar is indeed at the top of the heap. I've found nothing better.

With that being said, and the fact you have $1300 set aside right now, I'd take a hard look at the Minox All-Rounder. It comes very close to the Polar in performance, has the option of setting the illumination to a darker curve (you'll want to do that) and affords resolution that rivals anything out there. The All-Rounder is the culmination of improving and streamlining/simplifying the excellent ZE5i series. The series hasn't been heavily marketed but is definitely worth a look.

Right now, Optics Trade EU from Slovenia has them in stock, and with shipping/customs fees, the 2.5-10x50 will run you just over $1300. The 3-15x56 is about $80 bucks more. Don't worry about int'l shipping; it's quicker than ground here in the US lol. A scope I recently bought from them arrived in 3 business days.

Here is a link:
Minox page at Optics Trade EU

There are a number of other excellent optics that would serve your purpose. But sadly, a number of them -- like the Kahles Helia scopes -- can't be purchased here any longer and can't be imported, either. Hunting in Europe is often a low-light activity, and scopes available there often vary greatly compared to what is served up to the US market. The Steiner Ranger 4 and 6 (not sold here but can be imported) are perfect examples when compared to the Steiner models sold here in the US, all of which have far too bright of illumination and reticles which aren't the best for low light applications.



Bobby, how did you come to have experience with so many high quality optics? How does the VAT work out?

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Would one of the large objective Kaps be worth a look?

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I'm a Swaro fan, love my El's, AV and Z3's but I wasn't really happy with the Z6 50mm. My Leica er5 also a 50mm and a Zeiss Victory HT I hunted with were both much better at very low light than the Z6 I had. But as someone already posted each person's vision is different and I would get another Z3 before I considered a Z6.

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Are you over 50? (OP)

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Originally Posted by Rhodes
Are you over 50? (OP)


I turn 50 this year. I just recently had to start wearing readers.

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Originally Posted by MosesTucker
It’s true I had to go to Reeder‘s this year. The big 5O caught up with me! Just hoping I might get a few more minutes on these aging eyes when I’m sitting on those big fields.


ALL need a GREAT not cheap pair of Binoculars. Our deer time is 1 hr before sunrise to 1 hr after sunset. I currently use Meopta Meostar 12x50's. My favorite low light scope is the old Leupold var-x 3 with the heavy duplex. I NEVER scan with the rifle. In fact its never touched unless I want to shoot. I "hunt"with the binoculars(from high tower stands).
Many times I have found deer with my binoculars that I couldn't see with my naked eye. Once spotted. That old Leupold scoped .280 usually earned them a ride in the truck.

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Lots of good stuff to think about. Looks like I might need to invest in better binoculars.

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Originally Posted by MosesTucker
Originally Posted by Rhodes
Are you over 50? (OP)


I turn 50 this year. I just recently had to start wearing readers.


Reason I ask is.....cataracts are insidious and inevitable. People can get them young or older. They reduce light transmission big time.

Just saying, whenever we start talking about scopes and clarity and light transmission, start with getting your eyes and vision checked for best performance.

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Originally Posted by Rhodes
Originally Posted by MosesTucker
Originally Posted by Rhodes
Are you over 50? (OP)


I turn 50 this year. I just recently had to start wearing readers.


Reason I ask is.....cataracts are insidious and inevitable. People can get them young or older. They reduce light transmission big time.

Just saying, whenever we start talking about scopes and clarity and light transmission, start with getting your eyes and vision checked for best performance.


Yeah that’s good wisdom. I actually have an eye exam/check up coming in three weeks so I will talk to my optometrist about that. He’s not a hunter or a sportsman so I’m not sure how familiar he is with optics in the sporting realm but I will definitely talk to him about my situation

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Originally Posted by BobbyTomek
Many things need to be factored to find the right low light scope for yourself, but if just talking glass, then the S&B Polar is indeed at the top of the heap. I've found nothing better.

With that being said, and the fact you have $1300 set aside right now, I'd take a hard look at the Minox All-Rounder. It comes very close to the Polar in performance, has the option of setting the illumination to a darker curve (you'll want to do that) and affords resolution that rivals anything out there. The All-Rounder is the culmination of improving and streamlining/simplifying the excellent ZE5i series. The series hasn't been heavily marketed but is definitely worth a look.

Right now, Optics Trade EU from Slovenia has them in stock, and with shipping/customs fees, the 2.5-10x50 will run you just over $1300. The 3-15x56 is about $80 bucks more. Don't worry about int'l shipping; it's quicker than ground here in the US lol. A scope I recently bought from them arrived in 3 business days.

Here is a link:
Minox page at Optics Trade EU

There are a number of other excellent optics that would serve your purpose. But sadly, a number of them -- like the Kahles Helia scopes -- can't be purchased here any longer and can't be imported, either. Hunting in Europe is often a low-light activity, and scopes available there often vary greatly compared to what is served up to the US market. The Steiner Ranger 4 and 6 (not sold here but can be imported) are perfect examples when compared to the Steiner models sold here in the US, all of which have far too bright of illumination and reticles which aren't the best for low light applications.


Thank you so much. Very helpful. Of the two Minox scopes you’ve listed, would I gain any low light Advantage going with the larger 56mm?

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Originally Posted by MosesTucker
Originally Posted by BobbyTomek
Many things need to be factored to find the right low light scope for yourself, but if just talking glass, then the S&B Polar is indeed at the top of the heap. I've found nothing better.

With that being said, and the fact you have $1300 set aside right now, I'd take a hard look at the Minox All-Rounder. It comes very close to the Polar in performance, has the option of setting the illumination to a darker curve (you'll want to do that) and affords resolution that rivals anything out there. The All-Rounder is the culmination of improving and streamlining/simplifying the excellent ZE5i series. The series hasn't been heavily marketed but is definitely worth a look.

Right now, Optics Trade EU from Slovenia has them in stock, and with shipping/customs fees, the 2.5-10x50 will run you just over $1300. The 3-15x56 is about $80 bucks more. Don't worry about int'l shipping; it's quicker than ground here in the US lol. A scope I recently bought from them arrived in 3 business days.

Here is a link:
Minox page at Optics Trade EU

There are a number of other excellent optics that would serve your purpose. But sadly, a number of them -- like the Kahles Helia scopes -- can't be purchased here any longer and can't be imported, either. Hunting in Europe is often a low-light activity, and scopes available there often vary greatly compared to what is served up to the US market. The Steiner Ranger 4 and 6 (not sold here but can be imported) are perfect examples when compared to the Steiner models sold here in the US, all of which have far too bright of illumination and reticles which aren't the best for low light applications.


Thank you so much. Very helpful. Of the two Minox scopes you’ve listed, would I gain any low light Advantage going with the larger 56mm?


You should gain in brightness going with 56 vs. 50 with the same scope model. That being said, the larger scope is higher and more difficult to mount and is heavier.
I agree with the person above that said you need to see the target in your binoculars before you use the scope, but if your scope is not up to task you will not be able to see it.

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Originally Posted by MosesTucker


Thank you so much. Very helpful. Of the two Minox scopes you’ve listed, would I gain any low light Advantage going with the larger 56mm?


The 56 won't appear to be any brighter given equal exit pupils. The only edge you may gain is being able to use a sightly higher magnification and transferring a tad more detail to your eye. But those differences are minimal and almost impossible to detect in the field. When you get to glass of this quality level, a 50mm objective has proven to be more than sufficient for my usage. In fact, my favorite low-light scope overall is the Docter Basic 2.5-10x50 or its twin (Noblex Vario N4 2.5-10x50).

One other thought on higher magnifications: An overlooked facet is AO/SF. With very shallow depth of field in poor lighting, there can be occasions when more precise focus of the image can be beneficial, though I can only think of one single situation when I actually took advantage of SF. I was using a ZE5i 3-15x56 and was having a tough time discerning the edges and positioning of a moonlight coyote as it was blending into the frost-burned winter grass.

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The 56mm objective has 25.44% more area than the 50mm objective. That's huge!

How would you like to get a 25.44% raise in your income?


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Originally Posted by PaulBarnard

Bobby, how did you come to have experience with so many high quality optics? How does the VAT work out?


I've addressed this before, so here's a very short summary. When my health deteriorated to a point that I could no longer get out and stalk, I knew my only options were sniping unsuspecting coyotes and hogs from the front yard here at our farm. But they rarely show in good daylight. So I sold off a number of my guns and began experimenting with optics in an attempt to find the perfect low-light scope. Of course, that does not exist LOL.

As to VAT and customs, just as you would do here in the states, you learn to shop around, find VAT-free items or tax-free offerings and sales. Also, Optics Trade occasionally offers free international priority shipping. A recent item I was looking at (cost app. $1000) had an expedited shipping offering of $69.90 via UPS -- and that included all customs fees).

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Bobby,
Sounds like you might want to consider traveling the very slippery thermal-scope-slope.


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