Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns Rds on pistol? Yea or nay

I agree with Flave. There is a learning curve. Once you get it, it’s way better then open sights. Especially if your eyesight isn’t what it once was. I have a Holosun 507k on my P365XL amd live it. There ate some pretty good videos on YouTube on learning to use reflex sights on hamdguns.

Ron

Have you measured "way better"?

It is ok to enjoy the latest fad. Just don't confuse a video game with reality.

You, once again, have eliminated yourself from serious conversation with your 20 yard max b.s. Your limitations exist in many areas.

Shooting a handgun in a consistently competent fashion takes time and effort, a rds will improve the potential of the pistol for a competent shooter.


mike r

Competitive shooting is dominate by RDS, irons aren't competitive against RDS

Playing games is fun. Allowing playtime to spill over to defensive handgun use is questionable.
People shot very well long before the fad of RDS.

Yep and they shoot better and faster with them. They spill over onto difensive handguns because they are faster and more accurate. That is why I use them as well as many LEO my life is worth the best sighting system. YMMV

This is the definition of “way better” for me…50 yards, off the back porch top rail with my .500 S&W mag with a first generation Bushnell Holosight on it. No way I get this grouping at this distance with my old eyes and iron sights! By any definition, I shoot way better with the Holosight, than the revolver sights. They’re not for everyone, but they work better for many shooters. Speaking of fads….seems people said that about plastic pistols after Glock started making them, and I think that kinda stuck. I think RDS and Holosight type optics will also be around a long time as well.

I just picked this one up yesterday and got around to shooting it today.

It's still early but I like it a lot. I don't seem to have any issues trying to find the dot, and the ability to hit targets at range is impressive.

I posted on campfire about trading a taurus for a ruger. Check my thread & give me your thoughts

So, have you moved on to real guns yet or are you still stuck in your Kel-Tec fanboy fad?

The same posers made the same claim about optics on service rifles.

Stop pretending you can shoot.

I have the same thoughts as Massad Ayoob:

Thoughts on Carry Optics

9/12/2021

A growing trend in defensive handguns, from police service pistols to armed citizens’ concealed carry guns, is “carry optics”: compact red dot sights. I have three such in-house right now, all 9mms: a Langdon Beretta 92 LTT with Trijicon SRO, a Wilson Combat Glock 19 with Trijicon RMR, and an LTT Springfield Armory Hellcat with Holosun 407K.

Good news: You can see more target area around the red dot aiming index, better allowing you to see what’s happening at the target. Many shooters find the red dot improves accuracy. You can focus on the target and see the aiming dot simultaneously.

Bad news: Gotta keep that glass clean and fog-free. Anything battery-dependent is a concern. There is added bulk: appendix carry is popular with these guns because the broad surface of the abdomen gives more room to discreetly conceal the shape of a now “taller” pistol.

Carry optics on a handgun have a significant learning curve. Unlike a long gun, there’s no anchor point at the shoulder nor cheek index on the comb of a stock to help align eye with the red dot and the target.

I’m kinda like a cat chasing a laser beam: I have trouble catching the red dot. Thus, while I appreciate the advantages of a red dot, I’m still not as fast with it as I am with the iron sights to which I’ve been so long habituated.

Readers, give me some input. Tell me what you think of the concept, and let me know how much time you have working with them, and what type.

https://www.backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/thoughts-on-carry-optics/

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RDSs require a lot of shooting to develope a consistent presentation that allows you to catch the dot immediately. If you think you have a good presentation using iron sights, an RDS will quickly show you that it may not be as good as you think. An RDS will amplify a less than optimal presentation. In fact, you don't even need to shoot to practice this. You can develope the skill without pulling the trigger. But quickly reacquiring the dot after the first shot needs to be developed, too, which will require shooting.

The fogging issue is something a lot of people don't consider. Get out of an air conditioned car you've been in for awhile on a hot, humid day and you will immediately find your RDS lens occluded with fog. And there isn't a product out there that is truly effective at stopping it. Some people say getting a fogged lens is an avoidable problem. But in an emergency, I suspect it's not wise to tell your assailant to hold off until your RDS warms up a bit. Learning how to shoot with an occluded (or non-functioning) RDS is wise. Water on the emitter can also screw up the dot, even if the lens is basically clean.

I'm a bit ambivalent about RDSs on defensive handguns. They have advantages and shortcomings. Increased accuracy at longer ranges isn't even worth debating, RDSs simply are better. But I'm neither an operator nor a cop. I don't plan on getting into long running gun battles with anyone at long ranges. At very short ranges, I suspect the type of sights matters a lot less. Whatever you choose, you better shoot it a lot. There is no substitute for practice. A guy with an RDS on his gun whop doesn't practice is at a serious disadvantage to a guy with irons who does, regardless of range.

An RDS on a hunting handgun makes a lot of sense. Where one is taking their time to make the first shot count.

Couple of things I find with red dots.
If they're on a weapon that truly co-witnesses with open sites they can help teach/learn proper alignment in usage of the open sights. So long as the Red Dot is properly sighted in.

Also the red dots seem to be much easier to shoot both eyes open for people with eye dominance issues.

I wish this were an optic ready model where sights would be visible, but it's not. I think I'll like it with some practice

You sure about that?

Maybe. You messing with my mind Deflave. Quit it dude! 😎

Here is an issue that hasn't been discussed, that is actually a minor issue, if you use a dual illuminated model RMR.

Red dot RDSs have a red coating on the lens that filters out red light, buit green light will come through. It also allows for the red dot to be reflected on the glass so the shooter can seer it. Light coming through the glass has a green hue.

RDSs with a green dot have a green coating on the front lens that filters out green light, but red and amber light will come through. Light coming through that glass has a reddish hue.

If you want back up iron sights that co witness with the RDSs dot, and you still want to be able to see the glow of the tritium in the front sight through the RDS glass, then the colors of the dots on the RDS and the front sight need to be different. On my G17 with a green dot RMR, the front sight tritium green glow is completely filtered out buy the green coating on the front of the RMR. In low light, I only see the front sight tritium as I bring my pistol up, but once it goes in front of the RMR lens, that green glow is filtered out and I pick up the green dot of the RMR. I never even thought about this when I went with the dual illuminated RMR with a green dot and thought it might be a disadvantage. But I came to appreciate not being distracted in low light situations by seeing two green dots.

So it you want to see the glow of the tritium in the front sight through your RDS window, pick a color that is opposite of the color of the coating on the RDS lens. If you have a green coating, go with an amber front sight. If your have a red coating, go with a green front sight.

It's too bright in this pic to see that the front tritium glow is filtered out, but it is. Completely. In the pitch dark, I can scarcely see the glow of the front sight through my RMR lens.

Nice looking setup

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Setup for Hill People bag carry.
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Great points 10Glocks. I consider Mas Ayoob and John Farnam to be two of the best sources out there for self defense/shooting info.