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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,993 Likes: 7
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,993 Likes: 7 |
We must determine our definition of “long distance”! Here are my personal requirements….. An accurate rifle, using a fairly high BC bullet upwards of .30 caliber, that will give adequate expansion at the pre-determined distance limit involved, lots of trigger time with said rifle, and carefully choosing good atmospheric conditions! When you’ve satisfied all those parameters……having, as in my case, over 2000 ft/pounds of remaining energy at my personal limit of 600 yards is desirable! memtb Here's to ya. 2000 ft-lbs. at 600 yards, even for a heavy rifle, bumps me out of precision shooting. 1500 ft-lbs. at 600 yards, with a 9.5 lb rifle, is about it, and not all day long, either. But the .270 Win. can do that, if one is careful. GR FPE is irealavant quote such shows ignorance
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,052 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,052 Likes: 6 |
It’s a 9 pounder, and the recoil gets your attention! I’m certainly not good for more than 20 to 30 (30 is pushing it) rounds at a sitting with full house loads. I’d prefer to keep the round count under 10…..as the shoulder is pretty sore the next day! It’s shot very little with full house loads…..that’s what light loads in it and small bore rifles are for! memtb
You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel
“I’d like to be a good rifleman…..but, I prefer to be a good hunter”! memtb 2024
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,241 Likes: 31
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,241 Likes: 31 |
We must determine our definition of “long distance”! Here are my personal requirements….. An accurate rifle, using a fairly high BC bullet upwards of .30 caliber, that will give adequate expansion at the pre-determined distance limit involved, lots of trigger time with said rifle, and carefully choosing good atmospheric conditions! When you’ve satisfied all those parameters……having, as in my case, over 2000 ft/pounds of remaining energy at my personal limit of 600 yards is desirable! memtb Here's to ya. 2000 ft-lbs. at 600 yards, even for a heavy rifle, bumps me out of precision shooting. 1500 ft-lbs. at 600 yards, with a 9.5 lb rifle, is about it, and not all day long, either. But the .270 Win. can do that, if one is careful. GR FPE is iralavant quote such shows ignorance That has been my experience as well, due to both using and seeing a lot of big game taken on several continents with everything from broadhead arrows, .22-caliber rifles, and handguns on up to "big bore" rifles at various ranges. Impact energy has varied from around 50 foot-pounds to around 5000. The major factor I've noticed that matters is whether the projectile makes a big enough hole through the vital organs. Would like to hear about GA's, "The formulas used to determine bullet selection and impact velocity, on game inside that range, have proven themselves over a lifetime of hunting."
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,947 Likes: 72
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,947 Likes: 72 |
I would suggest that you abandon your chosen Long Range Rifle build, and either put a scope on a rifle that you have already that’s decent or buy a rifle in a caliber and cartridge that is easy shooting and can fire a projectile with a high BC.
People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience.
Get a good load for a rifle that you have and a scope that dials consistently and start shooting developing the drop data that works for all the drops out to as far as the rifle can shoot or the scope can travel. Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions. Learn how to dope the wind under pressure and time constraints.
When you do all of this, you will learn what is possible. You can then pick a cartridge that will get it done for you. You don’t have to shoot heavy recoiling cartridges to kill game at Long Range, but if you want to do so that’s fine.
It’s a great journey. You’ll find out every day how much you don’t know, but shooting in all conditions, learning to load, and understanding wind and a multitude of other things will eventually sink into your skull. You’ll discover humility.
Best of luck to you
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,998 Likes: 20
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,998 Likes: 20 |
Does anyone have experience with 155 Scenar expansion between 1800-1950 FPS?
I’m going to try to test it out on ballistic gell but wanted to see if anyone has on game experience from 1800-1950 FPS I shot a cow two seasons ago at 615 yards using my 20" Broadside shot. Entered the shoulder and was caught in the offside hide. Velocity was under 1900 according to my dope card. Worked perfectly fine as always. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/C4wmqRU.jpg) This is a quote from 3 or 4 elk ago. Using a rifle that does not weigh even 8 pounds and sure was not generating 1500-2000 FT-lbs at 615 yards. In fact according to my calcs, it was under 1200.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,579 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,579 Likes: 8 |
It’s a 9 pounder, and the recoil gets your attention! I’m certainly not good for more than 20 to 30 (30 is pushing it) rounds at a sitting with full house loads. I’d prefer to keep the round count under 10…..as the shoulder is pretty sore the next day! It’s shot very little with full house loads…..that’s what light loads in it and small bore rifles are for! memtb That's not a great recipe for developing LR proficiency with the load you'll use for LR hunting. Forget the arbitrary 2000 ft-lbs number, and use any 6mm+ cartridge/bullet that will retain enough velocity to expand when it hits flesh, and you're GTG. Most importantly, choose one that you can shoot to the best of your capability all afternoon without sub-consciously "bracing for impact" as you squeeze the trigger.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,579 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,579 Likes: 8 |
I would suggest that you abandon your chosen Long Range Rifle build, and either put a scope on a rifle that you have already that’s decent or buy a rifle in a caliber and cartridge that is easy shooting and can fire a projectile with a high BC.
People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience.
Get a good load for a rifle that you have and a scope that dials consistently and start shooting developing the drop data that works for all the drops out to as far as the rifle can shoot or the scope can travel. Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions. Learn how to dope the wind under pressure and time constraints.
When you do all of this, you will learn what is possible. You can then pick a cartridge that will get it done for you. You don’t have to shoot heavy recoiling cartridges to kill game at Long Range, but if you want to do so that’s fine.
It’s a great journey. You’ll find out every day how much you don’t know, but shooting in all conditions, learning to load, and understanding wind and a multitude of other things will eventually sink into your skull. You’ll discover humility.
Best of luck to you Good advice.
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 8,952 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 8,952 Likes: 6 |
Does a 140gr tsx max loaded out of a 270 even have enough velocity for reliable expansion at 600+ yds?.. mb
" Cheapest velocity in the world comes from a long barrel and I sure do like them. MB "
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,052 Likes: 6
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,052 Likes: 6 |
It’s worked pretty good for 30+ years! Though, I would much prefer shots under 50 yards! memtb
You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel
“I’d like to be a good rifleman…..but, I prefer to be a good hunter”! memtb 2024
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Joined: May 2021
Posts: 354
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 354 |
Wait, I thought all that was needed were some rip stop BDU’s and a three day assault pack and I too could be a sniper on some poor critter at 600 yards. And remember, that’s where true sniping begins..
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Joined: May 2021
Posts: 354
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 354 |
GR,
Sorry, but the more you post, the more I'm certain your knowledge of big game hunting is more theoretical than real. Ain’t that the truth. Still waiting on pics from the other thread.
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,184 Likes: 38
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 18,184 Likes: 38 |
I would suggest that you abandon your chosen Long Range Rifle build, and either put a scope on a rifle that you have already that’s decent or buy a rifle in a caliber and cartridge that is easy shooting and can fire a projectile with a high BC.
People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience.
Get a good load for a rifle that you have and a scope that dials consistently and start shooting developing the drop data that works for all the drops out to as far as the rifle can shoot or the scope can travel. Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions. Learn how to dope the wind under pressure and time constraints.
When you do all of this, you will learn what is possible. You can then pick a cartridge that will get it done for you. You don’t have to shoot heavy recoiling cartridges to kill game at Long Range, but if you want to do so that’s fine.
It’s a great journey. You’ll find out every day how much you don’t know, but shooting in all conditions, learning to load, and understanding wind and a multitude of other things will eventually sink into your skull. You’ll discover humility.
Best of luck to you Good advice. Yes it is. Doubt it will be followed.
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,323 Likes: 39
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,323 Likes: 39 |
I would suggest that you abandon your chosen Long Range Rifle build, and either put a scope on a rifle that you have already that’s decent or buy a rifle in a caliber and cartridge that is easy shooting and can fire a projectile with a high BC.
People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience.
Get a good load for a rifle that you have and a scope that dials consistently and start shooting developing the drop data that works for all the drops out to as far as the rifle can shoot or the scope can travel. Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions. Learn how to dope the wind under pressure and time constraints.
When you do all of this, you will learn what is possible. You can then pick a cartridge that will get it done for you. You don’t have to shoot heavy recoiling cartridges to kill game at Long Range, but if you want to do so that’s fine.
It’s a great journey. You’ll find out every day how much you don’t know, but shooting in all conditions, learning to load, and understanding wind and a multitude of other things will eventually sink into your skull. You’ll discover humility.
Best of luck to you Good advice. Yes it is. Doubt it will be followed. He needs a really good scope because I don't think the 3-9x40 Leupold he mentioned is going to cut it.. ha ha.. ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/eyqTMJy.jpg)
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,366 Likes: 13
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,366 Likes: 13 |
Does a 140gr tsx max loaded out of a 270 even have enough velocity for reliable expansion at 600+ yds?.. mb I wouldn't wanna gamble it myself.. A little practice shooting our 223’s and stuff during the summer out to 800 made the 675 yard shot pretty easy for my little brother. A decent scope like Jordan mentioned helps a bunch. ![[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]](https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/ww233/beretzs/DAC15E72_6256_499C_874C_07074028281B.jpeg) ![[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]](https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/ww233/beretzs/95904E37_C381_4FA7_B05D_3E342858A312.jpeg) We did use our packs to shoot over though.. Mine was much closer at 390, but still a relatively easy poke for a decent bullet and scope. ![[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]](https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/ww233/beretzs/B7005B12_D288_4133_B9F8_E77C7082A6B4.jpeg) ![[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]](https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/ww233/beretzs/940DB2EF_4E3D_4097_94ED_9129602B2A4D.jpeg)
Last edited by beretzs; 08/18/22.
Semper Fi
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,058 Likes: 1
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,058 Likes: 1 |
It takes excellent marksmanship. And a lot of practice.
And these zombies line up and eat from the media’s trough
Cowards CANNOT be free. Nor should they be.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,667 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,667 Likes: 6 |
GR,
Sorry, but the more you post, the more I'm certain your knowledge of big game hunting is more theoretical than real. Ain’t that the truth. Still waiting on pics from the other thread. I think he's a troll, volleying the General Big Game and the Ask the Gunwriters forums. It's Lee24 with a side of ElkSlayer91 and a sanctimonious dash of Savage_99.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/X0n16mr.png) WWP53D
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Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 3,085 Likes: 6
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 3,085 Likes: 6 |
[quote=rcamuglia]I would suggest that you abandon your chosen Long Range Rifle build, and either put a scope on a rifle that you have already that’s decent or buy a rifle in a caliber and cartridge that is easy shooting and can fire a projectile with a high BC.
People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience.
Get a good load for a rifle that you have and a scope that dials consistently and start shooting developing the drop data that works for all the drops out to as far as the rifle can shoot or the scope can travel. Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions. Learn how to dope the wind under pressure and time constraints.
When you do all of this, you will learn what is possible. You can then pick a cartridge that will get it done for you. You don’t have to shoot heavy recoiling cartridges to kill game at Long Range, but if you want to do so that’s fine.
It’s a great journey. You’ll find out every day how much you don’t know, but shooting in all conditions, learning to load, and understanding wind and a multitude of other things will eventually sink into your skull. You’ll discover humility.
Best of luck to you Good advice.[/quotI I agree with this also. This part (" Enter some fun shoots that are PRS style or practical rifle match style and learn how to get rest and build positions.")May not be necessary, but is still Good advise. You can accomplish this without having to enter a competition. Anyone can quickly learn to read a reticle or twist turrets. IMO the most important skill to learn is doping the wind. Find someone that is proficient at long range shooting. Maybe at a local gun club or shooting range that you can talk to. You can learn a lot from someone that has been in the long range game for a while. Learning how to read a mirage and wind conditions down range is more important than your rifle build at this point, JMO.
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,947 Likes: 72
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,947 Likes: 72 |
Participation in local precision matches is probably the most important part of the equation. It will make you a better rifleman and a better Hunter.
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,910 Likes: 13
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,910 Likes: 13 |
He needs a really good scope because I don't think the 3-9x40 Leupold he mentioned is going to cut it.. ha ha.. When I see that pic my imagination forms that sound a ruler makes when pinned down and thwanged on the edge of a desk.
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,161 Likes: 14
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,161 Likes: 14 |
...People have no business starting their long range shooting learning curve the way you are determined to do so. Starting out knowing nothing, thinking you know everything is a big problem, as you will finally figure it out with experience... The point of this thread, professor, is to determine what is necessary for shooting from 4-600 yards at game... versus < 400 yards. Already have a scoped rifle that handles < 400 yards just fine, and am a competent rifleman out to well beyond that. Thinking about building a hunting rifle good for 600 yards. Started a thread RE: that. Got mostly attitude and emotional outbursts so far. Was maybe expecting some practical advise. Thanks. GR
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