Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Scout Rifle

I recently posted a question about converting a Ruger 44 Carbine into a scout rifle. Winchester and Ruger both make a scout vertion of the Model 94 http://www.winchesterguns.com/prodi...?cat_id=534&type_id=119&cat=003C and the model 77. http://www.ruger.com/Firearms/FAProdView?model=17914&return=Y

Which are excellent rifle, but lack the fast follow up shot that a semi auto would provide. I want to convert the Ruger 44 carbine into a scout rifle.

I received a lot of suggestions of web sites that make these convertions, but none have parts for the 44.

The older model Deerfield carbine http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=83662736 looks like the best model to make these convertions to.

Looking for anyone that has drilled and tapped a barrel for scope mounts.

Hoot,

If you really want a scout rifle, then full speed ahead and damn the dollars!

Instead how about going with an Aimpoint (or other reflex sight) mounted on the action? Much easier to arrange, and much, much cheaper.

After using scouts since '93 (after a Jeff Cooper rifle course), I have regretfully concluded that the scout scope concept itself is flawed. It does work great on square ranges from 8:00a to 5:00p though.

jim

I have an older Ruger .44 Carbine like the one you referenced. It has a serial number that starts with 102, which I think means it has the "unloading button" near the loading port. The picture that showed the loading port also shows this button, barely. It is a nice feature, not present on the original version, and is worth looking for. (I wish mine had wood like that one!)

Anyway, it is difficult to mount a scope and retain the iron sights. I did it, using heavy steel mounts and a Leupold 1-4X, and then added a 0.250" riser block to the front sight to make it high enough to use a NECG peep sight on the rear scope mount (as an alternative to the scope -- can't be used with scope.)

This has been a really handy rifle. At 1X the scope is really easy to use at close range.

I've thought about putting a Aimpoint red dot scope on it, using a single ring on the rear mount, for low light conditions. It should work and should balance nicely, but I haven't tried it yet.

IMHO, because the .44 Carbine action doesn't require a forward mount like some bolt actions w/ stripper clip loading, the Cooper scout concept doesn't have to be followed exactly. You can get "both eyes open" viewing with a low power scope or red dot directly over the action...

fwiw,
I owned an early Steyr Scout and would agree with Mr. Dodd that the sighting system is flawed. A low range vaiable mounted over the receiver makes for a far more versatile rifle...imho

Regards, Matt Garrett.

I like the red dot idea. I have one on my Muzzleloader and its very fast to get on target.

Plus I wouldn't need to re-tap the rifle.

I'm not certain if any of these mounts will work on the 44 carbine, but if one will, it may be what you need. http://www.jackweigand.com/

Like the other guys have said,, I have a win94 set up with a scout scope and in low light or with the sin anywhere behind you it just dosn't work that well. Put you a 1x? variable or a 1X fixed and enjoy

I'm partial to the 1.5X6 Burris sig myself

The Scout Concept really falls apart if you are right handed and left eye dominant, as I am. I learned to shoot a bow left handed, but just can't shoulder a rifle naturally on the left- let alone have decent trigger control.
About the only advatage left is that you never get knocked in the forehead with a scout scope...

It amazes me the number of people who say the fwd mounted scope doesn't work, yet, every year a few thousand folks with scoped pistols shoot the crap out of stuff from early morning until the late evening. How do we do it?

Oh it works,, just not as well as a quality scope in the usual position.

That is why I can't shoot straight, should I go to the confessional?

I once had a 30-06 Scout built and used it for several years. After having taken Cooper�s work on faith for a long time, I was shocked to find that the Scout scope didn�t work as advertised. I was in college at the time, so I wrote a research paper on it and sent him a copy. He didn�t agree with me, but he was encouraged that I had tried his idea, and we exchanged several friendly letters before he died. I don�t say this to blow my own horn, only to show that I�ve given the Scout a fair shake.

In my opinion, a Scout scope is OK for close, fast shooting, but no better than a peep. This has nothing to do with the merits of one sight system over the other, and everything to do with the fact that the Ruger is stocked for iron sights and not a scope. If you spent your custom budget on ammo and range time, I think you�d come out ahead.

But don�t let me talk you out of trying a Scout. The best way is to drop $2k for a Steyr. Next best is a custom Scout, which costs at least that much if you do it right. Unfortunately, resale is worse on a Scout than for any other custom rifle, which I learned the hard way after I had a perfectly nice 338-06 made into a Scout. Instead, I�d get a Marlin and install an XS Scout mount. Use it for a few years like I did, then decide. If you don't like it, you can sell the parts and the gun and get far more of your money back than if you drill a Ruger full of extra holes.

The most important thing I learned from the Scout is that it�s not a death ray�you have to shoot a lot to get good with it. But you have to shoot a lot to get good with anything. I replaced my Scout with a light 308 bolt gun. It has a crisp trigger, a shooting sling, and a 4x Leupold scope in Weaver rings and bases. I also bought 1,000 rounds of cheap ammo when I got the rifle. I shot most of it the first year at targets within 100m, since that�s where I usually see deer.

That fall, I was walking back to camp when I saw a blacktail spike 90m away across a clearing. I turned and shot him through the lungs in less time than it takes to read this sentence. This is the classic Scout shot, but somehow I managed it with a rifle that�s �inferior� to a Scout. The next year, I tracked a blacktail doe to a brushy hilltop where she tried to sneak past me in the brush. I knew she had to pass a gap between two trees about 45m distant, so I put my crosshairs there. I fired when I saw her ribcage, and the venison was especially good. Again, a Scout would have been ideal, but my �inferior� rifle did fine. I suspect the big pile of brass I left on the training range had something to do with it...

Cooper preached making fast, solid hits with adequate cartridges. For what you�re doing in Florida, the 44 with a heavy cast bullet is definitely adequate. If you can hit once with it, you won�t need a followup shot.

Or a Scout scope.


Okie John

Yes it is a SIN to have the SUN looking over your shoulder when using a scout scope,,,,,,LOL,,, they are right next to each other on the keyboard ehhhh

I tried the scout scope, on a custom cutdown Browning BLR, and I found it not nearly as good as a tradition scope setup for hunting. The only advantage I see, is it's a good set up for a top ejection rifle, or one that you want to use stripper clips on. I doubt I ever mess with one again.

I have to say I am a big fan of the scout setup. They do take a little getting used to and are probably not for everyone but work great for me. I have had three a 45/70 marlin guide gun, a rossi pump 22mag, and a 9.3x62 p17. I shot a moose two years ago with the 9.3x62 at 280 yards. Even with a 2.5x scope shot placement wasn't a problem. The 22mag scout was the sheeeeit for hunting fox and coyotes behind dogs. There is nothing faster for moveing game.

I am not sure if these are swappable but similar platform...

http://www.ultimak.com/BuyMini.htm
http://www.amegaranges.com/

Probably the cheapest route for a bolt gun is a scout mount for the Rem 700 with sights made by B-square. I have seen it in the Brownells catalog but have no experience with it. http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1750&title=REMINGTON+700+SCOUT+MOUNT

Some pics in action that I found:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=202036

Moving game is what I hunt. In the southeastern part of the US we deer hunt with hounds. And this isn't open country. You need to locate, Identify, get on target and shoot in 3 to 4 seconds if you're lucky. This is mainly done with shotguns, but buckshot isn't as affective as a bullet at over 45 yards.

There is alot to concider with this type hunting beside the above. Safety is a major concern. When the deer hits a crossing, which is 80% of the time a dirt road or fire break, you never know if someone is about to round the corner. We try to always place a hunter on bends in the road, but this type of hunt is always on the move. We've had hunts start in one place and end 7 or more miles away. Thats another reason why I want this mounted on the 44 mag. instead of a 30-06. The Ruger semi auto carbine will provide the follow up shot with out launching a projectile 300 yards down the road, plus is easy to get in and out of a truck with. But I'm wondering if the scope or a good red dot would be a better choise for optics on a gun like this.

The Ruger Deerfield or 99/44 depending on the year it was made seems like a good fit. Short, fast and enough knock down power to be effective. Just not a large selection in scope mounts.

This isn't the standard hunting rifle, but this isn't the standard hunt.

Hoot

What about a Marlin 1894 in 44 mag with the scout mount. Not an auto but pretty fast none the less with some practice...

Does XS make a ghost ring for that gun?

For the quickest follow up shot, I think I'm gonna stick with the semi auto carbine. I wish someone would make a semi auto carbine in 454.

240 gr bullet at 100 yard would put out about 1200 foot pounds. Now thats a brush gun.