Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Muzzleloaders Reasons above 50

When I was a kid my dad got me a ML kit gun. 50 cal, percussion Hawken style from T/C.

Long since gone.

Now my son has developed an interest in flintlockes and the like.

Any real reason to go larger than 50 cal for deer/bear/fun shooting? Been poking around for a kit to do myself now and wondering what the advanced guys are doing these days regarding bore size.

It seems to me that the ML guys are trending towards 45cal for better ballistics and better moderate range hunting. I had a 54 cal Hawkin which was fun but doesn't do anything better than a 50 cal.

Stick with a 50-cal. Hard to find accessories for the 45s - 54s.

.610 really flattens them,

1800s Baker Flintlock

If just fun shooting and hunting deer and bears, then the 50 with roundballs would be very mild recoil and very effective.

I tend to like larger calibers and haven't had any issues getting my 58 roundballs shooting well.

Rather than get into a swamp of controversy here, let me suggest...if you are going to spend hundreds of dollars on this hobby, please....go to Beartooth Bullets Calculator, do your ballistics research before you shell out the money. Beartooth uses a different power value than foot pounds kinetic energy(which is nearly useless if not misleading) for round ball. I assume you will be using round ball because you mentioned flint ignition, which confines you to round ball or Ball-ets(twist rate).
Two things you need to take away from here, info about inline muzzleloading has no bearing whatsoever to traditional round ball shooting, none. Round ball as you research it, you will find bigger is better, EVEN with somewhat reduced muzzle velocity.

I have been informed the Beartooth calculator won't come up on a search. Not as good because they use ft/lbs energy...is 'ctmuzzleloaders', but quick and easy to use.

Rounball is the plan. What I shot as a kid too. Less than zero interest in in-line or "modern" ML.

I doubt recoil for any will be a real concern. I never noticed it when I was shooting 30 years ago, the son is 6' 180 and a former combat engineer- he can handle it. For him, history is the allure. Same for me but I'd prefer history that puts meat down.

Just noticed 90% of available gear is 50 cal, made me wonder why ppl buy larger.

Shoot them good and they'll all do fine. I've had great luck with the 58 but I'd shoot anything 50 or above with no worries. Gunsinternational sometimes has some really nice percussion guns for sale, worth keeping a watch on there. Track of the Wolf also gets some good guns in.

These are quality kits:

https://kiblerslongrifles.com/

If you are talking about a round ball rifle, you can kill deer with a 45 or 50 but 54 and 58 is where it’s at. People who are unfamiliar with flintlocks and muzzleloaders in general $hit themselves drooling over a 45 caliber barrel because they think it’s big. It’s really not, especially as a RB rifle. Most people btw will have no problems shooting a 58. Not a lot of recoil. Also, people will mistakenly tell you a 45 or 50 will shoot flatter then. 54 or 58. Not true at all. If you drive them as fast the bigger ball has a higher BC.

I had 54s all my life. This year I built a Kibler 45 SMR. It shoots fantastic, and the recoil is very mild. For paper I use 50G 3F, for fur 70G.
I ordered a new 54 Kibler, but the 45 might be in the truck the most.

Kibler is the plan

Got a 45 Seneca, 50 Hawken and 54 Renegade and Hawken. As the hole gets bigger the results get more dramatic (in a good way) in my little world.

54 SMR is an awesome rifle and excellent value.

For fun, deer and black bear, 50 is plenty. My Browning is a 54 and I’m pleased with it but a 50 would be fun too. Add in elk and, well, that wasn’t the question. 😁

I make them to earn most of my living and I have used them since the very early 70s to hunt too.

I shoot a 62 for the most part. I have killed a moose and a buffalo as well as several elk and deer and a few antelope with it.
The larger bore sizes for the flintlock era of arms simply shoot more lead and more powder. The moose I killed fell at the shot and the ball broke the shoulders and exited. A 62 cal ball (.600 actually ) weighs around 320 grains. I cast them from Wheel Weights so they don't flatten much and they go through everything I shoot as a rule.

So bore size with early slow rifling added ball weight. Bullets don't stabilize well in long slow twits barrels. I have made a few English style flinters rifled for bullets and they work very well, but the flash hole liners must be changed out about every 300 shots because the added pressure from a 400-450 grain bullet erodes the vents a lot faster. (I have one for sale right now in fact)

A big bore like a 62 looks huge, but remember balls are the lightest projectiles to fit in any given bore size. So a 66 cal (16 bore) is a 1 OZ gun. 437 grains is a lot of lead, but not much larger then most 45-70 bullets and less then some of the early 500 grain loads.

I also shoot a 50 and I have killed a lot of game with 50s, but they don't do the damage a 62 will do, or a 54, or a 58. Simple physics. The down side, just like with modern guns is recoil. A 62 kicks harder then a 58 or 54 or 50. You can make it kick no more than a 50 by using less powder, but that means less velocity and the larger slower ball is not really any more effect at that point. But if we have a MV of (let say) 1750 FPS for all guns obviously the heavier ball and larger charge of power is going to kick more. But with a 140 grain charge of 3F and a 320 grain ball my 62 cal flinter kicks no more then a 300 mag. Not "nothing" but not all that hard. A 58 is less, say 30-06. A 54 feels like a 300 savage and a 50 is around the same as a 30-30 in it's kick

Here is a pic of my 62. It's filled a lot of freezer space for me over the past few decades.
My Rifle 3 by Steve Zihn, on [bleep]

MrMuskie,

What bullet is that? Have a .62 Jaeger that a similar projectile would be really interesting in.

I don't have any expirience with flintlocks, having only ever used sidelock percussion guns. In my past muzzleloader rifle usage, there's been 45's, 50's and 54's (all Hawken style sidelocks) using conicals, mini-balls and PRB's. Also, Cap N' Ball revolvers, a T/C Scout 54cal pistol and a Pedersoli 10ga SxS muzzleloading shotgun for all of my shotgunning uses. I've primarily used Goex black, FFFg and FFg, and Pyrodex RS and P powders. Over the years, my accesment/opinion, from what I've used, the 54's just perform better (deer, black bear and pigs). Not saying the 45's and 50's don't work, because they obviously do. Anymore, I only use Goex FFFg, or FFg, in my 54 cal rifles and a patched round ball. Purely a personal preference decision, but really like the performance of what I use.

Enjoy!

Szihn, always appreciate your photos. Fine looking flinter there.

Thanks 30338.