Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns HANDGUNS AND BLACK BEAR

What do you guys carry in black bear country? When fishing in the High Sierra, I carry a stainless S&W 1911 in .45 ACP. I know it ain't the most powerful, but it's easy to carry, which is crucial. And with nine 230 grain Fed LE +P loads, I am sure it'll work if I can't bribe a black bear with a stringer of trout! BTW, black bears in the Mammoth Lakes area grow quite large, but then again they dine on trout and campground fare.

S&W Moutian gun, stainless 44 mag, 240 grain Hornady XTP over a bunch of 2400 (about 1200 fps).

BMT

Ruger 4 5/8" SBH 44 Mag with 240 Xtps usually in all 6 holes btu some days i run 3 XTPs and 3 240 Gr LSWC over a heavy dose of H110.

Only actually used my 44 on one bear and it was the 240 gr LSWC on a wounded bear that got up in some thick chit and at 35 yds =/- broadside it broke both shoulders and ended it right there

Glock 20-10mm with 15 rounds of Hornaday 180 JHP/XTP, plus a couple extra mags in the fanny pack

G20 or G29 with 15 (in the 20) or 12 (in the 29) rounds of Winchester SilverTip JHPs.

Not so many Blackies here in Florida as there used to be, but a LOT more than the Conservation folks will admit to.
The usual handgun with me when hunting is either a S&W Mountain Gun in .44 Mag, or a Ruger Black Hawk in .45 Colt.

I carry the .45 in a full flap holster I designed. I wear it over my shoulder, and it has a tie down strap to secure it to my belt. The holster rides a little below my chest, which keeps it clear of water and brush when I am wading around in a swamp. The load in this gun (this hunting season) is a Hornady 250 grain HP/XTP over 14 grains of Blue Dot. This load will go end to end on a pretty good sized hog, so I am sure it would work on a Black Bear as well.

Who made that holster for you?


Okie John

The holster was made about 8 years ago by two guys here in Gainesville. They had a biz called "Tactical Leather". I am not sure if they are still around though.
The way I designed it, the holster attaches to the strap with two "Chicago Screws". You can take the strap off, and wear the holster either cross draw, or strong side, as the belt loop on the back will work either way. I can post a pic of that if it would help.

Sam

Mando - welcome to the fire!

I don't worry to much about the black bears we have around here, but we do have other beasties that concern me when in the woods. Over the last several years, I have usually farried my 3" S&W model 60 with 158gr Gold Dots. I consider it to be barely sufficient for bear based on knowledge of friends who have killed bears with more or less the same thing (they all took a few hits to tip 'em over, BTW). I have considered carrying a 1911, just because it's so easy to carry and to shoot - but haven't done so yet. But I do think it's not the worst choice for your average black bear - given good choice in loads.

If I had an easily carried .44mag or .45 Colt or even a 10mm, that would be my choice. I used to work with a guy who routinely killed a bear or two every year with a 6" model 29. According to him, it never took more than a shot or two and they always fell pretty quickly. And this was back before we had all these premium bullets (he was not a handloader).

But for the near future, I will be probably be carrying a four inch .357 with 180gr cast flat points @ ~1400fps when in bear (lion, wolf...) country. Pretty sure that will do the job on anything I'm likely to encounter in my neck of the woods.

629, 4in. .44MAG topped with 300gr. WFNHC Beartooth bullets. Accurate in my gun and good velocity with a full compliment of H110 (MV = 1,250 fps).

Welcome to this forum....it has a wealth of information....you'll enjoy it.

FreeMe,

I do have a couple heavy frame revolvers in .357 Mag, & with 180 grain Buffalo Bore bullets it will work. When I bought my S&W 1911 I was looking at a Mountain Gun in .44 Mag. While this is a much better way to go in terms of lethality, carrying heavy revolvers while fishing is a pain in the butt, which is why I never, ever actually carried mine while fishing in known bear country, a stupid idea when fishing with my young son. But the .44 Mag is a much better way to go. I just have difficulty carrying heavy revolvers while fishing. And a 1911 on my hip is much better than a Mountain Gun in my truck! And my S&W 1911A1 is much more accurate than any .357 Mag I own or have shot, which translates to an excellent survival weapon.

When I decided upon a fishing gun, I knew that if I didn't carry it with me while fishing I would be better off spending my money on tackle. Therefore, I opted for the S&W 1911 in .45 ACP. I know there are much better rounds, but with 9 +P 230 grain rounds in a gun that is legendary to battery, I was on the right track. Therefore, I looked at the whole sport of high country fishing, especially ease of carry. Carrying a 1911A1 is as easy to the body as casting a lure to an Alpers (species of Sierra rainbow trout).

BTW, if the S&W 1911A1 came in 10MM I probably would have bought it; however, I am not convinced it is that much better a round than the +P 230 grain .45ACP.

magnumb,

Thanks. And there is no doubt that your bear protector is first rate! 300 grain .44 Mag bullets are excellent at close range for all North American game save big, big bears. Within 50 yards or so, that load will more than work on the largest of our antlered game.

Well, nothing' for sure, but we takes our best guesses and go with 'em!!

My guide in MT. told me last week, and actually showed me 2 of the recovered rounds, that he had to finish off a blackie at close range that his hunter had just wounded. He hit it 3 times in the nice white "V" in it's chest at only 4 or 5 yards then it veered past him at touching distance and he put another one in his shoulder. Groans aren't a sure sign of death in his or my book so he walked up to it and shot it in the back of the head. He did this with his Taurus .41 MAG, 4in. using Winchester factory loads, I believe, Supreme's, HP's of some sort. Not sure, but the recovered bullets were perfectly expanded with nice, sharp barbs in each pettle. These 2 bullets looked picture book perfect. The problem, in his estimation and mine, they were more man stoppers than bear stoppers because they never penetrated enough to do the job quickly. From what I saw, they'd be great deer-on-down bullets, to include the 2-legged variety.

Perhaps someone here knows of which bullet I'm describing. Not saying the .41 Mag is insufficient in any way, but as with most things, better made for specific duties, results in better endings.

My guide was carrying a .454 on our trip......with big, heavy HC's in the cylinder.......go figure.

Mando,

If your 1911 is all-steel, fully loaded it weighs about the same as a Mountain Gun - probably more. The 1911 does pack flatter and "feels" lighter on the hip.

I'd go the revolver route, but in a K-frame .357 Mag. A guy can accomplish a lot of stuff with a revolver and a handful of different ammo - more than a semi-auto can dream of. The versatility is tough to ignore.

JOG,

You're right, it terms of weight they're nearly identical. However, in ease of carry, for me there ain't no comparison. It seems that John Moses Browning had me in mind when he came up with the design of the 1911A1.

Regarding ammo, there might be a slight edge to a .357 Mag revolver when compared to the .45 ACP in terms of versatility; however, most shooters find one bullet weight and stick with it. I am no exception. Hence, with the .45 ACP the 230 grain is legendary as a bipedal defensive weapon and the same load will work on black bears. In the .357 Mag I like 158 grain loads for bipedal defense and 180 solid lead for big critters; hence, I would have to use two loads for trail use. So for me, the 1911A1 fills the bill in every category, ease of carry, speed to battery, a weapon that was designed for combat, and powerful enough for its intended purpose. But I can't find fault with the K-Frame .357 Mag. I guess it all boils down to preference.

I can't emphasize enough that for my build, the 1911A1 is exceptionally easy for me to carry. I never once carried any revolver while fishing because they are so damn bulky on my side. This year I might just get a small of back holster and get my S&W 1911 completely out of the way of my casting.

The .357 mag is a damn versatile round though, maybe the best there is in that category. It is a damn good choice for a survival weapon. It will routinely take deer-sized game within reasonable ranges. And it's pretty darn good for self-defense. The benefit of the .357 Mag is that recoil is manageable so that follow-up shots on target are easier compared with the blast of full-power magnum loads of larger calibers. With .38 Special loads, it's a cheap and comfortable to shoot all day long. I do love 4" barreled S&W .357 Mag revolvers. But I love the 1911A1 even more. But that's probably why there are so many different handgun/cartridge combo's, because we all have different tastes!


Good shootin',

M

Mando,

You make good points. Most shooters do find one bullet weight and stick with it - myself included. A good field handgun is my exception. I might want to plink, use birdshot, hunt small game with wadcutters, and if need be shoot a fireball at something larger.

There are plenty of wolves and bears around here, but I've never felt threatened by one. All the while I've fired thousands of rounds at other stuff. The other stuff has evolved into my reason to carry the field gun in the first place, with a bear/wolf load available for after dark.

My most common field gun is a .22 revolver (S&W M63). Ammo-wise I take the same approach - subsonics, cheap standard loads, and hi-vels. Kinda fun.

JOG,

I actually live in black bear country, although I have only seen one. However, there have been plenty of documented attacks on humans by black bears just mere miles from where I live. Because I live in the greater LA area, bears up here have lost all fear of humans.

I have seen black bears in the Mammoth Lakes area of the High Sierra, and while I, blessedly, have not been threatened by one, with my kids in tow, it would only take one wayward bear to ruin lives.

BTW, my favorite self-defense gun is a 1911A1, and I have seen plenty of bipedal vermin up where I live. Sadly, I also felt insecure due to a tweaker who invaded a fishing spot at which my young son and I were fishing in Bishop Creek Canyon. Sadly, with CA gone broke, I doubt I have seen a game warden up there maybe twice in all the years and times I've fished Bishop Creek. I have never seen an Inyo County deputy up there. And I'd bet there are a lot of outlaws hiding out in the High Sierra.

JOG

funny, the Model 63 is what I pack when hiking, or scouting. My 63 has the 4 inch barrel, and it makes a good squirrel and rabbit gun when loaded with CCI Mini Mags.

To answer your first question, I carry a 250-gr. SWC @ 1,000 fps in either a 4" Smith 29-2 or a 5" Smith Classic 629. Next choice is a semi-custom 1911 loaded with 230-gr. Hornady flat-point FMJ.

To answer the second, yes, I'd like to see a picture of the back of that holster.


Okie John

Mannlicher,

The M63 is one of the great ones. The S&W brain trust discontinued it and then brought it back with a goofy 5-inch barrel. No wonder gun companies struggle.

What holster do you use? I'm a lefty so my holster choices are limited, especially since the M63 is an odd size. I use a Bianchi 5BHL and I like it well enough, except I wish it had a covered trigger guard.