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I also yank heavy loads. But I have no advice.

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Originally Posted by Mountain10mm
Originally Posted by funshooter
Originally Posted by Mountain10mm
Originally Posted by funshooter
I have been a Structural Steel Welding and Bolting inspector for 34 years and in Commyfornia with all of the Earth Quake crap they frown very heavily of the use of a Grade 8 bolt for Structural use.
I have seen Engineers spec out Grade 8 bolts but not very often.
They do not like brittle bots for Structural use due to the Shock values.

Just my opinion but pulling a trailer with the bumps and humps in the road.
That may create Shock on the Hitch pins

Structural bolts are almost exclusively used in shear. The shear strength of a grade 8 is higher than grade 5, and provides a higher shear strength value for the connection. Period. That being said, the bolt may not be the weak link - so using a stronger bolt might not gain any overall connection strength. There is no "bending" of a bolt in structural shear connection. Failure modes in steel are almost all catastrophic. The bolt shears, or the steel tears out in chunks (block shear). Seismic design requires the steel members not the connections, to yield and absorb the seismic energy. When a contractor complains about grade 8 bolts, it's because of the expense and availability, or lack there of.


Structural bolts like A325 and A490 are used as a clamp in most cases anymore
Yes they have shear values but it is the Tension (Clamping Forces) that Engineers Calculate over the shear values
That is why they Tension bolts in buildings instead of just having wrench tight bolts
Think of a C Clamp holding something together. An Structural Bolt just does it from the inside instead of the out side.

i have used A325 bolts as a Hitch pin in a pinch when I could not find a hitch pin in the moment.

You are correct. That's called a slip critical connection. And the strength value of the connection is directly proportional to the "tightness" of the bolt. The tightness is about 70% of the bolts tensile strength with is based on the same psi strength value of the metal as the shear strength (oversimplification but good enough). Higher strength bolt = more tightness = stronger connection.


Yes
But the original Poster was asking about hitch pins.

I was trying to explain about Brittle verses Malleable steels for Hitch pins.

Not Tension type Connections.

Shear shock a grade 8 bolt then Shear shock a grade 5 bolt.
You may be surprised on the result.
I have witnessed both.

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Originally Posted by BC30cal
Edit to add;
After the storage business shut down, I worked a year for a Big 3 auto dealer and was somewhat perplexed how often they'd sell a customer a pickup that was not going to be able to pull what they wanted to.

For that matter, some of the RV dealerships sold trailers to people that were too big for their little SUV to pull safely on our mountain roads, but we saw far too much of that as well.

Dwayne, I feel your pain. I don't think concern about undersized tow vehicles is limited to BC. The US is cursed with the same people who think their F150 and 4Runner is appropriate for towing a 30' toy-hauler into the mountains. I know this personally because I routinely get stuck behind them, I'm usually car number 82 or more in that line of backed-up vehicles. It's a rare sighting to see any tow vehicle outside of agriculture and construction that is properly sized by the owner for the toys they are pulling.

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You would be very hard pressed to shear a hitch pin in two places at the same time.


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Originally Posted by Mountain10mm
Originally Posted by BC30cal
Edit to add;
After the storage business shut down, I worked a year for a Big 3 auto dealer and was somewhat perplexed how often they'd sell a customer a pickup that was not going to be able to pull what they wanted to.

For that matter, some of the RV dealerships sold trailers to people that were too big for their little SUV to pull safely on our mountain roads, but we saw far too much of that as well.

Dwayne, I feel your pain. I don't think concern about undersized tow vehicles is limited to BC. The US is cursed with the same people who think their F150 and 4Runner is appropriate for towing a 30' toy-hauler into the mountains. I know this personally because I routinely get stuck behind them, I'm usually car number 82 or more in that line of backed-up vehicles. It's a rare sighting to see any tow vehicle outside of agriculture and construction that is properly sized by the owner for the toys they are pulling.


The same as selling Hitch's designed to Fail.
The Aluminum Hitch's can get Cyclic fatigue and crack.
Make no sense to me to put people on the road at risk higher than already with people that do not pay attention while driving.
Add a trailer to the equation and faulty products and the stage is set.

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Originally Posted by kolofardos
I also yank heavy loads. But I have no advice.

Pulled a loaded semi out with the excavator twice on Friday.

Pulled out the 3/4 ton Dodge and the skid steer yesterday. The half ton and the skid steer twice this morning.

I also have no advice. A 1” rope and a 3/8” logging chain both worked just fine. The front receiver for the semi, fwiw, has a standard pin. At 80K gross everything held as I moved the front end around and got her out of the snow bank.

I reckon a 4 runner would hold, as well. But, I guess those Toyotas are extra tough…..


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Originally Posted by BC30cal
gunchamp;
Good afternoon to you sir, thanks for the reply.

My goodness I'll just imagine you've "seen some things" then in the RV service business.

For a couple years I managed a fair sized indoor and outdoor storage facility where we stored boats, RV's, classic and exotic autos.

Here in BC up until a couple years ago one could waddle into an auto dealership, buy a new pickup and get a 5th wheel hitch installed and then buy the biggest RV on the market and legally terrorize the highways with a regular Class V driver's license. A couple years back the powers that be decided that if the trailer exceeded 4600kg then the driver needed an upgraded license which includes some training.

Yes indeed though, the "average" person out west here who retires having never driven anything bigger than a Camry, then deciding to become a snowbird... well sir when you say "anything you can possibly imagine"... I can imagine a wee bit!!! laugh

There were a couple local RV dealers who I had a really good working relationship with their service departments since more than a handful needed their services.

Thanks for the information, the chuckle and the memories.

All the best.

Dwayne

Edit to add;
After the storage business shut down, I worked a year for a Big 3 auto dealer and was somewhat perplexed how often they'd sell a customer a pickup that was not going to be able to pull what they wanted to.

For that matter, some of the RV dealerships sold trailers to people that were too big for their little SUV to pull safely on our mountain roads, but we saw far too much of that as well.
We have a body shop and we are normally scheduled out 3 months+ due to mostly first timers haha. Not always their fault though. I had a couple come through with a fleetwood motorhome that blew a tire. We supposed to be a simple estimate, until they told me that they didnt have power inside. I got under the mh and found that when the tire blew, the tread beat a hole through the floor and grabbed the main wiring run for all the interior coach wiring. Ripped all the wiring out of the walls and ceiling and had it wrapped up around the axle. My tech loved me for bringing that one in to the shop lol

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No way is a 4Runner breaking a hitch pin, or a Grade 5 bolt, or a Grade 8 bolt.

Carry on with the over-thinking.

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Rub the receiver in a slurry of road salt, sand, and water. Slide it in and let the chemical reaction take place. They can be quite miserable to remove.




That was tongue-in-cheek that anyone in the rustbelt will understand.


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Originally Posted by White_Bear
Rub the receiver in a slurry of road salt, sand, and water. Slide it in and let the chemical reaction take place. They can be quite miserable to remove.




That was tongue-in-cheek that anyone in the rustbelt will understand.
Yeah, seen that a few times. Nephew's hitch wouldn't budge with a good yank with the chain wrapped around a 16" box elder.


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Originally Posted by Bristoe
You could go with a grade 12.9 5/8" SHCS. (socket head cap screw) such as is used in machine shop assemblies.

My gut feeling is, you'll spin the tires bald on a 4Runner before you shear a 5/8" grade 12.9 SHCS.

A 4 runner ain’t snapping no 5/8 grade 8 bolt.



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Yes, BTDT !!!


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Broke a pin hooking the cylinder to the fold down stabilizer leg on a Prentice loader,
the boss ran to the hardware and bought a couple grade 8 bolts. Getting the right pins
was a couple hour deal.

Broke them quick. At lunch he got their last grade 8, and a couple 5s.
The 8 broke, a 5 stayed in the rest of the week.

An earlier poster hit the nail on the head.
The 8s just snapped, too hard in shear.
The 5 deformed, it had to be hammered out, but it didn't snap.




PS. I was glad to get a real pin. Loading on the downhill side, reaching out for
a heavy log....your Sitting on Top of The Loader Ass will pull seat stuffings
when the lower stabilizer let's go. A truck suspension isn't very strong
under those conditions.


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Originally Posted by Pat85
Originally Posted by Bristoe
You could go with a grade 12.9 5/8" SHCS. (socket head cap screw) such as is used in machine shop assemblies.

My gut feeling is, you'll spin the tires bald on a 4Runner before you shear a 5/8" grade 12.9 SHCS.

A 4 runner ain’t snapping no 5/8 grade 8 bolt.
We move campers with forklifts. We have a 1", thick steel plated bolted to the forks with 4 large grade 8 bolts. They have sheared in the past when a side load was forcefully applied. I promise you a 4 runner can break them in the correct situation

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Originally Posted by Rock Chuck
Originally Posted by SamOlson
I ordered up the stuff to make two of these setups.


Pin, shackle and shackle block all made in the USA.



[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]
The block says 13k, the pin is 20k+. Is that a 1/2" shackle? If so, it's probably near 20k breaking strength. So, the block is the weak link. If that isn't enough, you likely need a heavier hitch. It's certainly more than the OP's 4Runner can handle.



It's a 3/4" shackle.


Our feed pickups weigh about 13,000lbs loaded so I tried to find the strongest setup. No mud yet so haven't tested them out.

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Did that high rise apt building in San Fran ever get fixed?


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I make my own Hitch Pins out of Cold Rolled Round rod.
They do not break at least I have not had one break yet.
I have bent several but not to bad to be able to tap them out of the receiver with a hammer.
They rust up a bit when sitting in the Weather

I am to Cheep to pay the price for store bought Hitch Pins.

Cut the length you want them. Drill a hole in each end Spin a taper on one end and put a large Key Ring for pulling on the other end.

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I've been using 5/8ths socket head cap screws and a couple nuts forever


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A local blacksmith made pins of blue steel rod, with a loop bent on the end, he ground them to a point.


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Originally Posted by wabigoon
A local blacksmith made pins of blue steel rod, with a loop bent on the end, he ground them to a point.
He leave them annealed or harden and temper?


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