Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Lathe question

When you buy your lathe get one large enough with a spindle bore large to pass any barrels thru. Keep in mind that some are much larger than you need and you will not find them as comfortable to work over as one just the right size.. I have a nardini 12x30 which does all I need and I believe an 1 5/8 spindle bore. At times I wish it wa a 12x40. The nardini is high precision machine. Also you may find some or many that are a three phase motor. Can make them cheaper than a single phase. It is pretty easy to convert from three phase to single phase. Can put together the third leg of three phase from a home made phase converter. I did it myself so it can’t be too difficult.

A Heavy 10 in the same category as a Monarch, give me a break. You can do excellent chambering work on them with the sleeved headstock bushings adjusted properly. Tell me what bed wear has to do with chambering accuracy? When you turn a tenon you are only using about 1" of travel and the same in threading? 99% of folks use the tailstock to push a floating or pusher style reamer holder and bed wear has no effect on this.

Butch, stop making so much sense, buddy.

Hope you're doing well, my friend. -Al

Uh, no they don't. Though maybe OK, no experienced machinist will call the H10 "one of the best". It is nowhere near the top of the food chain. And, while an experienced machinist might be able to do precision work on one, he will likely have to work for it. Comparing it with a Monarch is a joke. Mine is a 10EE, perhaps not the best size for gunsmithing, but very precise and well made.

Be still my beating heart. Nice, pal!

I got a Feeler clone of a Hardinge HLVH inch/metric a couple years ago… sure makes working in tenths easy <g>. I had an ongoing job that required two bearing pockets fairly deep in a large casting, and I had my tricks to nail them within the required couple tenths on the Webb, but it would’ve been easy on the Feeler… but it never could’ve swung ‘em. Had to take the gap out of the Webb to do that work.

Production machining for money is a whole other universe from chambering. Production stuff requires all parts of the machine to be in adequate spec at all times because you never know what you’ll need to do. Chambering is basically a very finicky setup, with expensive material, followed by a relatively straightforward threading and reaming sequence. It’s not “easy” but it certainly doesn’t really push a machine to its limits- especially the bed ways.

I have this notion of trying it on the Feeler next time just because threading on an HLV type machine is so elegant and easy. However, a) my reamer holder won’t fit the tailstock taper and b) the HLVH doesn’t go as slowly as you’d want for reaming. Reaming is basically a major “form cut” and as the size of the “form” goes up, RPM’s go down… a guy could set up an HLV with multiple VFD’s (it has 3 separate electric motors) to slow it down but, meh.

Well, I guess the machinists and hobbyists I have talked to have misinformed me on the quality of the Heavy 10 machines? So, you guys with Monarchs don't seem to think the Heavy 10s are good enough for a home hobbyist to do gun work or????? Not sure I would worry too much about guys running out to buy a Monarch any time soon, but I would think for 99% of what most machinists will do the Heavy 10 would be more than sufficient and they are built very well. Most professional machinists won't be buying their own machines IMO anyway, so I'm guessing most of them will be working on the machine they are supplied with and that will almost never be a Monarch from machine shops I have done electrical work in over the years.

For those of you who can afford a Monarch or equivalent machine I envy your machines but deep pockets doesn't in itself make one a machinist any more than any particular machine does. I've seen guys with Atlas machines do some pretty darned nice work once they have them set up properly.

"One of the best" they aren't.


Thanks. I would have been happy with the Hardinge too; was looking for one when the Monarch presented itself to me.

How do you like your Sheldon? I picked up an EXL-56B a year or so ago, and I'm just now starting to mess around with the thing...I built a steel table for it, next project is to add a VFD. I have a rotary converter in the shop for 3ph, but I think VFD's are much better option.

I would have been happy with a Monarch! Although the power supply complexity stuff is a bit daunting.

This one popped up at the perfect time and is in excellent shape and being an inch/metric machine is awesome because I do lots of metric threading on small parts. If you’ve never threaded on a HLV, be sure to try it if you get the chance. The Newark DRO is pretty sweet. The lathe itself is quiet but the RPC isn’t.



This is the spider I made for the back of the spindle of my Webb. It’s held on with two sets of 4 screws…… talk about a pain to get it perfectly (sic) concentric, which was only necessary for craftsmanship reasons, but once done MAN is it useful for stuff way beyond gun work. For example I have an adjustable work stop I insert through the rear of the spindle and is held by that chuck that works great for the type of work I do- typically batches of parts in the 20-200 range. Having a really repeatable work stop on a working lathe is really handy and enables some great work flows. Honestly- I can’t say enough good things about the Webb/Whacheon/Hwacheon WL-435. They are fantastic lathes. Kind of a great combo of old-school “big iron” but with modern spindle speeds (IE for carbide) which a lot of otherwise awesome old heavy iron won’t do. That just a plastic slug I keep in it when not in use so the screws won’t back out and go flying.

Thanks for the info guys. Much appreciated. Had no idea so many guys had lathes.

You could do good work on a Heavy 10. Run any prospective machine you might buy at all speeds and through all the gears in the threading gearbox. Run the carriage the full length of the bed, both by hand and under power. Run the carriage crossfeed by hand and under power. Listen and feel for rhythmic clicks or throbs- most machines have been crashed at some point(s) which can result in a damaged gear tooth (clicks) in the threading gearbox or elsewhere… or a bent shaft (throb) somewhere. It happens. Doesn’t mean the machine is toast but a good thing to know about before buying rather than after.

It amazes me how often the lathe is needed. Though I always wanted a mill and a lathe, it wasn't until I was in my 70's that I finally got them and taught myself how to use them. Still learning.

I'm just a hobbyist so my review may not be as reliable as some here who use machines for a living but I did a bit of research before buying a lathe and then this Sheldon KFQU popped up out of the blue for very short money so I bought it. It is a machine built in the late 40's or early 50's when they had a reputation for being a great and very accurate machine. However, do some research on Sheldon lathes before you buy a used one. Some of the later models had a not so sterling reputation and tended to break down a bit. Finding parts will be next to impossible, though there is a guy on Home Shop Machinist who used to work for Sheldon and still makes parts for some of the machines and sells them on the site.

All that being said, I like this machine a lot and I am still learning how to make use of it. I made a lot of bushings, and other pieces for my hotrod and other projects when I first got it and turned a few barrels , among other things. The headstock bearings and gears are still available if I remember correctly and used parts come up on ebay often. I don't think mine was ever a production machine so it is still very accurate and solid. Be careful of the units with the legs with rounded tubes. Most of these were built for military contracts and were carried in heavy trucks and used for battlefield repairs and machine work . Also some ship board machine work from what I heard, but can't verify. They got beat up pretty good for the most part from what I understand unless you find one that was never issued.

Anyway, check out online info about them and the forum on Sheldon lathes on The Home Shop Machinist site...

If I had the cash and a real need a Hardinge, Monarch, or even a Nardini would be sitting in my shop as I had chances to buy each of them. But for my uses I couldn't justify the cost...

Bob

Yup, everyone saying I am a dumbass about my opinion on the Southbend Heavy 10 is probably right. When I saw the question I initially assumed the OP was asking for a mid level machine for some home machining projects like a lot of us. Anyone looking for a Monarch or roughly equal machine probably wouldn't be asking here for input, right? And to me, the Heavy 10 is a pretty darned good machine for us home machinists and hobbyists from all the research I've done on these on several forums and buddies who are machinists. I still think that for those of us who need a hobby machine the Heavy 10 is right up there in a reasonable price and utility point to do some pretty good work without investing in a professional machine...

How about this- list a few machines that are in the category of the Heavy 10 type machines that might be as useful for what guys like us may use them for- barrel work, chambering, making tools, bushings, etc....

Here is a small list of machines that most guys could afford for home hobbyist work
Atlas
Craftsman (models almost identical to the Atlas machines and also larger machines basically identical to a Heavy 10)
Sheldon
Jet
Southbend

There are tons more...

For the hobbiest, there are many, many lathes that will give you good service and results. Very good work can and is being done with very modest equipment.

You might want to find a machine tool business in your area that specializes in rehoming lathes, mills, etc. In most cases, these machines are up and running and have tooling. A friend of mine is in that business and the quality of stuff that comes in is pretty impressive. He specializes in high performance engine shop stuff but there's always lots of stuff he either knows about or can connect you with.

Good shootin' -Al

http://jamisonequipment.com/

A lathe is the only tool that can make parts to fix itself. If you also have a mill. -Al

I don't think I posted that a H10 couldn't do a good job, it just ain't the quality of my 10EE. I do my chambering on my Clausing 6913. Somebody said they couldn't get their lathe slow enough for chamber reaming? How slow do you think you need to go. I have a Grizzly 0709 lathe. It is heavy and works very well, but is awkward for me to use.

Actually a knee mill also amazes at how often it becomes useful. And it really goes hand in hand with a lathe.

Mine is an ancient Index Super 55 (photo). Also shown is the very first part I made on it: an end fitting for a 4" diameter sailboat boom. I had never operated a mill before, so this was a great challenge for this old man.

Awesome work, pal !

Very nicely done!

Between rifle stuff and race car fab, the mill keeps me busy.





Good shootin' -Al