Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa 9mm Mauser

Good morning,

Does anyone have experience with this round (also know as 9x57)? I am told it was similar to the 358 Winchester? Thank you for your time.

John

I have a 358 Winchester and make my brass from 308 Winchester brass. The two cases should be pretty similar but I would guess that using 7X57 brass for yours will result in slightly less case capacity perhaps between the 358 Winchester and the 35 Remington. Knowing the guys on this group, there is somebody that has the exact round and will be able to give you lots of better information.

I would think that the 9mm Mauser would have a greater case capacity than a .358, and would be close to a .338-06 or .35 Whelan. It ought to be a nice round for elk-sized game in Africa.

JohnL,

I do have a 9x57 Mauser. Cases are easy to make by necking up 8x57. I suppose that one could also neck down 9.3x57 case, but I haven't tried it becasue 8x57 are far more pleniful and cheaper, as well. The biggest problem is bullets. The 9x57 typically has a bore diameter of .356. Most all bullets available are .358". I have bumped them down using a Lee bullet sizing die and Lee Alox lube. But lubing with Imperial sizing die wax works noticeably better.

Muledeer, who post here also is currently working with one. the9.3Guy

Rolly, CAhunter and 9.3guy,

Thanks for replying. I don't have a rifle chambered in 9x57 yet, but I know where one is for sale and I'm getting that feeling again. Apparently, there was an article in AFRICAN HUNTER magazine - Vol. 8, No. 6, 2002. Does anyone have access to this article that can send it to me - either by e-mail as an attachment or to my fax - 602-993-4392. I appreciate it!

John

I do have a 9x57, and am about to have another one...yes, I do like it! My current rifle is a 1908 vintage commercial Mauser, which is going to stay original. The one I have on the way is drilled and tapped, so will be a perfect candidate for a Leuppie 3X. It will be restocked to more-or-less match the original Oberndorf stock configuration, with somewhat less drop at heel to facilitate scope use. (Old eyes, dontcha know...) My Mauser handles .358 bullets just fine, but I have some bumped-down bullets to try too, thanks to 9.3 Guy, who is either facilitating my research or enabling my habits...

I've worked my way up to about 2200 fps with 200 gr Hornady RN bullets and IMR 4320, in resized Remington 8x57 brass. No signs of pressure, so I'll keep moving up. It would appear that 2400-2500 with 200 gr and 2250-2350 with 250's is feasible. I'm sticking with round-nose bullets -- mostly because they look right and work well at the velocities I'm striving for. Within 250 yards or so, going to spitzer bullets wouldn't gain me enough trajectory advantage to make it worthwhile.

I'd love to see the article in African Hunter -- please post how to gain access -- or email it to me if you get it and can. Or PM me and I'll send you a FAX number.

Great old cartridge -- I think Remington should bring it out in the next 700 Classic, since they used to sell the 9mm Remington, a cartridge designed to work in either the 9x56 Mannlicher or the 9x57 Mauser.

My vote is to go for the rifle if you have a bead on one -- reloading is pretty easy and not just every hahnyock has one. Oh...Midway has Redding dies for about $50.

Muledeer,

Thanks for your input. I will seriously consider the 9x57 rifle. My problem is that I'm looking at 3 different rifles right now. I could buy all three but divorce can be expensive.

John

Divorces aren't expensive...it's all the costs before and after them that add up...!

I generally go for the phased approach. "Honey, I needed this to go with that, because I didn't have one of these." Followed by tolerant smile and small head shake.

Is the rifle you're looking at an original commercial Mauser?

JohnL: I have no experience with this at all, but, I do have an old 'HANDBOOK for Shooters and Reloaders" by Parker O. Ackley (hardbound copy by the way) which lists it, and loads. It states: "The 9x57 is also known as the 9mm and the 9mm Mannlicher. This is a very old cartridge quite similar to the present day "wildcat" .35 Whelen except that it is somewhat shorter than the Whelel and somewhat longer than the .35 Remington. Cares are very easily made fin one operation from .30/06 by using a suitable forming die which is availabe from any of hte loading die manufadturers." It lists HiVel#2, 3031, 4064 and 4895 with 200 grain bullets; HiVel#2 4895 and 4064 with the 220 grain bullet; 3031, 4064 and 4895 with the 250 grain bullet; and 4064 with the 275-280 grain bullets. With a standard twist 1x14 inch barrel it lists a top velocity with the 250 grain bullet of 2,500 fps. I don't know if that is a misprint or what, but at that velocity, you would have a muzzle energy of 3.470 fpe. The book does show two other loads in the 250 grainer going 2,400 fps, which would give it just about 3,200 fpe. The text goes on to state: "This cartirdge has been manufactured in the United States in the days past, and it is still very popular in other countries throughout the world. actually this isw a very hard cartridge to beat for brush shooting, being quite similar or a little better than the currently manufactured .358 Winchester." Hope this helps. Tom Purdom <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Tom,

Could you please post the loads for IMR-4895 and IMR-4064 from the Ackley book? I only have Vol. II and they are not listed in there, so I conclude you are referring to Vol. I.

Loading data for the 9x57 seems to be quite scarce. I shot mine yesterday. Did not chrono the loads. Mostly because I am more concerned with accuracy and pressure at the moment. I started with 43.0 gr. of IMR-4064 and worked up to 45.0. No visible pressure signs. Accuracy was about 2 min. @ the proverbial 100 yds. Recoil seemed about on a par with the .35 Whelan. Thanks, the9.3Guy

JohnL I know the feeling I'm looking at # rifles right now myself; 1) Browning Trophy Custom in7mm w/ an octagon barrel for $750. 2) Savage 116 Safari Express in 300 win mag $549. and 3) a custom wildcat 366 D.G.W. based on a CZ550 Safari Magnum.

You can always do like I do when I want a new gun I buy her a diamond makes her smile and she forgets about the guns <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

9 3Guy: I'll just post all the loads. The book was first published in 1962 in first printing and mine is from the second printing in 1963. A lot of neat stuff in there.


200 gr bullet 43gr HiVel#2 powder 2200 fps
44 3031 2185
45 4064 2165
45 4895 2240
220 42gr HiVel#2 powder 2150
44 4895 2085
44 4064 2100
250 42 3031 powder 2075
51 3031 2500
43 4064 2060
50 4064 2400
52 4895 2400
275-280 42 4064 2000
46 4064 2160

I TAKE ABSOLUTELY NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR THESE LOADS! Tom Purdom <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hey Guys,

I was just reading your posts about the 9x57 Mauser and I have requested that file so we can include it with our next update to the website. I can't give you a timeframe, but it will be a couple of weeks. I've had a flurry of technical problems recently, but that's the way it is in cyberspace.

This caliber has a reputation as a good bushveldt plains game cartridge, provided the proper bullets are used. This is not a problem for us in modern times, but hampered it's performance in the old days. It is claimed that some rifles can shoot regular .358 bullets without swaging down and get good accuracy, but I'm not telling that for the truth. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Alan

Tom,

Thanks so much for posting those loads. I have a veritable library on guns and reloading and I could find very little on the 9x57. All I can say is anyone who can shoot 50 gr. of IMR-4064 with 250 gr. bullets has got to be a relative of Elmer Keith. I guess I am going to have to break out the Ohler. I'd like to get at least 2350 f.p.s. with the 250 gr. bullet. But after yesterday, I am not sure my shoulder can take it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> After about 100 rounds between the 9x57, the 8mm-06 AI and the .300 Whizzum, my shoulder looks like the proverbial rainbow today. I mean, I am usually not a wuss for recoil, but by the end of the day, I was starting to grit my teeth in anticipation. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ...the 9.3Guy

You are most certainly welcome 9 3Guy. I just popped in on this forum for the heck of it since Africa is out of the question for me (health and money you know!). I am trying to talk my little brother into a CZ 550 Full Stock in 9.3x62. He has a CZ 550 Full Stock in 7x57mm and loves it. We're taking it pig hunting in Junction, Texas, in a couple of weeks, him with his CZ 550 Full Stock in 7x57mm, me with my CZ 550 American in 7x57mm, and Tom George with his Model 70 Featherweight in what else, but 7x57mm Mauser. Should be KICK! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Great bunch of posts! I'm still mulling the rifle over but now I have some loads to consider if I take the plunge.
Muledeer - I'm actually looking at a German double rifle in this caliber. And by the way, my wife figured out the phased approach long ago.
366DGW - diamonds are a good idea - I like the bribery angle.

It's good to see so many folks interested in this caliber out there. Unfortunately, it may be a while before I can get the 9mm Mauser rifle as I just bought a Deluxe BSA Enfield sporter in 375 Express.

So many guns, so little time.

John

JohnL


my 9x57 was a 9x57R double rifle by Gastinne Rennete (not sure how to spell that) the Paris maker of duelling pistols. Hammerfless boxlock ejector. It was thirty years ago, forget my loads, but they were with 250 grain Hornady.
Shot a big deer on Anticosti Island right through a one foot thick tree, so I was perfectly well satisfiedl

miki

...great site...great stories...thanks...

Hey JohnL,

A simple update turned into a major project, but the results have been well worth the effort. However, I did not forget about your 9x57 information request. Here is a link directly to that article, but be sure and check out the rest of the site while you are there.

http://www.african-hunter.com/9x57_mauser.htm



Hey ThomasEdwards,

Thanks for your comments. The staff at African Hunter magazine appreciates a little positive feedback once in a while.

Cheers,

Alan

Thanks Alan - great article on the 9x57 - your site looks great too. I may have to subscribe to the magazine based on the articles in the latest issue. I've been hesitant because of the perceived distance and time it looks like it takes to get an issue. What are the facts about this?

John