Home Forums Birds & Dogs Shotguns Point of impact

I just bought a 12 ga SXS by a well known maker. Took it to the range to test some loads, and found it centering the patterns 12 inches to the left with both bbls. I was shooting from a bench at a measured 25 yds. Tried a couple differant choke tubes. I have patterned my Win 21, and 2 Drillings the same way so I don't think its me. Waiting to hear back from the maker, its only been a couple days since I emailed the pics, but was just wondering if anyone has any thoughts. My first idea was it maybe the stock ? Any ideas would be a help.

If you consciously lined up the beads and aimed at the patterning board, there’s a problem

If not and you shot the board by mounting and shooting, the stock may not have enough cast off if you’re right-handed

Turkish gun?

Shooting off a bench and being a foot off at 25 yards is a major regulation issue. Or the stock isn’t even close to a decent fit, and it would be hard to not pick up on that with the first mount. Especially for an experienced shooter.

Would be interested in who the well known is. Would be rare for a well known to be that far off on regulation.

If you’re aiming it from a bench, like a rifle, then the stock shouldn’t matter much, since you’d be looking right down the center of the rib. A foot at 25yds is a lot. I mean like a cross dominant eye thing.

For wingshooting, I ‘d skip the bench and shoot the patterning board. Smoothly mount and shoot like you would on a flying target. Determining POI trumps patterning for the wingshooter. And shave off the beard (just guessing in that). 😁

Plus, your M21 is no doubt causing you the problem. Get rid of it immediately. I will send you the shipping address.

Gun problem and not the stock. Regulation issue. Had a Benelli like that. Hopefully the manufacturer takes better care of you than benelli did me.

American gun. I first noticed it at a ham shoot, offhand of course, then took it to the bench, sitting , elbows on the bench, not rested on anything like a rifle rest. I want to give them a chance , then I will report good or bad service. My beard is a recoil reducer LOL. Thanks for the replies.

Current production Made in America SxS leaves only one maker that I can think of....

CSMC

It is CSMC, They have been advertising on their site for a while a Fox A grade series that they made foe Savage Arms and I read some reviews that sounded good, and based on their reputation I bought a 12 ga. BIG MISTAKE ! I can get no satisfaction from them, every time I call I get stonewalled. When I ask to speak to a higher up I get a voice mail, and when I call back I'm blocked. They are located about an hour away, but have no store hrs so I can't drive there. The main store , Galazan, is in Greenwich, about three and a half hours away. The salesman is never available as they screen all the calls. This is so frustrating as getting a lawyer over a $3200. shotgun is not cost effective. Looking back, when the gun came to my LGS I noticed no warranty papers or bill of sale, but it was everything I wanted, felt good in my hands,and I couldn't wait to shoot it. Been an unhappy situation ever since. I have never been treated so badly, and let me say I was in sales myself for over 40 years, 15 for Camfour a gun distributor, and 25 selling RV's, and my mantra was "a problem is a chance to be a hero" Clearly CSMC does not follow that thinking. A bill of sale was emailed to me but that was my last contact with the salesman.

Besides phone calls I have sent six emails to each of the two email addresses and pictures of the patterns crickets.

Besides phone calls I have sent six emails to each of the two email addresses and pictures of the patterns crickets.

Maybe you should make a YouTube video. We’ll all help you get the view count up.

As noted above, stock fit shouldn't be playing a role in the problem as you've described it. Has to be either the shooter or the barrel regulation. If you can, get hold of a couple of laser cartridges (might not be the right name for them) and see what they tell you. That way you'd be eliminating the possible effects of recoil and/or flinching associated with actual shotshells. And use a device to hold the gun so as to further eliminate the human element. My $.02.

When you look down the barrels, what do the circles look like?Do they overlap? When you line the beads up with an outside point around 20 yards away, are the tubes close when looking thru them?

Masshunter that is to bad they are not standing by their gun. Briley use to do excentrix chokes that change poi not sure about a 12 inch change. They might be worth a call.

Well, after over six weeks today they emailed me a form to fill out and send . waiting for an autherisation number. Guy on the phone cheerful and helpful. Almost like someone saw my last post ? I guess they figured I wasn't going away. Never thought of looking through the tubes, good idea battue. I had thought of Briley, but shouldn't have to pay for the mistakes they made. I am hopeful that from here on it will get taken care of. I'll keep every one posted. Thanks for the input.

I bought a set of laser cartridges to try and sort out a CZ O/U. One was okay, but the emitter in the other was crooked, easily demonstrated, by turning it in the chamber and watching the light draw a circle on the target. So, you need to test the tester before you draw any conclusions using it.

Knock the primers out of some 12 gauge hulls—should be apparent where the barrels boresight in relation to the bead. Works for turkey guns and sights.

Gun is now back at CSMC Finally sent a return number. Can't believe how they dragged their feet.

Update : The gun came back July 13, no paper work or explanation of work done. Only had a chance to test it once, and still about 5" to the left. I can't believe they didn't test fire it. So back to square one leaving E mails and waiting for a repair number to send it back again. And this is supposed to be a high class company. They will never get another dime from me.

I regret what has happened to you, but wish I could say I am surprised.

Many years ago I went direct to Tony Galazan, who happened to be at the CSMC booth at the big Vegas show. I told him I wanted to order a Model 21 to my specs, had deposit in hand. Half way through his sentence back to me, he broke off the conversation without a word more to me, struck up another conversation with an acquaintance who had walked up. I was a bit put out about it, but waited a good 10 minutes for him to finish our conversation and take my order. I just walked away, finally, and they never got a dime from me.

The sad part is I really like the gun, its everything I wanted, decent wood, reeks quality, just soured on the way its gone down

And here my 73 year old J.C. Higgins 16 ga. SXS centers patterns from both barrels beautifully. I call it my Jed Clampett gun. Haven't struck oil with it yet but I have killed a lot of game.

I 've had people.pull that crap on me. Once is enough I don't bother to ever talk to them again..mb

Elly May was a babe. 😏

Update When the gun came back July 13, and was still shooting a bit left, I started calling and E mailing for another return number. I finally got one on Aug 11, almost a month of being ignored. I sent it back that day. I started calling and E mailing after a couple weeks, again can't talk to anyone except "Jay & Ray" that answer the phones. Finally got it back Jan 14, test fired it and it was back to the original far left POI.
I can't believe the treatment I got Besides paying $3250 for the gun it was over $50 to ship it back each time. My choice now is to trade it off at a loss, or invest in a couple of Briley Eccentric chokes. I'm not sure they can move it far enough.
All I can do is warn everyone NEVER BUY FROM CSMC !

Damn. That’s too bad. They look like really nice guns. Guess your best bet for a Fox is to find an original. They’re out there and priced reasonably last I looked around.

l have known when I saw the "No Return Policy" I was fooled by the glossy adds . I should also have read some of the other shotgun shooting sites as there are some horror stories there.

Been ogling a Weatherby Orion SxS a bit, but crap like this makes me think I should just settle for what I have.

If you like the gun, by all means contact Briley and see what they can do for you. It’ll cost, but probably no more than you’ll lose trading it off.

Another option might be having the barrels sleeved by someone like Simmons. They might be able to correct the problem.

Keep us informed.

Man, sorry you’re going through this! I know how you feel. I had two Beretta O/U shotguns that had horrible barrel regulation. Of course Beretta didn’t do a darn thing about it. I won’t own another one of those either.

You are among a number of disappointed purchasers of SxS doubles from that company.... 5 have personally come to my ranch to confer, shoot my pattern plates/ boards.... ask me to shoot it....
For all the mechanical innovation the company demonstrates in its efforts to build a medium to HIGH End SxS, they have not gotten the barrel regulation solved. Double regulation is not now , nor ever been a pure mechanical equation..... Part experience, skilled Barrelsmiths , and sometimes a great deal of smokey magic and tweaks to the tubes to get it right. There are other quality guns available at or near that pricepoint that have near perfect or better regulation.....