Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Mule Deer, and others...advise wanted

Looking for insights and suggestions.

Long story short....
A long lost (stolen) VSSF 220 Swift has returned home, but the barrel is toast.
So it's getting a new barrel, probably a Bartlein, but I'm undecided as to which cartridge to have it chambered to.
I love the performance the Swift and don't want less, but the case can be a bit of a pita to deal with.
The choices? Leave it a Swift and deal with the case issues, 22-250 AI, or perhaps 22 Creedmoor all in (probably) an 8" twist or perhaps a bit faster.

What say you? Any experiences with the AI or Creedmoor?

How is the Swift case a pain? Yes, it is semi rimmed and some care must be given to be sure the rounds are oriented correctly in the magazine, the upper round’s rim is in front the rim of the round below it.

Never felt it was a problem. I’ve shot a Swift for 30+ years and after the first mistake loading the magazine, I never repeated the error.

I’m a Swift fan. Always have been and always will be.

I, too, have been using the swift for many years. My first experience with it was in 1981.
You're right about the semi rimmed case, it's not that big of a big problem.
My complaints about the case are that it requires a lot more frequent trimming than any other case I've ever dealt with and finding cases for it can be very problematic and there is no other available case from which to form it if need be. Thus the reasons for my interest in possibly going in a different direction.

I once read that the case size of a 22-250 AI is 100.1 percent of a 220 Swift. If that is true a 22-250 AI should be very similar to the 220 Swift. Can anyone confirm this?

I am a 22-250 fan. But if rebarreling, I would go Creed.

How do you intend to use the rifle?

Water Capacity of each per google search:

AI-48.5
Swift-47

Scotty;
Good morning to you sir, I hope that the day in your part of the world is giving you favorable conditions for the raid and you're well.

Going off of a foggy semi-old guy memory, when I put together a long range coyote bomber in the early '90's chambered for .22-250 AI 40°, using some sort of smaller kernel sized ball powder - so not water - and in the .220 Swift cases I could find back then which I think was only two different brands, my fully blown out Ackley cases held a grain more powder.

I've always just used .220 Swift data after that and so far haven't had any issues, but admittedly it's not a rifle I shoot that much anymore. To clarify why, it's a bit of a heavy beast and I'm a little old guy so mostly the Ruger American .223 comes out if I'm going coyote calling anymore.

Hope that helped you or someone out there.

All the best.

Dwayne

Paul;
Top of the morning to you sir, I hope you're getting a good start on your day in the deep south.

I see that as I was attempting to answer the question you actually did it first.

Good to see it more or less mirrored what I'd remembered.

At my age and caffeine level - working on the second cup - I feel pretty good about that!

Have a great day Paul.

Dwayne

Swift brass:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1025893541?pid=984791

MickeyD,

Must confess that after owning a number of .220 Swifts over the years I switched to the .22-250. Never had any problem with Swift cases getting to feed (partly because one of 'em was a Ruger No. 1B) but did have occasional problems finding good brass.

Aside from brass availability, switched to the .22-250 because some rifle companies started making relatively inexpensive 1-8 twist models, at least in limited runs. One of ours is a special run of Tikka T3 sporters that Whittaker Guns in Kentucky had done several years ago. Of course it shoots very accurately, but also works very with heavier monolithic bullets on deer and pronghorn--which is why it's been Eileen's primary rifle for those animals the last few years, with even milder recoil than her .243 Winchester and .257 Roberts rifles. (Oh, and I also used the 1-8 twist special Whittaker run of Ruger American sporters on the biggest-horned pronghorn buck I've seen locally, which worked fine at around 350 yards.)

Will also comment that the .22 Creedmoor is almost identical to the .22-250 AI, except for having the modern "accuracy" shoulder angle of 30 degrees, as opposed to the 40-degree shoulder of Ackley Improveds.

John,
Thanks for you reply, it's greatly appreciated and tends to feed that little voice in the back of my mind that keeps screaming "go with the factory 22-250".
However, I don't want to give up any of the performance advantage the Swift has, slight though it may be.
My inclination does favor the AI due, mostly, to quality brass availability from which to form the cases and the 22-250s well established presence---it's not going to disappear any time soon.
That being said, there are at least a couple of sources for 22 Creed brass that makes that option tempting.
On any given day I'll decide to go with the AI. The next, the Creed.
Decisions, Decisions. What's a loonie to do?

Thanks, again, John.

I have two Swifts, a .22-250, and a .22-250AI. Both the std .22-250 and the AI are about 3000 rounds old. I like them all, but if I wanted to start over I would go with the AI. Brass is plentiful simple to make, and you mostly want fired formed brass to begin serious load development. Mine are all std 1-14 twist, for my purposes that is all I need. I did have one 1-8 twist, and I personally don't see the need. That one shot best with 64 gr. WW and I can shoot them out of the 1-14. As for deer and antelope, they have all killed a pile of deer and antelope with 50 and 55 gr. bullets.
It is never my serious medium game caliber, but it still works. As for twist, I think I might go to 1-12 for my next barrel job, but I maybe never need it. Who knows, at 75 most of my very serious shooting is behind me. But I guess I will keep at it as long as I am able. Good luck with whatever you do.

Mickey,

The other advantage of the .22-250 AI is just about eliminates the need to trim brass--like other AI rounds.

Dwayne

So the 22-250 is a little bit more that the 220 Swift. I have been thinking of getting my 22-250 rebarreled. What you say about using 220 Swift data make sense so one doesn't go with hot loads the AI tends to bring out.

Thanks to all for your thoughts and suggestions and for staying on topic...a somewhat rare event here.
Your comments have been very helpful.

John, your comment on case trimming is the single biggest reason I won't be chambering for the Swift. I absolutely HATE case trimming!

As it stands now it'll be chambered in the AI. There's precious little the Creed will do that tha AI can't and quality brass is far more available.
As for twist rate, I see no reason to go with anything other than an 8". It'll handle the mono metals, high BCs, and probably most of the more commom cup and cores.

Again, thanks to all.

We never had any trouble killing deer and antelope with the .220 Swift either. In fact Eileen used our first one (a tang-safety Ruger 77 with the 1-14 twist) for several years with the 60-grain Nosler Solid-Base loaded to 3650 fps, and I also used it as a loaner rifle when guiding deer and antelope hunters--who often turned out to be "over-gunned" because they bought some sort of magnum rather than bringing the .243 or .308 they used in Pennsylvania or Alabama or wherever. For some reason they believe more velocity and "power" was needed for longer "Western" ranges--and this was before laser rangefinders appeared.

In fact we used the 60-grain Solid Base for everything in the Swift, from prairie dogs to coyotes to deer. It worked. But these days prefer higher-BC monolithics in a 1-8 twist .22-250, because they drift less in the wind and ruin less meat than lighter lead-cores started faster--yet still kill very well.

what are going to use this rifle for ? big game ? targets ? small game ? if its a coyote -deer rifle then get a 1-9 twist chamber it a 220 swift its a great old cartridge. if its just a paper target rifle you might want a 1-10 twist and shoot the cheaper 55 - 50- 45 gr. bullets in a 22-250 . if you wanna a very accurate paper target rifle get a 8 twist for bigger bullets ,put a single shot follower in the rifle chamber it in a 22 BR.

If I were to get my Swift rebarrelled, it would be to .220 Swift AI.

you don`t need a AI ,but it mostly depends what your going to use it for ?