Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Reduced loads...450BM and 358win

Anyone have receded load data for the 450 Bushmaster or 358win??


I'm looking for something with a jacketed HUNTING bullet that'll perform well on deer inside 100yds. Something with low recoil.



The girlfriend expressed a little interest in hunting. I have both rifles that are nice and light and compact. I just can't find much on bullets and powders for lighter loads.


I'm thinking a .357 mag bullet innthe 358 and a 452 whatever in the Bushmaster.



I just don't wanna put another rifle in the closet yet till I know she'll actually hunt. Those 2 rifles would work well. But being 6.25 pounds and lighter, full throttle loads will be way too much for her.


Thanx!

I haven't done it, but I know how I'd start. I'd get some 180 grain Speer flat noses for the 358. Then I'd start with top end 35 Remington loads for an extruded powder like 4198 and work up over a chrono until I found accuracy near actual 35 Remington speed.

158 XTP-fp and sr4759 shoots great in my 358 win. A friend uses that combo from a 356 win contender pistol with excellent results.

I did about the same thing with RL7 and 200’s. You have a broad swathe in which to find a comfortable velocity spot and chances are it’ll be plenty accurate as well.

^^^Speer 180. It was (or seemed) somewhat hard for deer at 35 Rem/357 Max (rifle) speeds, even when hitting bone…..for me. I got almost no expansion out of those. The WFN 180gr cast bullets, SSPs, and the various 200hr SPs….FTX, RN, etc seemed to perform better in my loads at around 2300-2400fps and less. The 158 XTPs were nasty for damage, backed off to around 2000-2100….explosive otherwise. The 180gr XTP, I liked better, all the way up to 2400+. FWIW, my 5’ nothing wife would shoot those all day in an encore 16.25” barrel.

Thanx guys! A 158 or 180 was kinda what I was thinking. Just need a powder to get 1600-1800ish. Should have much recoil and not pushing the bullet way too fast.


I can find cast load data but not much on reduced jacketed lighter bullet stuff.


If it'll hold a few inches at 100yds I'd be happy. I've killed a few truckload of deer and I've never broke 100yds even though I shoot steel beyond 1000 weekly lol. My average deer shot is 40yds or so I'd bet. Probably due to me primarily being a archery and flintlock hunter....I just usually set up in cover and for closer shots.

Mauser I’d look at 4198 or 7 or anything along that burn rate.

Don’t be worried about using cast data. You won’t have any major pressure issues down that low.

That low I wouldn't use the 180 Speer I mentioned.

Yeah, 2000-2200 with a 180 doesn’t have much recoil…or blast. I’d want 2k to guarantee expansion.

If it were me I would get some 200 grn ftx bullets and try to duplicate 35 rem velocity. The other thing is cast. I know you said jacketed, but a 200 grain cast at 2000 fps is very easy on the shoulder, and quite effective

I figured a 180 at 2000ish in a sub 6lb rifle would still be a bit much. I have no idea honestly. I guess I'll have to experiment and try.

I have a load I cooked up for plinking small game that uses a 9mm bullet. It's an absolute gas to shoot and very accurate. Unfortunately I can't help you with the reduced load you're after. I like the 180 Barnes and a bunch of TAC, it smacks critters hard.

Fireball, that's my goto load now (haven't taken a critter with it yet because I was carrying the bushy or tagged out in archery. I have 178gr Hammers now that the 180s are dried up. Barnes seem tough to come by....Hammers seem available all the time...so I wanna see how they stack up.


If you don't mind Sharing the 9mm load, I'd be interested...could be a good way to get her trigger time with that exact rifle and very little recoil at all.

Pretty much 350 Legend territory.

I loaded these up in my 358 with H4895. 37ish grains got me about 1900 fps. I’m sure it would do fine on deer inside 100 yards. They also sell a 200 grain version. Either would be fine, the 200 might be better performance but a little more recoil. Both will be light in the recoil department though if you keep them around 2000 fps.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1988218433?pid=827283

I know you said you wanted a jacketed bullet, but the cast bullets are tailor made for this application. These are out of stock at the moment, but worth keeping an eye out for.

^^^what I was referring to earlier. I’ve killed quite a few deer with those style bullets. Can’t recall if the midway version there is the same hardness (or lack of) I preferred, but those should work from 1700-2400+ just fine. They did for me.

At the 1600-1800 speeds I would look for some of the 180 grain SSP bullets. My friend harvested a lot of deer with his Thompson Contender and that load. Even in a pistol it was very mild mannered.

7 grains of 2400 powder and a 124 grain HP. Don't know the brand of bullet.

I just cast and powder coated some lee 200g fn .358 bullets. I've got gas checks for them that I'll put on when I size them.

I've been wondering about using a lighter charge of unique or blue dot or maybe 2400 to load them light for my 358 blr. I don't really want to use a filler though so I'm wondering how light charges of pistol powder will do in a 358 case. I'd like to load some as light as 1200 fps and also find a load for hunting that gets closer to 2000fps. I realize the pistol powders won't work to get me to 2000 but I have a bunch of old data 2200 I might experiment with for it.

I've just been busy working on 6.5 grendel loads and 300 bo loads for the kids upcoming deer and elk hunts and also starting load development for my havak element 7 prc that I think I'll hunt with this year.

After we fill our tags I'll get back to working up cast loads.

If you want to try some cast PC flat noses let me know. I can size them .357, .358, .359, or .360 when I put the gas checks on. The are a zombie lime green color powder coat and a medium to hardish maybe bhn 16-19 I'm guessing. They should expand a bit at 2000 fps and I'd donate some to get her out hunting.

Bb

@ Burleyboy

All I can recommend is Trail Boss or H4895 reduced loads for the .358 Win. I've never experimented with pistol powders in a rifle other than what's recommended for .300 BLK. A good investment for hanloading cast bullets is a Lyman or Lee reloading manual.