Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game I finally had an accubond fail

Poor guy...soldier on, all for the sake of the cause!

klik,

Hey, both my rifles that didn't like X's both have Pac-Nor Barrels! Hmm.

DakotaDeer, I only have seat of the pants research into the TSX BC, but it was at a time when I was putting some significant trigger time into figuring out holdover out to 400+ yards and boy, the differernce between the AB and the TSX was not subtle! I'm now using B&C reticles or turrets so it really doesn't matter much what the BC is, as long as I have it doped...

-jeff

If BC is that important of a pass/fail criteria for selection of a hunting bullet, you better stick to paper punching instead of hunting. jorge

It's not a pass/fail criteria for me at all, Jorge. Just said it was a very noticable difference- right before the part where I said that it really doesn't matter to me!

-jeff

Klik,

I've talked about the history of the X a lot with Randy Brooks, and the main problem back in the early days was making them consistently, both because of machinery problems (the machines he got when buying the company were not particularly fresh) and copper. He simply couldn't afford to big big lots of copper in those days, so had to take smaller lots, and often whatever he could get. So the bullet varied, both one from another and from batch to batch.

As finances got better he could afford better machinery and bigger, better lots of copper. He also learned how to heat-treat the expanding end of the bullet to make expansion more consistent.

And that's why they ended being a very good, consistent product even before the TSX appeared.

I would imagine Bill Steigers went through a similar process of trial and error on the Bitterroots. I know John Nosler went through it with the Partition, which is now a VERY different bullet in manufacture and material than when he invented it 60 years ago.

I guess a further point is that I (among other gun writers) got blasted a little when we first startd writing up the TSX--because so many shooters had had mixed results with the plain old X for 15 years or more. Some even tried the TSX and didn't like the way it killed game. They didn't like the size of the edxit hole or entrance hole or SOMETHING. Some called me a charlatan and worse. Meanwhile I went on testing them on big game in calibers from the .25 to the .416, until I thought I had a pretty good handle on how they worked--and differed from the old X. By that time it was time to try something else new, but I still shoot an animal with the TSX from time to time--and will being doing the same thing with the tipped version as well.

Thanks, JB. You've really added some great unput to what has been a rather strong diversion, (thanks in no small part to myself, ) from the original thread.

Sorry Jeff, I was by no means directly my statement to you but rather as a general comment. We know how many neophytes out there whose main criteria for a hunting rig are accuracy and BC. I must admit though the TSXs have been the most consistantly accurate bullets Iv'e worked with to date and while I've only killed two deer with them so far (140gr 7mm Weatherby) the results were quite satisfactory. Both DRTs with large exit holes after traversing the entire animal. My "money bullet" is still the Swift A Frame and we know that bullet's about as aerodynamic as an F-4 Phantom! jorge

I worked for a guy who really wanted to buy an F4 off the surplus market... he flew a couple hundred missions in Vietnam in F-100's and wanted a mid-life "toy". Said you could get them for about $100k on the surplus market...

His other dream airplanes were the F-16 and the A-10. He was flying A7's for the New Mexico ANG at the time.

Hey, you just recently used those TSX's on deer, right? Seems like I remember you mentioning it about a month ago and it hadn't happened yet. So what were the particulars?

-jeff

Jorge, you're right on all counts.

I won't swap bullet construction for high BC, either, which is another stupid trade-off. Fortunately, you can shoot well-constructed bullets of high BC and not really lose out on anything, a prime example being the 180 gr. .308 Nosler Partition SP, which has a BC of .474!

And even with bullets of slightly lower BC, you're still not giving up much hit potential in the real world, provided that you know your rifle and practice with the load you're going to hunt with at all practical ranges, and not just off the bench at 100 yds. For quite a few years, I used the 180 gr. Nosler Partition Protected Point out of my 300 Win. Mag. for most of my hunting, and that bullet has a lower BC that the 180 SP Partition. And yet, when called upon, this projectile was up to 400 shots on Nambian gemsbok as well as Sonoran Coues deer, plus 275 yd. shots on NM pronghorn, Texas whitetails down senderos, etc. I really never ran into a situation where this bullet did work well.

Sometimes we get too wound-up on statistics, group size and computerized downrange ballistic profiles for our own good. Practice time behind the rifle and shooting skill under field conditions does much to make up for fractions of an inch off the bench and minute differences in BC...........

AD

I went thru a 180 grain Speer Mag Tip phase and it worked splendidly on everything. Had to quit though, such an ugly bullet.

Yep, the TSXs look like they are going to be hard to beat, but eh A-Frame remains my favorite. I also have great expectations for the North Fork and have them ready to go if my moose hunt comes to fruition next year and I am also going to use them in my custom hein 450 Dakota.

On the TSxs,like I said, just two Alabama does do not a great test make, but they were shot at different ranges under 100 and over 200> I purposely tried to shoot them both head on in the hopes of a bullet recovery, but both bullets exited the opposite short ribs (aft) with very large exit holes and drt. 7mm Weatherby Mag and 140 TSXs @ 3300. jorge

the retained weight in the Accubonds in the photos I posted are:
left 30 cal 180 = 108.6
center 30 cal 180 = 97.0
right 7mm 140 = 77.2

163bc

Those pictures don't inspire confidence for use on anything but the lightest framed animals. It looks like you had complete and partial core separation and relatively modest impact velocities. Looks like a good bullet for southern whitetails though. jorge

Like I stated earlier, they are pretty much an overpriced ballistic tip.

Impact velocities on these were in the 2900-3000 fps range into front shoulder bone. These are the only 3 I have recovered out of 25-30 I have used on game. I don't consider 50-60% weight retention a failure?? I been shooting a lot of does on a QDM property I'm involved with and have used Accubonds for that over the last couple years just so I could test em out. I gotta say that overall I'm very impressed with their performance and would rate the Accubonds an excellent choice for use on deer sized game and possibly up to caribou & elk with heavy for calibur bullets. 163bc

I didn't say they were a failure. IMO, there is no difference between a ballistic tip and an accubond, just price. There is no boubt they work.

Not a failure at all! Just not enough weight retention for me at those velocities for larger animals. jorge

I shot a 230lbs wild hog at 200 yards last month with Federal Vital-shock 140grain AB. I hit the animal around the neck area, the bullet did not exit but it knock the animal on the spot.

Several of us used AB this year instead of NBT for deer, tested first on Mulie's, 1) 7mm RM 160gr at 315 yards, behind frt shoulder nice exit DRT 2) 300RUM 165gr at 527 yards low shoulder hit, short track. Next tried on white tails 1) 7mmRUM 140gr at 65 yards, behind frt shoulder, large exit DRT 2)7mm RM 160gr at 125 yards, high shoulder shot severed spine, large exit DRT 3) 7mmRUM 140 gr 50 yards, behind shoulder DRT 3) 7mm RM 160gr at 250 yards, back ham and then neck (running shot) massive damage to both hams 4) 300RUM 165gr 170 yards, behind shoulder, nice exit 50 yard track 5) 300RUM 165gr 225 yards, shoulder shot, lost off shoulder, DRT 6) 300RUM 165gr 275 yards, behind shoulder, nice exit DRT.

Never recoved a single bullet, saw immediate kills to short runs with excellent bloodtrails. Meat damage was in excess more to bullet placement than bullet design. So far I like them and will continue to use them.