Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters so....what's the next WSM going to be?

As of now...

My vote would go for the 9.3 WSM this would come close to the 9.3x64 round. This would or could be a
seller in Europe and with good marketing maybe
North America. It wouldnt hurt in Africa either.
A real cosmos round.

9.3 Cosmos perhaps? Think 21st century here.

My next custom rifle will be in this cartridge.

I was at Nosler last week talking with some of the
Techs, they say that 23" is max for the WSM SAUM line of cartridges. Anything past that barrel length was of no
benifit. I like the short mags, a lot.

fwiw

I'm really pulling for the .338 WSM to become a factory

cartridge. I have one of my MRC SS S/A coming in a mag

boltface & the other is going to be a 25-284(my 1st wildcat)

If the .338 doesn't come to pass I'm thinking maybe a 350

Rem. Mag. might be an even better choice for my first

larger bore with the handgun bullets available for plinking

etc...decisions..decisions. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> Good Shooting, Bruce

I can picture Lazz numbers with max starting pressures(nosler into lands,high neck tension). His RCBS dies way oversize, and his brass is thick&hard. I believe the SAAMI max press for the 257SJ is 63.8Kpsi. 270WSM is 65Kpsi.
I do know that MY loads are correct, as posted. I've cal checked my software against many mentioned loads, from all kinds of discussions. 2years of careful comparison and tweaking. I don't see contradictions w/regard to similar bore/capacity cartridges very often.

By the way. I gotta ask.
How does brass thickness affect pressure handling?
And why wouldn't Win/Rem actions handle what lazz offerings can? Including Savage/Sako.

mikecr...I'd be curious to hear about your experience with Lazzeroni brass, dies and loading practices as they certainly don't jibe with mine using the components or my conversations with John Lazzeroni. With respect to the brass being thick & hard, I find it to be thick and relatively soft but the good thing is that with proper care (I anneal every 4th or 5th loading) I have brass that has been used more than a dozen times and the pockets are still tight, my concentricity is still very good and both of my rifles continue to give me more accuracy than I thought was possible using hunting bullets in full-power loads.

With respect to the action used by Lazzeroni (McMillan MCR-T) being stronger than either the Rem or Winchester, next time you handle one take some measurements and read Dan Lilja's article about bolt-thrust on his website. I think the Rem, Win & Sav actions can "handle" the pressure from factory Lazzeroni ammo (Lazzeroni started out using the Rem 700 actions) but I don't think the extra strength needed for a reasonable margin of error especially with handloads is there...again re-read the Lilja article.

I'm also a little confused about the 257SJ (tell me more aobut the cartridge)you mentioned having a SAAMI pressure standard which suprised me as even most proprietary lines of cartridges don't and I don't know of any "wildcats" that do......tell us how that came about.

One thing does scare me a little is your seemingly total belief in the predictive ability of QuikLoad and similar programs......what happens when the burn rate of a powder changes with respect to the figures listed in the program (see my experience with RL15)...what happens when a bullet manufacturer changes the ogive and/or bearing surfaces (happens all the time)....etc, etc....to say nothing at all about changes in neck-tension which isn't even a variable.

My experience working with QuikLoad, with the expert help of Mic McPherson, made it pretty clear to me that it didn't work very well with either my 9.53 Hellcat or my 7.82 Patriot.

Not trying to start a long running feud here about Lazzeroni cartridges, the differences between CUP & psi, SAAMI standards, QuikLoad or any other predictive loading programs, I'd just like to suggest a need for "moderation" in using absolutes when talking about loading especially as you near max pressures which isn't the same as max "safe" pressures.

I would consider my example loads as max. Of course anyone should work up carefully to them. Like you said, things change. Personally I subscribe to Ken howell's thinking, in that slower powders(or whatever fills the case)for <50kpsi is sufficient and greatly reduces throat wear. But there was a capacity comparison going on there w/WBY-vs-WSM, and I thought I'd throw in the 6.53SJ for further example. Just to try & proove that with relatively light bullets, further Capacity makes little difference. My contention is still that w/100gr and below bullets, The 257WSM isn't "in between" anyting.
I don't want to argue anymore about Lazzeroni(whom I have zero respect for).
I don't want to argue about the accuracy of my software.
If you like I can look into your Patriot load discrepancies.
In a year or so of researching every posted load, and then tweaking & testing for a few months, I could probably estimate your loads correctly. I charge 5cents/hr though. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I'd like to see a 35 or a 375 on that case.A friend of mine made up a 35 on the SAUM case and is getting just over 2800 FPS with a 250 grain Partition from a 23 inch barrel over the chronograph.

WB.

Is his insurance paid up?

JimF

That's 4350 ftlbs of muzzle energy which ain't gonna happen unless he's using magic fairy dust instead of smokless powder......a 225gr bullet around 2800 fps does, however, sound "reasonable" but stout.

He did this before the WSM and SAUM came out.He took 300 RUM cases and cut them back until it'd fit into the Remington 600 action.

He wrote some of this up on HuntAmerica about 2 years ago.His name is Brian Smith and if you run a search you ought to be able to find it in either the Handloading or Rifle board.

WB.

If I were Winchester and contemplating a .338 or larger bore on the WSM head size it would be to go to a 3.3" COL length. This would approximate the Dakota line.

What Steve Timm said...... now that makes sense!

I do not question the good folks at nosler but the "expansion chamber" for a 270 wsm is much smaller than the ec for the 300 wsm. for any magnum, a 24" barrel is a sensible min or why not just shoot a 308.