Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters 224 Texas Trophy Hunter?

So I am pawing thru my new copy of Cartridges of the World (my last one was about 15 years old and I was in serious need of an update!)and I found this cartridge listed. In looking it over, it certainly at rist seemed to be a good answer for a low-recoil deer hunting cartridge, and would seem to be adequate for SC White-tails. I have a few questions about this cartridge, and wondered if anyone out there may be able to answer them:

1-Anyone have actual shooting/hunting expereince with this cartridge?
2-Does this do anything that the 22-250 or 220 Swift (or 22-250 AI, it is a wildcat afterall)
can't do with properly constructed bullets?

I find it interesting, and would appreciate input from all!

i have a friend in texas who is associated with the tv show entitled "journal of the texas trophy hunter". there is an older man who is the host of the show, well known in texas hunting circles, and he, with an associate, supposedly designed that round. i have seen a video where he has taken a few texas whitetails with the gun and also where he has "guided" some young kids to take their first deer with the gun. i don't know if it is available in a factory chambering (i suspect it is not). seems to me to be another wildcat cartridge that has minimum popularity in texas.

I recently read an article on this cartridge (can't remember where). If I recall correctly, it is the 6mm Rem. case necked down to .224. According to the article, the ideal rifle for this cartridge has a fast twist barrel so heavy bullets can be used for deer hunting thus taking advantage of the large powder capacity.

I can't see where it would do anything any of the cartridges we have with a fast twist won't do especially the 220 swift. just a bunch more BS. I have a 22-250 with a 1-8 twist excellant accurcy with any bullet weight even 70 gr.

Yep, nothing a factory chambered round wouldn't do almost as well.

22/6mm has been around for years, gets a bit more speed if thats important.

Get a 22-250 in a fast twist, 8 or 7 and you'll be fine. You will have to reload as far as I know, to use heavy bullets though.

I've shot more than a few with the above, and 80 smks... works fine.

Jeff

The 6mm case has quite a bit more capacity than the 250 or Swift and will beat them badly with a fast twist barrel which can utilize the heavyweight 22 bullets .

In addition , when you start pushing 70 to 75 gr bullets and up , RL 25 and and other very slow powders come into play and this showcases the advantage of the larger boiler room even more........those heavy 22 s at warp speeds are flat shootin little sobs.....

I imagine a .224 TTH and a 70 TSX would kill most anything....

Question was what can it do vs the 22-250 with properly constructed bullets. I took that to mean no question of shots past 300 yards etc.....

My basis was assumed and assumed on the above. Sure you can get more speed, its why my friends used the 22/6mm years ago when 90 jlks first came out, I was limited in matches to 223, and they were not, so the 22/6 shined better at 1000 yards, but of course barrel life is much shorter.

Given a 70 tsx, any of the top line 22s will be a killing machine. I still prefer to err on the large side of calibers, but the man is asking for low recoil, standard deer round.

Greg-- how did the weekend go? Still a can sitting on my desk at work....

Jeff

Weekedn went good Jeff, thanks for asking...
It was a crazy, weird night Christmas Eve.
We went calling on a new place that had sign all over it. It was 22 degrees at 9PM, full moon, still as death...
6 sets, not a dang thing except I got some coyotes fired up about a mile away that never showed...


We've had nights like that before where there was nothing at all and all of a sudden a magical switch turns on which might have happened later in the night...

Somethin funny Jeff, Bart called me up this weekend and he got some TAC for me as well without me knowing. I WILL be headed past La Grange on the way up to Mason to go hunting in a a few weeks and will stop by for sure...

Thanks again Jeff and hope you and yours had a Merry Christmas!

Dang, the 70 TSX and a fast twist piqued my interest...
This is a bad thing...

rost - you wee exactly right, my shots would be taken at closer range. Actually, I should have been a bit more diligent and included that where I hunt the longest shot (and this is fairly extreme) would be right at 150yds. may get into a different lease in a few years though, and they have some opportunities at maybe 225, but nothing farther than that.
In reality, the longer ranges would likley be right at 100yds, and while my boy has a M94 in 30-30 (everybody should have a lever action, you know), I was thunking of a light rifle that is also light in recoil. Maybe a used Rem 788 or Ruger 77 or Savage or the like with standard barrel and a fixed 6x or the like would be a good combo, me-thinks, and hey, I can always use another gun, can't I?

Heck at 150-225 max, I'd be more than willing to toss .224 tsx of proper weight for twist, from a 223.... I've used 85 tsx out of a slow 6mm round, out past 250 so far and netted stem to stern penetration...

Greg- can still here whenever. Damn nice of Bart too!

Jeff

Greg and others,

A good friend had a 244 TTH built a couple years back, he loves it. Whole thing weighs 7 lbs complete with scope and AND a 26" barrel....it shoots bug holes....little bitty ones.
He's taken several deer with it and a bunch of hogs. He shoots 70 gr TSX's. Last year he shot two hogs with one shot at 150 yds. Both hogs about 125 lbs, both melted in place and the bullet was not found, traveled through both hogs and kept going with extensive internal damage to both.
A 22/250 with a fast twist IS NOT equivalent of a 224 TTH. The 224 launches 70 gr bullets at about the same speed a 22/250 does 50 to 55 gr bullets.....pretty big difference.

Greg, you going to be around Mason/Castell this weekend?

Bill

I had a 22-6mm and still have a 22-243. The 22-6mm was the worst barrel eater that I've ever owned. The CM steel in the throat area eroded about like a sand castle on an incoming tide. I've pretty much decided that, for me, the 220 Swift and 22-250 have about all the case capacity that I can use effectively and expect to see a reasonable period of barrel life. What good is all that potential speed if you don't have much, maybe any, useable barrel life left after you've developed your pet loads?

That said, good luck with your 224 TTH!

Jeff

I think its pretty clear the 22-250 is slower, case capacity is not nearly the same... but for the needs, a 224TTH would be overkill and a waste. While a 22-250 could give 1000 plus rounds of barrel life.

Jeff

The extra velocity doesn't have to mean faster throat-erosion.

My .220 Howell has more capacity than the .224 TTH and doesn't erode throats fast when it's loaded to lower pressures with the slower powders (Norma MRP, IMR-7828, Ramshot Magnum) that I designed it for.

Excessive throat-erosion is a result of very high pressures, which are in turn results of using too-fast powders in search of too-fast velocities.

Load the .224 TTH with its optimum powder[s], and it won't erode throats any faster than a .30-06 or a .22-.250.

Load any cartridge to high pressures with faster powders than are best for it, and throats erode faster.

TANNSTAAFL!

My 22-6mm was a Winchester 70 in 22-250 that had been rechambered. Since it has a 1 in 14" twist barrel, I was shooting 55, 60, and 64 grain bullets over H414 and Varget. I tried 4831 and 7828, but I couldn't get them to shoot MOPdog groups. I was also making a special effort not to over-heat the barrel, but perhaps it was just soft steel in that late 1960s vintage Winchester barrel.

What is the point of shooting a large case capacity .224" bore cartridge if "too-fast velocities" aren't the objective? For any practical application that I can think of, the 22-250 and 220 Swift will do about as well and, probably, give the shooter more barrel life potential.

Of course, I respectfully defer to Mr. Howell's opinion, since he knows more about shooting then I ever will.

Jeff

I've got one and love it. rem action pac-nor barrel finished at 27". 46 grains of RX22 will net 3600fps with the 75 grain amax.I have taken several deer and hogs with this rifle/load with great effect, however with this bullet only broad side shots in the soft ribs area will do. I had a friend shoot a buck three years ago head on, the animal collapsed like a ton of brick had been dropped on it and didn't even wiggle.after a few min. though the deer was up and look for a place to run, after an additional shot through the lungs it was down for good. at 200-300 yard and animals inthe 100 pound weight class this is an good choice of caliber but it will still require perfect shot placement to be effective.

you are the only person to state the MV. I would like to know what all the others are getting. measured MV not paper figures..

I'm not home, or I'd go look at the shot records, but IIRC I was getting just over 4,000 fps with 55 grain BTs and Sierras with Varget and around 3,850 fps with 60 grain Partitions. I don't remember what I was getting with 64 grain PPs, but I think that over 3,600 fps the groups started to open.

Jeff

Thanks, but it isn't Dr Howell's opinion but solid, well (but not well enough!) known fact of interior-ballistics physics as it relates to pressures, velocities, optimum powders, etc.

Full explanation takes lots more room than we have here, alas. Besides, I've already addressed the issue in some detail on other threads lately, and right now, I'm just too tired of repeating myself to do it again here, now. Please, just bear with the decrepit, useless ol' phardt for a while.

Maybe I should write (as if I had all the free time in the world!) a fairly short explanation in one of my word-processors, save it to disc, then copy-and-paste it whenever this issue rears its quizzical countenance again � and again � and again �