Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire "The Day That Shall Live in Infameimy."

Not sure if I have mentioned this on here before.


My grandfather on my mom's side had been stationed on the Arizona.

He was initially listed as KIA from the December 07 attack, but he was not.

Incredible deal. He had been stationed on the Arizona for quite some time. A very short period before the attacks (I cannot remember, as I am going off of what my aunt told me, and I need to write it all down before she passes). Days or a week before the attack he was transferred to another ship. If I recall right, he was on shore during the attack.

When the attack happened, the paperwork for the transfer was lost. He was shown as being on the Arizona. Communications were down and Sailors were not able to contact family or loved ones. My grandmother was notified that he had been killed, as being part of the crew on the Arizona.

A couple weeks pass before he is able to call home.

Imagine the shock of his parents and wife.

Our greatest generation of men. I sincerely doubt that we will ever see their like again. God bless every one of them and may they all rest in peace.

Wow.

SMH

because he is an old guy who thinks it cute and draws attention to himself.....I am becoming an old guy, sure hope I dont end up becoming a dumbfuck/jackass like him.....bob

God Bless The Greatest Generation. RIP Servicemen Servicewomen who saved a nation.

Boy....been some dandies come through since before and after 9/11.

Some of those guys saw war for 20 years.

I thought it was Peach Harbor.

PS FDR was well aware of the advancing Japanese fleet. The code had been broken. Pearl Harbor was set up for annihilation as a false flag to move America into a war footing with the Axis powers.

Nope, and nothing false about that flag.

Setting up your own side for massive defeat falls in that category. We saw the same thing recently occur in Israel.

"Captain Johan Ranneft, the Dutch naval attache' in Washington, recorded that US navel intelligence officers told him on December 6 that Japanese carriers were only 400 miles northwest of Honolulu. Despite ... this, no alert was passed on to our commanders in Hawaii, Admiral Husband Kimmel and General Walter C Short."

- John Toland's Infamy: Pearl Harbor and It's Aftermath, P 316.

- and that was because FDR specifically forbade it? Nope, there were massive failings and hubris of moving the fleet to Hawaii. Now, the failure in the Philippines to me is less excusable.

There have been a few but not a whole generation. Few and far between. To few.

Why weren't Kimmel and Short notified?

The reason is that FDR, and his team, were intent on engaging in "diplomatic fencing ... so as to be sure Japan is put into the wrong and makes the first overt bad move. The question was how we should maneuver them into the position of firing the first shot."

- From the diary of War Secretary Henry Stimson (John Toland's Infamy: Pearl Harbor and It's Aftermath, PP 275-276.

Short and Kimmel were sacrificed. Admiral King was a traitorous person. He had his minions court martial Captain McVay for the Japanese sinking of the Indianapolis to cover for the Navy’s misconduct. They denied destroyer escort and when the Indianapolis didn’t show up never searched for it. King did it because he had hated the captain’s father for putting him on report when he was a cadet.

Wabigoon or Biden?

If an Arab chieftain is confined to hospital he's...

A Dey that will live in infirmary.

And don’t forget the shooter on the grassy knoll…

*groan*

Muzzies the new Nazi Jap.

TRH- politely and respectfully, my point is, in part, that saying "Pearl Harbor was set up for annihilation as a false flag to move America into a war footing with the Axis powers." Is a bit much -and a real and direct attack is not a 'false' one.

I do not believe anyone for a moment felt the fleet would- or could - be so soundly thrashed or it was deliberately left to happen. I am aware of a communique left unread that morning and would love to know how Short or Kimmel would have accepted it. The fact there even was a communique indicates someone wanted the island prepared. Most believed Japan would never dare strike the show of force the fleet represented. Radar was there if you recall so the notion the island was purposefully left completely defenseless to allow the entire fleet to be destroyed doesn't wash. The US figured to be at war with Japan soon no doubt but it took Hitler declaring war on the US to get America to commit to Europe. Why go to war without a navy?

The main thing is that any attack on American holdings would have us declaring war so why would the fleet need to be destroyed? Would we not have declared war just as eagerly had defenses been prepared and damage considerably less?

I am not at all saying FDR wasn't pushing us into war with either Japan or Germany. Moving the fleet to Pearl was akin to modern-day NATO making members of countries on Russia's border. I agree that the common assumption was the Japanese were going to start something but no one foresaw the massive breadth of their undertaking on the opening day of the Pacific War.

LOL