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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
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ehhhhhhh, youse guys and their god. youse should know about creation.
Before the dawn of time and before the world was created there was a place called Niflheim…
Niflheim was the mist world. It consisted of ice, frost and fog.
Far from Niflheim there was a place that was as hot as Niflheim was cold.
It was the land of fire and was called Muspelheim. A giant named Surt was in charge of Muspelheim. He owned a flaming sword. This was the home of the fire demons.
Between Niflheim and Muspelheim there was a great void. This vast emptiness was called Ginnungagap.
In the center of Ginnungagap the climate was quite pleasant. In this mighty void between the hot and the cold, the first giant troll was formed.
He was the first Jotun and his name was Ymir.
Right about where the ice started to melt on the outskirts of Niflheim, another creature was formed.
It was the huge cow called Audhumla. Four rivers of milk flowed from the teats of Audhumla.
Ymir was lazy. He spent most of his time drinking milk from the teats of Audhumla and sleeping.
Something very strange happened when Ymir slept. He started to reproduce in his sleep. From the sweat under his left armpit male and female Jotuns were conceived.
Later his feet coupled and started to give birth to six-headed monsters. It never seemed to end. His body produced new and sinister creatures every time he fell asleep. It did not last long before the place was crowded with Jotuns.
Audhumla loved salt. By the borders of Niflheim the cow found a very salty stone. The three days the cow licked the stone something bizarre occurred.
On the first day human hair emerged from the rock.
The second day Audhumla licked the salt; a head grew from the stone.
Finally on the third day the rest of the body popped out.
The man who had grown out of the salty rock was Buri, the very first of the gods.
Buri was to become the grandfather of the great god named Odin. Buri eventually died of old age because the apples which kept the gods young had not yet been made.
Buri, the first of all the Aesir, had a son named Bor. Surprisingly enough, not all Jotuns were ugly. Some of the Jotuns were actually amazingly good-looking.
Bor fell in love with a female Jotun named Bestla. She was the sister of the wisest living being named Mimir.
Bor and Bestla had three sons. Their names were Odin, Vili and Ve.
Odin and his two brothers were troubled by the fact that the Jotuns outnumbered the Aesir. The giant troll was constantly conceiving new Jotuns. The only solution they could see was to kill Ymir.
The three brothers waited until Ymir was asleep before they attacked him. A frightful battle emerged. Using all their strength they managed to kill Ymir. The blood gushed out with fierce force in every direction.
Most of the Jotuns drowned in the deluge of blood. Only two Jotuns survived, Bergelmir and his wife. The couple found refuge in the land of mist, thus saving their lives. All future Jotuns descended from this couple.
The three brothers hauled the dead body of Ymir towards the center of Ginnungagap. This is the place where they created the world from the corpse of Ymir.
The blood was transformed into oceans and water.
The flesh turned into land.
The bones formed the mountains.
The teeth made into rocks.
The hair became the grass and trees.
They threw the brain up in the air and it turned into clouds.
The skull became the sky. It was the lid that covered the new world.
The brothers caught some of the sparks shooting out from Muspelheim, the land of fire. They threw the sparks up towards the inside of the skull. These sparks shone at night and were to become the stars.
While the brothers were preoccupied creating a new world from the body parts of Ymir, worms kept crawling out of the corpse.
The worms transformed into dwarfs. The brothers ordered four of the dwarfs to support the sky. They did not want to risk the sky falling down. The four dwarfs were named East, West, South and North.
The other dwarfs established their homes in rocks, caves and grottos under the ground. The dwarfs became experts in craftsmanship.
Day and Night
A Jotun named Norve had a daughter named Nótt. She was the personified night. She was swarthy and dark, the goddess of the night. Nótt married three times.
In her second marriage she had a daughter named Fjorgyn. The meaning of Fjorgyn is earth. Fjorgyn was later to become the mother of Thor.
Her third husband was Delling. Delling was one of the Aesir. He was often considered the personified dawn.
Delling also guarded the home of Balder. Balder was the son of Odin and Frigg. The house belonging to Balder was named Breidablik. It was told nothing evil was to be found in Breidablik.
Nótt and Delling had a son. His name was Dagr. He was extremely handsome. Dagr was as light as his mother was dark. Dagr became the personified day.
Odin put Nótt and Dagr in the sky. They each received a horse and carriage. They travelled continuously around the world. Nótt rode first and was followed by her son Dagr.
In the sky were also the Sol (the Sun) and Máni (the Moon). Sol and Máni rode across the sky in chariots. Sol was female and Máni was male.
A gruesome female Jotun lived in the East woods. She conceived many children.
All her children were born as wolves. One of her children was named Skoll. The wolf Skoll spent all his time pursuing Sol (the sun). Skoll only had one goal and that was to swallow Sol.
Another of her children was named Hati. The wolf Hati spent all his time hunting Máni, the moon. Sol and Máni are terrified of Skoll and Hati. That is one reason why Sol and Máni travel quickly across the sky.
The first humans
The three bothers Odin, Vili and Ve were strolling together on a beach. As they were walking they found two nice looking logs. One seemed to be from the Ash tree and the other seemed to come from an Elm tree.
Odin blew the gift of life and spirit into the logs.
From Vili they received movement, mind and intelligence.
Ve gave them shape, speech, feelings and the five senses.
The first two humans had been created.
The man was given the name Ask. He had been made out of wood from an Ash tree.
The woman was given the name Embla. She had been made from the wood of an Elm tree.
The Aesir decided the humans was to reside in a place they named Midgard. The Aesir named their own territory Asgard. It was to be just about impossible for humans to wander through to Asgard, the home of the gods.
The Aesir made a colorful bridge connecting the two worlds. They named this bridge Bifrost. The humans often referred to Bifrost as the rainbow.
"Russia sucks."
---- Me, US Army (retired) 12B & 51B
Russian Admiral said, after the Moskva sank, "we have the world's worst navy but we aren't as bad as our army".
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2011
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ehhhhhhh, youse guys and their god. youse should know about creation.
Before the dawn of time and before the world was created there was a place called Niflheim…
Niflheim was the mist world. It consisted of ice, frost and fog.
Far from Niflheim there was a place that was as hot as Niflheim was cold.
It was the land of fire and was called Muspelheim. A giant named Surt was in charge of Muspelheim. He owned a flaming sword. This was the home of the fire demons.
Between Niflheim and Muspelheim there was a great void. This vast emptiness was called Ginnungagap.
In the center of Ginnungagap the climate was quite pleasant. In this mighty void between the hot and the cold, the first giant troll was formed.
He was the first Jotun and his name was Ymir.
Right about where the ice started to melt on the outskirts of Niflheim, another creature was formed.
It was the huge cow called Audhumla. Four rivers of milk flowed from the teats of Audhumla.
Ymir was lazy. He spent most of his time drinking milk from the teats of Audhumla and sleeping.
Something very strange happened when Ymir slept. He started to reproduce in his sleep. From the sweat under his left armpit male and female Jotuns were conceived.
Later his feet coupled and started to give birth to six-headed monsters. It never seemed to end. His body produced new and sinister creatures every time he fell asleep. It did not last long before the place was crowded with Jotuns.
Audhumla loved salt. By the borders of Niflheim the cow found a very salty stone. The three days the cow licked the stone something bizarre occurred.
On the first day human hair emerged from the rock.
The second day Audhumla licked the salt; a head grew from the stone.
Finally on the third day the rest of the body popped out.
The man who had grown out of the salty rock was Buri, the very first of the gods.
Buri was to become the grandfather of the great god named Odin. Buri eventually died of old age because the apples which kept the gods young had not yet been made.
Buri, the first of all the Aesir, had a son named Bor. Surprisingly enough, not all Jotuns were ugly. Some of the Jotuns were actually amazingly good-looking.
Bor fell in love with a female Jotun named Bestla. She was the sister of the wisest living being named Mimir.
Bor and Bestla had three sons. Their names were Odin, Vili and Ve.
Odin and his two brothers were troubled by the fact that the Jotuns outnumbered the Aesir. The giant troll was constantly conceiving new Jotuns. The only solution they could see was to kill Ymir.
The three brothers waited until Ymir was asleep before they attacked him. A frightful battle emerged. Using all their strength they managed to kill Ymir. The blood gushed out with fierce force in every direction.
Most of the Jotuns drowned in the deluge of blood. Only two Jotuns survived, Bergelmir and his wife. The couple found refuge in the land of mist, thus saving their lives. All future Jotuns descended from this couple.
The three brothers hauled the dead body of Ymir towards the center of Ginnungagap. This is the place where they created the world from the corpse of Ymir.
The blood was transformed into oceans and water.
The flesh turned into land.
The bones formed the mountains.
The teeth made into rocks.
The hair became the grass and trees.
They threw the brain up in the air and it turned into clouds.
The skull became the sky. It was the lid that covered the new world.
The brothers caught some of the sparks shooting out from Muspelheim, the land of fire. They threw the sparks up towards the inside of the skull. These sparks shone at night and were to become the stars.
While the brothers were preoccupied creating a new world from the body parts of Ymir, worms kept crawling out of the corpse.
The worms transformed into dwarfs. The brothers ordered four of the dwarfs to support the sky. They did not want to risk the sky falling down. The four dwarfs were named East, West, South and North.
The other dwarfs established their homes in rocks, caves and grottos under the ground. The dwarfs became experts in craftsmanship.
Day and Night
A Jotun named Norve had a daughter named Nótt. She was the personified night. She was swarthy and dark, the goddess of the night. Nótt married three times.
In her second marriage she had a daughter named Fjorgyn. The meaning of Fjorgyn is earth. Fjorgyn was later to become the mother of Thor.
Her third husband was Delling. Delling was one of the Aesir. He was often considered the personified dawn.
Delling also guarded the home of Balder. Balder was the son of Odin and Frigg. The house belonging to Balder was named Breidablik. It was told nothing evil was to be found in Breidablik.
Nótt and Delling had a son. His name was Dagr. He was extremely handsome. Dagr was as light as his mother was dark. Dagr became the personified day.
Odin put Nótt and Dagr in the sky. They each received a horse and carriage. They travelled continuously around the world. Nótt rode first and was followed by her son Dagr.
In the sky were also the Sol (the Sun) and Máni (the Moon). Sol and Máni rode across the sky in chariots. Sol was female and Máni was male.
A gruesome female Jotun lived in the East woods. She conceived many children.
All her children were born as wolves. One of her children was named Skoll. The wolf Skoll spent all his time pursuing Sol (the sun). Skoll only had one goal and that was to swallow Sol.
Another of her children was named Hati. The wolf Hati spent all his time hunting Máni, the moon. Sol and Máni are terrified of Skoll and Hati. That is one reason why Sol and Máni travel quickly across the sky.
The first humans
The three bothers Odin, Vili and Ve were strolling together on a beach. As they were walking they found two nice looking logs. One seemed to be from the Ash tree and the other seemed to come from an Elm tree.
Odin blew the gift of life and spirit into the logs.
From Vili they received movement, mind and intelligence.
Ve gave them shape, speech, feelings and the five senses.
The first two humans had been created.
The man was given the name Ask. He had been made out of wood from an Ash tree.
The woman was given the name Embla. She had been made from the wood of an Elm tree.
The Aesir decided the humans was to reside in a place they named Midgard. The Aesir named their own territory Asgard. It was to be just about impossible for humans to wander through to Asgard, the home of the gods.
The Aesir made a colorful bridge connecting the two worlds. They named this bridge Bifrost. The humans often referred to Bifrost as the rainbow. Most excellent, its its about time someone posted something that makes sense!
For those without thumbs, it's s Garden fookin Island, not Hawaii
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,027 Likes: 63 |
Sounds like the translaters believe in a flat earth. I met a flat earther. At first I didn't understand what he was talking about. He is as crazy as the folks who believe the big bang created them. The atheists fought the Big Bang Theory tooth and nail, because Christians embraced it as being consistent with the Biblical account. Atheists preferred the Steady-State Theory of the universe, which denied that all matter and energy had a beginning point.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,725 Likes: 2 |
Nah, not even close. Maybe try again?
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Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,663
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,663 |
Dunning-Kruger and confirmation bias are strong in this thread! Amen, brother.
“When debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
- Socrates
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Posts: 13,443 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,443 Likes: 8 |
tdoyka, great story. Given today's very advanced CGI technology, it would make a blockbuster movie! Big box office bucks! BTW, your real name wouldn't be Isaac Asimov, Jr., would it??  L.W.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." (William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830s.)
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Posts: 32,219 Likes: 7
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 32,219 Likes: 7 |
The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,518 |
tdoyka, great story. Given today's very advanced CGI technology, it would make a blockbuster movie! Big box office bucks! BTW, your real name wouldn't be Isaac Asimov, Jr., would it?? L.W. nah, i'm a crippled-up stroke survivor. i was raised a Roman Catholic, but i got older and now i'm a Animist (Native American Animism with a little bit of Shinto). i believe that everyone and everything (animals, plants, rocks, rivers, oceans and such) has a spirit. on the other hand, i do believe in science. i don't believe climate change or political "science", like i never had the jab. the God or gods never mention time. time is a human concept, much like inches, yards, miles and such. i do believe that the Earth is billions of years old. human timeline is like a blink of the eye. the Theory of Evolution or Natural Selection is probably right. Homo Sapiens have been around for 300,000 years. Sahelanthropus Tchadensis (i had to look that one up. i only spent a 1 1/2 year at college ;)) was one of the first that walked on two legs some 7 million years ago. you liked the Norse myth (Vikings)? i almost got into that religion. yes, i have read the Bible, parts of the Torah, the disgusting Quran, Kojiki, some Buddhist texts, some Bhagavad Gita and other pagan religions.
"Russia sucks."
---- Me, US Army (retired) 12B & 51B
Russian Admiral said, after the Moskva sank, "we have the world's worst navy but we aren't as bad as our army".
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,443 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,443 Likes: 8 |
Tdoyka, thank you for that information. I have a great respect for creative writing and creative writers. It ain't nearly as easy as it looks (or reads).
Sounds as if you have done a lot of research and reading in the various areas of the supernatural in history's many cultures. I enjoy those subjects too although there is so much information out there I know I'll never come close to reading it all.
Sorry about your stroke. I hope you are able to get around and have a fairly normal life. My late wife died of a stroke brought on by complications of Alzheimer's dementia, and my father died of a brain aneurysm. I sympathize with you, but fortunately it has not impaired your creative thought process.
Hang in there.
L.W.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." (William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830s.)
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Posts: 18,590 Likes: 16
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,590 Likes: 16 |
There are a lotta reasonable people who are passionate about science. And then they’re taught in church…or strongly encouraged…that they must believe in the literal creation narrative in Genesis, even though it appears to contradict by many orders of magnitude the age of the earth and the universe as determined by science (astrophysics and astronomy, etc.). This creates problems for some, especially when they’re told that they gotta believe ALL of it (literally) in order to believe ANY of it.
Many hundreds of years ago they questioned Galileo because he determined that the earth moved when the Bible said that God set the earth on its pillars and it didn’t move.
Anybody here still think the earth is fixed relative to other planets and stars and galaxies, etc. and doesn’t move…?
Does that mean you don’t believe the Bible…?
You can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a fixed earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority. In the same way, you can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a young earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Posts: 31,211 Likes: 9
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,211 Likes: 9 |
There are a lotta reasonable people who are passionate about science. And then they’re taught in church…or strongly encouraged…that they must believe in the literal creation narrative in Genesis, even though it appears to contradict by many orders of magnitude the age of the earth and the universe as determined by science (astrophysics and astronomy, etc.). This creates problems for some, especially when they’re told that they gotta believe ALL of it (literally) in order to believe ANY of it.
Many hundreds of years ago they questioned Galileo because he determined that the earth moved when the Bible said that God set the earth on its pillars and it didn’t move.
Anybody here still think the earth is fixed relative to other planets and stars and galaxies, etc. and doesn’t move…?
Does that mean you don’t believe the Bible…?
You can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a fixed earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority. In the same way, you can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a young earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority. This is a huge problem for those who believe God is infallible. These factual errors in the Bible clearly dispute that belief.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,518 |
Stone Cold Steve Austin 3:16 - I just whipped your ass
"Russia sucks."
---- Me, US Army (retired) 12B & 51B
Russian Admiral said, after the Moskva sank, "we have the world's worst navy but we aren't as bad as our army".
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,590 Likes: 16
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,590 Likes: 16 |
This is a huge problem for those who believe God is infallible. It might be for some, but clearly and certainly not all. These factual errors in the Bible clearly dispute that belief. The error is on the part of those who misinterpret (either intentionally or unintentionally) in order to make what is said fit in with their preconceived bias. I absolutely believe that the universe and the world and life on this earth are God's creation, and I believe that whatever means He used to achieve His creative objectives (the Big Bang, evolution, etc.) was very clever on His part. I see no incompatibilities between science and spirituality. None. I see science as a source of spirituality. The literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story, to me, is stupidity beyond belief. We have factual information that proves that. Jesus referred to Genesis when talking to ancient Israelites because it’s what they knew. It’s the information they were given. They didn’t have the ability to understand the complexities of the universe or creation, so they were given allegory. No big deal. Even Jesus used parables in His teachings, and they are clear examples of allegory. Salvation doesn’t depend on one’s literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story anyway. And a relationship with the risen Jesus doesn’t require an inerrant Bible.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 86,353 Likes: 35 |
The earth is flat, 6000 years old, and the center of the universe.
If you take the time it takes, it takes less time.
--Pat Parelli
American by birth; Alaskan by choice.
--ironbender
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Posts: 132,027 Likes: 63
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,027 Likes: 63 |
There are a lotta reasonable people who are passionate about science. And then they’re taught in church…or strongly encouraged…that they must believe in the literal creation narrative in Genesis, even though it appears to contradict by many orders of magnitude the age of the earth and the universe as determined by science (astrophysics and astronomy, etc.). This creates problems for some, especially when they’re told that they gotta believe ALL of it (literally) in order to believe ANY of it.
Many hundreds of years ago they questioned Galileo because he determined that the earth moved when the Bible said that God set the earth on its pillars and it didn’t move.
Anybody here still think the earth is fixed relative to other planets and stars and galaxies, etc. and doesn’t move…?
Does that mean you don’t believe the Bible…?
You can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a fixed earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority. In the same way, you can choose to interpret the Bible in terms of a young earth but you don’t have to without the Bible losing its authority. Well said.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,725 Likes: 2 |
This is a huge problem for those who believe God is infallible. It might be for some, but clearly and certainly not all. These factual errors in the Bible clearly dispute that belief. The error is on the part of those who misinterpret (either intentionally or unintentionally) in order to make what is said fit in with their preconceived bias. I absolutely believe that the universe and the world and life on this earth are God's creation, and I believe that whatever means He used to achieve His creative objectives (the Big Bang, evolution, etc.) was very clever on His part. I see no incompatibilities between science and spirituality. None. I see science as a source of spirituality. The literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story, to me, is stupidity beyond belief. We have factual information that proves that. Jesus referred to Genesis when talking to ancient Israelites because it’s what they knew. It’s the information they were given. They didn’t have the ability to understand the complexities of the universe or creation, so they were given allegory. No big deal. Even Jesus used parables in His teachings, and they are clear examples of allegory. Salvation doesn’t depend on one’s literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story anyway. And a relationship with the risen Jesus doesn’t require an inerrant Bible. They could have been educated and given the facts. The ancients were just as intelligent as us, just did not have our information and understanding of the natural world.
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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,948 Likes: 6 |
This is a huge problem for those who believe God is infallible. It might be for some, but clearly and certainly not all. These factual errors in the Bible clearly dispute that belief. The error is on the part of those who misinterpret (either intentionally or unintentionally) in order to make what is said fit in with their preconceived bias. I absolutely believe that the universe and the world and life on this earth are God's creation, and I believe that whatever means He used to achieve His creative objectives (the Big Bang, evolution, etc.) was very clever on His part. I see no incompatibilities between science and spirituality. None. I see science as a source of spirituality. The literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story, to me, is stupidity beyond belief. We have factual information that proves that. Jesus referred to Genesis when talking to ancient Israelites because it’s what they knew. It’s the information they were given. They didn’t have the ability to understand the complexities of the universe or creation, so they were given allegory. No big deal. Even Jesus used parables in His teachings, and they are clear examples of allegory. Salvation doesn’t depend on one’s literal interpretation of the Genesis creation story anyway. And a relationship with the risen Jesus doesn’t require an inerrant Bible. Your arrogance is very obvious here. You think you are smarter than Jesus and his listeners? You and all of us today would be considered retarded if we could time travel there.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,590 Likes: 16 |
Some people worship Jesus, and some people worship a book. Some people believe their faith is based on Jesus and the resurrection, and some people believe their faith is based on a book. And those who worship a book and believe their faith is based on a book castigate those who worship Jesus and believe their faith is based on Jesus and the resurrection.
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,725 Likes: 2
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,725 Likes: 2 |
If the bible has errors, it can be wrong about a lot of things, including God.
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Posts: 61,304 Likes: 31
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 61,304 Likes: 31 |
"As for me, and my house, we will serve the Lord."
These premises insured by a Sheltie in Training ,--- and Cooey.o
"May the Good Lord take a likin' to you"
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