Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles Winchester 1895 reduced load

Good evening everyone;
I’m new to the forums but not to shooting. I recently picked up an 1895 made in 1904 chambered in 30-40 Krag. Looking to shoot it, but would like to start with a reduced load and work up from there. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

JR,
Any of the starting loads in a reloading manual will be reduced loads. Lyman #44 lists 47g of IMR 4350 with a 150g bullet producing 2267 fps out of a 22" Krag barrel. That is also the accuracy load. Handloader (July-August 1976) cites DuPont pressure data for 48.5g of IMR 4350 with a 150g bullet as producing 36,300 c.u.p. Shooting cast bullets is a lot of fun in the 95s and the 30-40 is a great cast bullet cartridge. I have had good luck with multiple powders and any 170g - 220g bullet at about 1600 fps. Even in bores that are worn, I can still get loads that are worth the effort.

Good luck and congratulations! The Winchester 1895 is a great rifle, especially in 30-40 with 28in bbls and a longer sight radius.

Chip

Thanks, I have 4350 and some 150g fmj. As for cast, I do have a Lee 170g / 309 mold and a 155g / 312 mold I can try.
Thanks for the reply
JR

I would suspect it would work in an 1895 Winchester also.

I have an 1898 30/40 Krag Cavalry Model. I load it with 30 grains of either IMR 4198 or RL 7,
and use bullets from 170 grain RN/FN, 180 grain RN, 200 gr SP to 220 grain RN.

In the velocity range of the original 30/40 Krags. My model has the 24 inch barrel instead of the 29 inch barrel.
only about 5,000 of the Cavalry Model was made.

I’m going to order a 200g mold and see if I can scrounge up any of the above powders. Thanks for the info.
JR

JR,
I was gong to PM you but I dont think you have enough posts to receive a PM...anyway.

30-40 has been around a long time. I am not the expert but have some experience with multiple 95s over the years. Here are pictures of Lyman 44, 41, 46 and the Handloader data I mentioned. (edited the order so it matches the pictures) On the Lyman 46 are the two loads I have settled on in my two remaining 95s: 180g Horn SST with 44g of IMR 4350 and 220g 308284 with 16g 2400 as cast.

Looking at my 95 data that goes back to the mid 90s:
Up front, I did not have much success with 150g bullets so didn’t spend much time pursuing good loads for that weight.
180g bullets with 44g-45g of IMR4350 have consistently done well in numerous 95s.
220g bullets with 43g of IMR 4350 was consistently good in all but one of my 95s.

As for cast bullets, I cast soft and keep the velocity in the 1400fps – 1600fps range. Lyman 308291 and 308284 have both been great in many of my 30 cal rifles. Shooting cast is a little more complicated than jacketed. Sizing for throat dimensions and lube are added details that matter. Since you have a mold, I wont mansplain the details that you can look up. My 308284 casts .311. I shoot it as cast with Lee liquid alox and 16g of 2400 for 1485fps. 18g of AL5744 does equally as well and yields 1522fps. This is in a well used 95 from 1896.

Hope some of this helps. Have fun researching and shooting that fine old rifle.
(another edit...i have taken deer, elk, and bears with my original 95s. The woods is where they shine!)

Chip

There is a wealth of knowledge here! I looked at the LYMAN website and apparently they dont make those molds anymore. I did an ebay search as well as gunbroker, and none are for sale, but will keep my eye out for these molds. I will check if lee makes anything similar and give those a try. I see my local Basspro has 4350 in stock and will swing by later today and grab some. thanks again.
JR

JR, check NOE molds. He copies several of Lyman designs but, makes them better!

Ideal and Lyman slightly changed names of molds over time. 308284 became 311284, same with 308291 and most if not all of the 30cal molds.

Here's some on eBay right now. Search for these listings.

311284:
375182126120

311291:
155974452028
155944127017
Double cavity!
256367799613

NOE has their version of the 291 in stock.
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/bullet-moulds/308-311/311-173-rn-am4/

I have also had really good luck with 308407 (311407)

Okay, i found the majority of my cast data...not knowing where it was was driving me nuts. It's mostly data from my "newer" 95; from 1898. Throat is .310 on this rifle.

308291, 10g Unique, sized .310 and lubed with Orange magic. OAL was 2.95 and it shot .75" at 50 yards at 1336fps. 9g was slower but gave single digit average and standard deviations and equally small groups. It's like shooting a big 22LR, a LOT of fun!!!

308291, 18g of 2400, sized .310 and lubed with Orange magic. OAL was 2.95 and it shot 1" at 50 at 1749fps. SD and AD were single digit.

308284, 17g of 2400, as cast (.311) and lubed with Lee liquid alox. OAL was 3.130 and it shot 2" at 50 BUT, put 4 of 5 shots into 3/4" at 100yds. Outlier opened that group to 3". Velocity was 1529 and again SD and AD were single digits.

These were all consistent and repeatable loads for me. Only variable was me and my eyesight which...is not what it used to be even corrected. The long bbl helps and i wish my rifles had the Lyman 21 or 38 sight but im not willing to put one on, not even an original.

I did try IMR 4198 but didnt have nearly the success as i did with 2400 and Unique.

Full disclosure, Im NOT a cast guru. In fact, i am super low tech. Im using range lead melted in a large pan and transferred to ingot molds. If i can dent the ingot with my fingernail, I consider it soft enough to shoot. It's a very un scientific method but works for having fun and shooting on the cheap. I try to get as many ingots as I can from one "processing" so that I can use the same batch to cast at a later date. Obviously when a batch runs out, i have to start all over. These loads have stood the test of time and performed equally as well through 2 batches.

Others will have great information to share. gnoahhh, who frequents the Savage collectors forum, has spent considerable time casting. In fact, i see that he's responded to this thread today.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...artridges-two-molds-you-recommend#UNREAD

Chip

Good info here, tag
Bugger

Thank you JOE for the info on the NOE molds,
Thank you chip for taking the time to look up the updated lyman molds on ebay as well as the wealth of load data you have provided for me. will take a look. As for what I cast, i order 5lbs of linotype from rotometals and melt 5 lbs of soft lead to get a BH of 14-16 or so. Have you experimented with powder coating at all? it seems to be in fashion.

I have not tried powder coating but i have tried paper patching. Since im solidly in the "less is more" camp, using liquid alox and trying to stand the bullets up to dry is all the adventure my patience can stand. Paper patching requires a lot of prep to make the papers not to mention a good technique to roll them. Since my goal was to shoot more and fiddle less, I quickly lost interest in paper patching 30cal. If i want to hunt with a 95 (and i do), ill use jacketed bullets. If i want to blast through 50 rounds, playing the "i wonder if i can hit that" game ill shoot cast for the cost of 10 jacketed rounds and no recoil.

Jr, keep us posted about how your loads work out. Would love to hear from you.

Chip

will do
thanks again
JR

I bought the double cavity mold, thanks again.
JR

Using the low amount of powder do you need to use yarn or something to fill the case?

When did the 1895 become the 95?

How rare were the SRC in 30/40 or the one I had was Stamped 30 U.S. or ARMY I can’t remember.

Darned good info there!! Can't add much! ("What? Gnoahhh's at a loss for words??!)

Just a couple add-on's though: The 311284 mold was originally designed with the Krag cartridge in mind. If a fella had one of those molds he can do anything that needs doing with a .30-40. But, and it's a big but, the bullet's nose must be a snug fit in the bore of the gun or accuracy may well be not as good as you hope. Simple test is to take a bullet and press it into the muzzle - if there's even the slightest bit of resistance on the nose portion it should be ok, and if there's zero resistance on the nose portion go look for another mold. That long 311284 (308284) absolutely needs to be fully supported in the barrel. The mold was designed by Dr. Hudson, a famous Krag rifle competitor back at the turn of the 20th century. (And it goes without saying that the base portion of the bullet has to fit the throat, as with any cast bullet.)

My favorite tin can/walnuts/golf balls plinking load for the .30-40 is the old Lyman/Ideal #311241 155gr. plain base bullet propelled by 6gr. Red Dot. It's been long discontinued but they turn up on eBay now and then, or maybe have Tom at Accurate Molds cut you one. Cheap as dirt practice round even with today's stupid high primer costs.

Angus: do not use "yarn" or anything else as a filler with light powder charges. Benefits are minimal at best and if incorrectly employed can cause damage by "ringing" the chamber neck.

(Well, I guess I wasn't at as much of a loss for words after all!!)

Thanks gnoahhh, I picked up a 311291 yesterday on ebay, will, keep an eye out for a 311284. I will make up some plinking loads for fun.
Angus, the 30US IS 30-40 KRAG
Thanks
Jr

Tom at Accuratemolds.com is a wonderful source for the molds you might need. His catalog will show many bullets and if it is not in his catalog he will make your design for you. I will suggest you start by sizing your cast bullets at .310" if not .311", the largest that will fit in the throat of the chamber on your rifle. .310" is probably a safe place to start. None of the loads should require any filler of any kind. That could quickly ruin an otherwise nice rifle.
Good Luck,
Rick

It may be worth it to slug the barrel, thanks for the info on accurate molds
JR