Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only Winchester Classic Classic Stainless 375 H&H

About ready to mount a Leupold 1.5-5 on my 375.

Planned to go with Leupold DD & Low Rings - Bases arrived today and I'm not sure if I'm crazy about the looks. I have another front base that isn't extended, but not sure about the position of it on the ocular once it's mounted.

Didn't really want to spend another 150-170 on Talley Steel bases, but what are some other fairly attractive options or any pics with Leupold DD's installed?

Thanks for any recommendations

I like Warne Maximas. Similar look to Talley.

Here is my Win Classic Stainless 338

Cone Trol is an old skool super clean mounting system.

Honestly though, the Leopoldo Back Country or Talley Light Weight ring/base combo is my preference if you don’t need QD function.

Wouldn't mind trying the Backcountry mounts, as they're a little heavier built than the Talleys but I don't believe the make the correct one for the rear screw spacing.

That's a classic look to me. ^^^

DD's always look good, I don't know what the OP's issues is, without pics.

When I'm not using DD's, I'll use the weaver style cross slot mounts for my heavier kickers. I'll also use steel over aluminum in those instances. Warne and Leupold both make some good mounts/bases. Then I prefer Burris Zee rings, or the Leupold PRW's for more heft on the magnums like the 375 H&H.


Op needs to post a picture, so he can show us exactly what he doesn't like about them.

i have talleys on mine. Only way I would go different would be warne bases and warne QR rings

Another consideration!

The Leupold QD base/rings. This opens up the opportunity to use your iron sights, hopefully never, if necessary. We’ve (wife and I) have been using these on our Model 70’s since the mid ‘90’s, she on her SS push feed .338 WM and I on my .375AI. We have back-up scopes mounted and zero’d in rings.

I tested mine for their repeatability, a couple times by swapping scopes. They came back to their respective zero’s.

I hope to not need them, but they’re there for emergency use, and I have confidence in them! My opinion on them for what it’s worth! memtb

I'll take some pics in the next day or so, when I'm able.

Good suggestion. Some say the oldstyle Leupold QD's are not very strong. The ones I'd use (and have experience with) are the QRW/PRW base, that has the cross slots like the weaver bases, only they are made from steel. Another good thing to use on the heavy kickers. As I stated in an earlier post. However, if the op does not like the location of the DD's, for whatever reason, he's not going to like the oldstyle QD's either. Again, need to see pictures, to know exactly what he's talking about. Then maybe we can offer some acceptable alternatives..

For me the attraction of QD mounts are the ability to have a backup scope along already zeroed. I have them on my Super Express but not for iron sight use, I can’t get my face low enough to use them.

I have the same issue with the irons, but as I mentioned, hopefully the irons are “never” needed. memtb

Good suggestion. Maybe even having the ability to switch to a higher powered variable would be useful. Like memtb said though, it's nice to have irons as well, but I bet the OP's doesn't.. My pre 64 375 H&H's did, but that's not a classic stainless. The op also needs to make sure he orders the correct bases. The ones for the post 64 express models. He probably already knows that though.

That's where the pre 64's shine. The ability to use both, and the factory montecarlo stock is very forgiving.

One thing I found with the Leupold QR mounts (the ones with the stud on the ring bottom) is the rings may need to be lapped to release easily. I have a set that work fine until you torque the scope into the rings, then it's difficult to remove the scope/rings from the rifle. Everything has to be square and parallel for those studs to slide in and out of their respective hole in the base. No, KY doesn't help.

I thought that the Classic SS Model 70’s in .375 H&H came in this configuration! However, I’ve been wrong before. memtb

Good point about that set up. You'd think the receiver would have to be close to perfect too. Some aren't, as you know. I have a set, for an H&H receiver, but have never used them. Decided to go a different direction. The OP is getting some good info here.

QD's are nice if you want back up irons.

This one was too barrel heavy, chopped it to 21" got it fluted which helped the balance and handling.

DF

I handled one quite a few years ago…..yes they were incredibly heavy!

Yours looks good……and I suspect handles even better. For timber/brush work it should be an awesome package! Out of couriosity what does it weigh - scoped, loaded, and slung? memtb

Can’t remember. Will weigh it and post results when I get home from the office.

DF

Here's what I'm currently seeing with the Leupold DD bases I have.

1st pic are the bases that come packaged together with the extended rear and fronts
2nd pic is of a mix of the 1st package and a regular front base
Others are some overall scope positioning

Just not sure about the ring positioning being to close to the objective with the mixture of the two.

I can live with the rear extended base, but the front extended base is a no go for me.

Kinda liking the looks of the Warne QD and it appears they position the front ring a little more back than what I'd be dealing with currently.

Other option is to mount a VX5 2-10x42 that's sitting in the safe vs the 1.5-5 in the pictures.

Dirt - I found reference to your rifle when I 1st picked this up and 1/2 tempted to do the same. I picked this particular rifle up this past year at Scheels for 700+ tax, looked like someone had fired a few shots with the open sites and presume it went back into the safe.

Was one of those deals where I couldn't afford not to buy it. Of course like all things, the rifle was the cheap part as I just booked a cow cape buffalo hunt for next year (pockets aren't deep enough for a bull hunt at this time).

I hope that you felt just a little bit guilty when walking out the door with that…..cause you stole it! I certainly don’t need another .375 H&H……but, I’d have grabbed that one! Congratulations ! memtb

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It never looks right to my eye when a two piece base is cantilevered over the breech.
Looks like your hole pattern is the Express pattern.
1st to 2nd: 0.330" 1st to 3rd: 4.660" 1st to 4th: 5.520"

Maybe use a one-piece base ?

Ah yes. Pics are worth a 1,000 words. One of the reasons I generally don't use DD's on my H&H magnum receivers. I'd go with the steel warne or Leupold QRW/PRW bases. Not only because they won't hang over the ejection port, but they are stronger, you can use QD type rings, plus they are a little easier to work with for fore to aft adjustment, because you can turn the front base around so the slots are more inboard, or further outboard.

Here are some Leupold QRW/PRW mounts on an H&H receiver:


The warne is a little more adjustable than the Leupold, as it has 2 slots in the front mount:


I don't really like that one, because it will either hang off the front of the receiver, or if you turn it the other directtion, it hangs into the ejection port. However, it's there, for cases like the OP is dealing with. I personally modify that Warne mount, and run a longer tube scope, if that is the issue. That's just me though..

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That looks good, BSA.
The OP should re-group and do something like that.

Yes, thank you all...

Plan to order up some Leupold QRW bases and go that route


PS: Yes, I know I stole it and felt good about it My friend I was with was looking at me like WTF when I grabbed it and wouldn't set it back down. I wanted one when they were 1200 or so, but couldn't ever justify it and now with some bringing 2k plus I couldn't resist.

You did very well. Plus that is a 5 digit, which makes it even more desirable. Well done!! I'll bet it shoots very well too.

I goofed a couple years ago and passed a Winchester Stainless 375HH at Cabela’s, it was priced about $850 IIRC. I should not have passed. My 375 HH is a No 1 that needs to shot.
You did alright and with that rifle at $700+. Smarter than me for not passing.

Whats your rifle chambered in? I don’t remember my factory stock have that much texture in it.
Sitting in a hospital bed recovering from a knee replacement, might be a bit before I pull out a stock to refresh my memory. I have a 5 digit Cl. Stainless that needs a replacement factory stock. Someone shortened the original a bit. I have it setting in the factory stock from the rifle above. I do have a MPI or ! Stock I was going to fit on the 5 digit. To somewhat match the 338. I will have to fix the floorplate inlet as its for a 1 piece.

9# 1oz empty.

1.5-6x42 Victory is not a light weight scope. With a Leupold it would be in the upper 8# range.

Balances at the receiver ring, which makes it feel and handle lighter than it did before the ”surgery”. With the OEM 24” “truck axle” it was way muzzle heavy, handled accordingly.

I learned that Winchester from that era, had all their big magnums with the same barrel contour. Of course the .375 had more steel in the barrel than the .416 or .458.

I don’t think I’d want a really light .375 H&H.

This one is a keeper.

DF

Thanks DF…..that sounds like a dream rifle! Exactly what my AI weighs “all up”! It’s a pleasure to carry when hunting, but does jump a bit when shot from the bench!

Had Winchester been making that when I built my AI……I would have had the perfect rifle. As it is, mine is just….near perfect!

Congrats……never let it go! 👍 memtb

Go with Elmer and set you up a standing bench for the big guns. He knew what he was talking about.

BTW, this Classic is a 6 digit G gun, built in 2001.

DF

I don’t think that I could ever get as stable standing at the bench as I could from a seated position.

Thankfully, I don’t have anything that has severe recoil. Maybe once you pass 70 or so ft/lbs recoil, tiny groups cease to be that important! 😂 memtb

Yours is. The OP's looks like a 5 digit classic. I think Winchester should have made them more like yours to begin with. Or even a little lighter contour. A fluted 375 H&H EW would be a cool rifle. One with factory irons, and 22" barrel. Yours is just about perfect DF.. Even with the factory stock, as I know you probably bedded that one right, with Brownell's steel bed or something like that. I'm an odd ball though, I like the factory tupperware stocks. I always paint them, and install a better recoil pad, and glass bed them, but that's all they need, to be made serviceable and more appealing.

Not quite as stable but pretty good for a big boomer.

I was sighting in my buds .416 M-70 with 400 gr NPT and SAF’s at 65 yds. Was able to get some pretty good groups.

DF

I was at the grand opening of Walmart in Anchorage in spring of 1993.
Got mine NIB then and there while the Mom & Pop shops cursed the big box store come to town.
I had not seen one anywhere else before Walmart came to Alaska.

Mine was destined to become a .375 WBY MAG by a simple chamber reamer cleanup with the 2001 CIP version,
shorter throated than the 1945 version and very accurate.
Shot my tiniest 3-shot group ever at 100 yards with a hot handload and a custom 300-grain bullet.
The tupperware stock was replaced with an HS Precision.
Empty, iron-sighted rifle with QRW 2-pc bases weighed 8 lbs 11 oz.
Screws were 8x40-ed by gunsmith when it was re-chambered.
Pictures incoming ...





Rear scope base can be reversed for no overhang, but have to be this way to fit the old Leupold 2.5-8x36mm.
The Leupold 1.5-5x20mm works with no overhang of rear base.

Nice rifles gents!




I think I have Warne bases on mine, and I could likely flip the front looking at the pictures, but for now, I am leaving it as is. I think I used Leupold BC rings on mine with a plain old 6x42 with dots.



Tried an old M8 4X and liked the 6X more.

Awesome rifle…..in functionality and accuracy, plus a nice little “improvement”! 👍 The “only” thing that keeps it from being “perfect” is the weight, get her under about 9 1 or 2 loaded/scoped/slung……then you have the “PERFECT” rifle! 👍👍👍 memtb

9#, 1oz or so can be affected by the scope. The one I posted would be in the high 8 # range with a smaller Leopold glass.

To me, the scope I mounted is worth the cost and weight. Its light gathering is top notch. One guy who hunts Africa commented what a great leopard combo that would be. Makes sense.

DF

Yeah, those barrels are really accurate, more so than one would expect.

I have a bragging 3 shot target, too. Not easy to duplicate, but sure if nice when you shoot one like that.

Those big bores are often surprisingly accurate.

DF

Indeed ……good glass can add weight. I used the Leupold 2.5-8, built when Leupold still had a great reputation for making quality scopes…..it never failed me (us). About 10 years ago we stepped-up to a Leupold 3.5-10 CDX due to our relocation to an area where longer shots were the norm. The jury is still out on it’s longevity.

With the aforementioned 3.5-10, my rifle (.375 AI) weighs-in at 9 lbs. 1 oz scoped/loaded/slung. When shooting from the bench, an extra 2 or 3 pounds would be “sweet”…… though, knocking off about 2 pounds would be awesome on a hard day of mountain hunting! 🤔😉

I’d be pretty comfortable with either the 2.5-8 or the 3.5-10 on that Leopard hunt…..but, I think that your Victory would be the better choice! memtb
memtb

Nice rifles guys. If those won't get it done, I don't know what will..

They can be sleepers regarding factory barrel accuracy. I was surprised, as well as others, on how well they can shoot

You’d think only high end custom barrels could shoot those kinda groups.

And I’ve noticed how well big bore can shoot. Pretty amazing.

DF

Just about every .375 H&H I've seen have shot lights out. When you shoot a ragged hole group with one, though it always seems extra special. My 9.3x62mm was the same way. Just something about the big bore rifles. A lot of them seem very easy to please. The reason I told the OP, I bet it shoots lights out. He did well on that rifle.

My only suggestion would be to check the factory hot glue bedding, and make sure it's at least still in the stock!!!!


I've had 2 or 3 classic stainless model 70 rifles look like this. They got properly glass bedded in a hurry. You know about glass bedding a model 70, so I don't have to tell you, but the OP needs to be warned.

I jerked that hot glue out with pliers, Steel Bedded the lug and forward action. I know bedding won't stick very well to Tupperware, so I drilled holes in and around the lug area so the Steel Bed would lock itself in the action. It worked. That stuff is way better than what they use at the factory.

Just didn't like the way it looked, although it must work OK or they wouldn't have done it that way. Good enough for them just not good enough for me....

DF

Exactly. You know I do the same exact thing. Drilling the holes is important too, to lock the bedding/epoxy in. Works great. Those that complain about bedding these stocks, probably don't do that little trick.. Along with roughing it up pretty good, to give the epoxy something to bite in to. I've never had an issue with a properly bedded tupperware stock. The ergo's fit me well too. They are a tad bit heavy, but on a 375, that isn't a bad thing..

Yeah, failed to include roughing up the surfaces.

That little trick of drilling holes at different angles is the way to make it work.

Finished product sure did beat the factory “quick bed”. Good beats quick in this case. That Steel Bed ain’t gonna move.

DF

Edited to add, that’s why I didn’t replace the Tupperware, the ergonomics are perfect for me. And they are a tad heavy, but on a big boomer, that’s OK.

My Classic Stainless .375 had a wandering zero problem due to the hot glue gun bedding. I used the situation as an excuse to buy a McMillan Supergrade pattern. That was a great buy years ago, glad I'm not trying that today.

Getting rid of that hot glue bedding is the first thing to be done with a Model 70. I've found its often the only problem they have.

Yeah, the McM is a better stock, but with their current pricing, I'm gonna stick with the improved Tupperware with better bedding.

Not a bad stock with bedding fixed. Not that pretty, but it's a working gun. Not gonna worry about scratches and dings.

DF

Exactly.
This is a wood stock, but they do the same thing on the tupperware stock models:



Pretty poor practice and material:

But don’t ya know it’s fast and cheap.

I don’t think bedding is the place to skimp.

But if you never take it apart, who’s gonna know.

That won’t pass muster here with us Loonies.

We’ll find out.

DF

Ha ha. That's for sure.

My stainless classic is bedded to a Bansner stock and shoots very very nicely. I’m not a classic snob so I solved my scope mount concerns with a picatinny rail. The Nxs 2.5-10 is probably overkill but I like to see what I can do at longer ranges (600+) for fun so that’s what I use.

The bipod is only on there for the picture.

The FN-made Winchester M70 .375 H&H Alaskan came from factory in 2011-2012 (USA assembled)
with good epoxy bedding of action recoil lug and tang.
Ditto the 2014-2015 version assembled in Portugal from South Carolina parts.
Those are walnut stocks.


Anyway, I think y'all are making a mountain out of a mole hill
when it comes to a little overhang of scope base at rear of action.
Look at how Ross Seyfried did his Remington M700 .416 RemMag and called it professional:





Here is my old M70 Classic .416 RemMag before I re-barreled it to .458 WinMag,
with just a little bit of overhang at rear seen as tolerable,
but no good for front overhang!



Here, I fixed it with a hacksaw:



Overhang at the rear allows for decreased potential for Weatherby Eye Brow,
and I find it no impediment to loading and ejection.

Here are a couple of the old M70 Classic RUM actions with QRW bases for 0.330" hole spacing on the rear/bridge,
drilled bigger for 8x40 screws (404 Jeffery on top, .500/.338 Lapua Magnum Improved below):









Last rifle above has a Connecticut Classic Tupperware stock on a Pre-'64 M70 .30-06 action re-barreled to .458 WinMag,
epoxy bedded as y'all have described above, and it is a bugholer.
Everybody I know hates the hot glue beddings.
Notice that the front base overhang above was not yet corrected by hacksaw, to perfect this one.

Regarding hole spacing on a lighter weight .375 H&H Winchester M70 Alaskan:
Same as on the Connecticut Classic M70 Stainless Synthetic













Convert .458 WinMag to .375 H&H-length-COL-capable with three drop-in parts:
sheet metal magazine box,
bolt stop,
ejector.

I like the Leupold PRW rings and mounts. They are basically a stronger version of the Weaver system.

While the BACO's do have a little nicer bedding on their rifles, and it looks like they use a better epoxy than the NH rifles did. A lot of them I've seen are not what they are calling, "good glass bedding from the factory, right out of the box". Have you seen some of these bedding jobs??? If you have, and you've dealt with some accuracy issues, you'd know the bedding wasn't worth a schidt, about 8 times out of 10. That is a better track record than the hot glue bedding. I'll give you that.

Also, there's nothing wrong with guys wanting their mounts and rings to be aesthetically pleasing to the eye. Personally, I don't like bases to hang out into the loading/ejection port. I'm not going to argue about what I like, because we are not all the same there. If it does not bother you, that is great. To me, it looks like dog schidt.

Well, to me bedding is an easy fix. I don’t expect much from the factory, so I’m not easily disappointed.

Without much expectation, there can be little disappointment.

DF

Yep, mass production and individually hand tuned have their differences.

For sure.

DF

Jackphantomhuckleberryhounddog (his AKC registered name) knows the difference between "dog shidt" and Shinola.
He says this 6#12oz empty-unloaded .375 H&H Pre-'64 M70 is Shinola,
even though a longer-tubed scope had to be used to avoid scope base overhang:



And this is not Shinola:



That is a Weatherby Eyebrow waiting to happen, but it sure is pretty with no scope base overhang.
The unnamed plinker was using very light cast bullet loads on that Youtube video.
Surely he would do better by his scope for loads that kick a little.
Ross Seyfried's rear scope base schtick was Shinola.

Here is my own idea of special purpose Shinola, hand machined by me with a bastard file.
After the Gunsmith drilled and tapped the 8x40 holes, I attached the bases with J-B WELD glass bedding
all around, including the integral recoil stop on the front base, and "thumb cut" between the 2-piece Picatinny bases.
I call this a "Seyfried Double Schtick" not a double "dog shidt":



Near Mfg. makes a nifty one-piece Picatinny rail with recoil stop to fit Winchester M70 rifles of various hole spacings,
with tilt or without.

Here is that factory epoxy bedding,
on the 7#10oz empty-unloaded .375 H&H Winchester M70 Alaskan from South Carolina:

Of course, a .375 H&H is pretty gentle on a walnut stock.
I would let the factory job above go as is unless problems arose.
For serious use I would Cerakote the metal and stick it in a B&C "Medalist" stock weighing same as the factory walnut.
Sweet.

Hard kickers do need more attention.
A more thorough job of reinforcement and bedding is needed for those,
examples here on two different .500 Mbogo rifles,
both CZ 550 Magnum actions,
one in the factory "Phat American" laminate stock that came on a .416 Rigby,
the other in a B&C formerly called "Kevlar" then "Aramid" by CZ-USA,
always the same "Medalist" from B&C:

Here is the old "Euro Lux Hogback" walnut that got same treatment as the laminate above:



Then moved to a B&C with thorough bedding:

Details of B&C bedding of .500 Mbogo number two, not doggie number two, follow below.
First, here is the factory epoxy bedding blob that CZ USA did, on the 550 Magnum (originally another .416 Rigby)
discarding the F-block and escutcheon with screw on the barrel recoil lug contraption,
leaving only a remnant lug bedded into the aluminum alloy endoskeleton of the B&C stock:



There was no other bedding epoxy anywhere else, idea being to let the rifle bed itself into the exposed aluminum.



First step in the custom job, re-barreled to .500 Mbogo with recoil lug on barrel:



And what followed in a multi-step bedding job, I did myself:











That is what I would do to the .375 H&H Alaskan M70 if I did not trust the factory bedding job on the walnut: B&C

The heavy barrel and a 2.5 pound stock on the Connecticut M70 Classic Stainless are fine for a .375 WbyMag re-chamber.
I hesitated to do it to the 7#10oz SC Alaskan .375 H&H.
Even more so to the 6#12oz Pre'64 .375 H&H.
First Buffalo with a featherweight .375 H&H, was a mad cow that was killing the sheep on this farm in KY, she had to go:















Bloody left hand in pocket.

Front sling swivel……that’s the reason that I had my swivel mounted on the barrel.

That’s a good place for rifles of heavy recoil. It also lowers the muzzle considerably if you carry it slung on your shoulder….which I very rarely do! memtb

So far, I have not had violent hand contact with a sling stud. But, they do seem to be tough on range bags, if I locate them wrong and allow too much rearward momentum.

I never had swivel contact with my old, heavy H&H. But, after reading about many bad experiences with African hunters and high recoil rifles, I thought it might be a good idea to put the swivel on the barrel of my relatively lightweight AI when it was built. memtb

Riflecrank,
Pretty cool collection of thumpers you have there.
I like the front swivel stud location on the end of the forend. Nice idea.

Thank you for the flowers, JD338.
I first learned of that forend tip sling stud from ogling Ross Seyfried rifles in G&A 40 years ago at least.
I suppose others did it too.
Here is a Jim Brockman piece I have put on a couple of my Thumpers if I want to make them heavier,
embedded and covered with epoxy in the barrel channel,
little knob on end is all that is exposed, hanging out below the barrel:

Anyone know what barrel band sling swivel stud fits these barrels?

New England Custom Gun has a good selection of barrel bands.

Here's my 375 H&H M70 ready for brown bear in a few months.

Now that’s a great carry rifle weight…… with the added weight of a sling and fully loaded, it should be a pussy cat to shoot! Good Luck on that bear! memtb

I've got a Nosler M21 375 H&H Mag with a Leupold VX-5HD 2-10x42mm mounted in PRW rings on a 2 piece picatinny rail that came with the rifle. Pretty solid setup. Rifle weighs a tad over 8 pounds.