Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Long Range BS

Then you better include the 100 yard hunters to, spend some time at a range before hunting season and see were some guys rifles shoot or comments " minute of deer or elk is good enough.
Your problem is you wanna say all LR hunters are " slob " hunters. Theres plenty of slob hunters to go around in each category you choose to put them in in.
How about we just put them all in just one.

Spicy talk, folks.
Geezer here, still hunt sheep , mule deer and our local mountain goat every year.
Steep country, often available cover but requires more patience and planning to make this play.
This is how we were taught, going back a few generations that predated modern rifles and optics.
The skill is in your ability to close the distance, to verify the horns or antlers are legal, sheep hunters have had their rams away because they were 1/4" short on one side, during mandatory inspections...by experienced Sheep hunters.
I can sometimes see the Sheep and Goats on our "Sheep Mountain" with my optics. I also hear the long bombs attempted , y'know rifleshots spaced long enough to make a adjustment sometimes 8-10-12.
Across a valley, or from the truck or quad.
This makes me cringe, my guess is many of those hunters won't put the 2 hours into crossing the valley to check.
More importantly, they could of likely connected with a wounding shot and just might of killed and left a mature 10 year old ram on the mountain.
This ram suffers and dies( watch for the birds) the shooter has taken a nice legal ram out of the picture.
The long shooter heads down the road.
I only wish postional shooting practice was the current rage, and the equipment , the rifles etc was the talk of the mountain.
I love our wildlife species! I sometimes love our livestock as much. Their livestock's destiny is secure, they will be killed. All forms of killing must include little risk of suffering to any animal.
This is not a video Game, folks
My little old opinion

My guess you and I are real close in age 63 week ago I still get in the rugged mountains after M.D.and Elk ive been on sheep, goat hunts. So because I choose to take a shot on an animal or pass on the shot at LR make me a slob hunter?
How about the bow or crossbow hunter who brags about those 100 yard shots?

I am older than you, 66.
Maybe that is why I don't recall using the word- slob.
I do know what I have experienced, worked as a Game guide for various outfitter's until I got too old.
I will say this, unless you are proficient shooting offhand, sitting kneelng and prone , able to keep your shooting in the black( 8 ring) you will wound Game at extended ranges.
I wish hunter's spent more time on positional shooting as practice rather than long shooting.
It would also make them a superior long shooter,
Shooting without dialing, wind calc , bullet spin drift
and the rotation of the earth.
Use you hunting and stalking instincts, or you will lose them.
God Bless, take care

comerade;
Top of the morning to you my cyber friend, I hope you all are getting spring like we seem to be a half dozen valleys west of you and that you're all well.

As another older hunter, I'm about a year and a half younger than sherm 61, who has also been blessed to be out on a whole bunch of grand adventures where we sometimes brought meat off the mountain, I approach some of it this way.

When teaching our spring BC CORE Hunter Safety course each spring at the gun club, the topic of "how far away can I ethically shoot" has come up since I started which was 35 years ago now I see.

My reply has been modified somewhat over the years, but more or less I'll tell the students a couple things, the first of which is that if they can hit a regular old pie plate every time from that shooting position with that hunting tool, they're good to let fly.

Now not 9 out of 10 times comerade, but 10 out of 10 when they're practicing.

We all know that there's a different amount of excitement that hunters experience when shooting at game and I'll ask them to be as honest as possible with themselves about that too.

The other thing I tell them is that they need to mark the spot where the animal was, head over to it and check to make sure they missed it.

In a lifetime of hunting I'm sure many, well likely most of us have seen where mortally hit animals don't react much if at all. Younger or less experienced hunters don't have the benefit of this field experience so I encourage them to be extra diligent in that regard.

One that comes to mind for me was a 2 point mulie that was leisurely walking at maybe 200 yds when I hit it with my .338 Win Mag. My late Dad was watching with binos and he first said, "What happened?" as he assumed first that I could shoot better and second that the .338 would knock it flat.

As I recall now comerade, I was digging another round out of my pocket it continued its stroll and presently collapsed, but I'm sure we've all seen similar reactions.

Was a good lung shot by the way, likely behind the shoulder as it was there I'd aimed.

Anyways that's just a few thoughts on shooting at any game from another older BC redneck and nothing more.

Best to you all.

Dwayne

Once again you wanna lump all hunter in the same category. How much do you think I shoot? What distance? Rest or bipod? Etc.
You have no idea we are all just LR bad hunters can't get close, no skill, just take unethical shots blah blah.

It is possible to do both.

It is also more common that folks who take game at distance, also take game close up, and everything in between.
Ditto on Jordan's comment above me.

Jordan;
Morning my friend, I hope all is as well as can be in your world. Hope the family is all well too today.

For sure and certain, I can safely say from our discussions that you practice shooting a bunch AND that you've seen many more animals hit than most hunters, much less a beginning hunter.

There's a fellow here locally who teaches long range shooting and in discussions with him and an instructor there, they've said there are younger hunters who do very well at the shooting part but who still have some issues out hunting.

If I could summarize their thoughts, it'd be more or less that experience level one gets after seeing "enough" stuff hit and react.

I've used "enough" in quotations both because I'm at a loss to quantify what that might be and then too Jordan I don't recall how many animals it took for me before a few dots got connected or better said started to get connected quicker.

Hopefully that made sense?

Again my thought is to just urge the hunters who loose an arrow or bullet at game to go take a look before coming to the conclusion it was a miss.

Nothing more than that.

All the best to you all as we head into Easter.

Dwayne

Listen up swamptard. My range is in my back yard. I shoot out there whenever I want and that is several times a week in the off season. I was out there shooting yesterday. When I shot competitively I not only had the highest off hand and kneeling averages in a league of 144 competitors, I placed in the top 3 at the State championship 3 years running, took high individual one year and still hold the record for the highest score ever fired in a match by a first year competitor. I'm pretty sure I know how to shoot and do it pretty well. Most of my practice today is done off hand where I maintain the abilty to consistently hit a 2" target from 65 yards. This is how I practice most because most of my shots are fired off hand at deer that are less than 65 yards away when hunting with a rifle. It has done me well as my success rate has been 100% since I killed my first buck 50 years ago. Since then I've killed somewhere between 225 and 250 deer by my best estimate. I stopped keeping track many years ago now and no longer have an exact count. My freezer is still 3/4 full of venison right now, the walls in my living room, bed room and reloading room are covered with antlers and mounts and there are boxes of antlers in storage because I have no room to hang more. Oh and one more thing. Baiting or feeding deer is not legal here and there are no food plots or farm fields in the State forest lands where I've done most of my deer hunting.

How some narrow minded people define a "hunter" is pretty laughable.

We considered anyone who could fill a freezer an accomplished hunter. Dad thought antlers mattered. If not for legal requirements, I would leave the antlers in the gut pile for the wolves to chew.

I have killed a couple of 4x4 mule deer, a 5x5 bull, and a 6x5 bull that many would consider nice. The antlers all went to the county dump after the meat was transported home.

Hell, I would much rather eat a doe or a cow.

We typically ride our horses several miles and about 3000 feet in elevation in the dark, to start a day's hunt. At the approach of legal light we look for game which can be seen from the trail while horse back. The trail is near the ridge top, and the view goes for miles.

If game is spotted a mile away, we ride closer. If it is within 500 yds, we stop, dismount, drop the reigns and kill the game.

If nothing is seen on the ride in, we have a couple of favorite look out points with great views, and lots of big rocks to use as a bench rest.

Both of the aforementioned bulls were shot from this same lookout point. One finds a comfortable seat and then lasers trees and rocks in likely shooting lanes.

In the old days, before lasers, we would recreate on the same trails during the summer on horses or on dirt bikes, while carrying our rifles. We would bet on range estimations off of the trail. Then we would shoot big boulders for confirmation.

The 5x5 bull was spotted coming up out of a canyon at about 800 yds. I watched him take a few steps and stop and look over his shoulder, again and again. I picked the point in the trail to kill him. It was a nice open saddle where four trails intersected. It was 400 yds to the trail in that saddle at just about a 30 degree down angle.

I carried a Ruger #1 in 7mm STW with 162 gr Hornady btsp at 3200 fps over H1000 with an old Burris FF 4-12 duplex. It was zeroed to be a couple inches high at 300 yds. At 400, I held just a little high on the ribs, considering the downward trajectory.

When he stopped to look over his shoulder, I touched the trigger.

The first bullet hit him in the aortic arch from the left side. He jumped two times uphill, then turned around and stood with his nose in the dirt of the trail. I dropped another slug into his heart from the right side. He picked up his head, and started walking away from me in that saddle. I dropped a third round into the pocket in front of his right hip. It also ended up in the pumping station. Then he walked out of sight. He made it about another twenty yards, right into the middle of a water covered bog.


The old grand daddy 5x6 was killed a few years later, again at 400 yds. Only this time he was nearly 30 degrees uphill. My first bullet entered the right ham, traversed the kidneys, and came to rest in the back portion of the left back strap. Eventually he turned and presented a broadside shot. I put a bullet into his heart, at which point he fell.

There was no blood in the thoracic cavity, as he had completely bled out through the kidneys.

No, I will not try a shot on game beyond 500. I know where to hold under at closer ranges and have killed plenty of deer at 100 to 250 yds. I don't have to mess with turrets. I know my trajectory. Shooting ground squirrels all spring with a 30-06 zeroed at 300 yds will do that, You only have about a 1.5 inch vertical target.

When you observe an elk traveling cross country, there is no opportunity to stalk him. In ten minutes he will be a mile away, two or three minutes if he decides he needs to run.

I suppose, by most definitions here, I ain't a hunter. Nor am I a long range shooter. I know my limitations and work within them.

Well I’m sorry you feel that way about the moose, despite it being quite the deflection from my point. I’d agree with the 99% sure of a first round hit thing…if not bumping it up to 100%.

I won’t endorse folks who lob rounds at critters without being confident in their ability, but there are people who can and do make 600+ yard game shots with much, much more reliability than many hunters do at 100 yards. Many of those guys with the ability also have the discipline to hold their shot if conditions aren’t right, regardless of the distance. I can’t say that with the same confidence about people who insist only shorter range shots should be taken or allowed.

Some people have ethics and other’s don’t, however they’re defined.

Carry on, I guess.

Whatever range you can be sure of placing a quickly fatal shot is ethical. Whether it constitutes "hunting" or not is a matter of opinion and debatable. I'd like to see someone who can consistently place their shots with precision under field conditions at 600 yards and beyond but so far no joy. Jim over on Backfire issued a challenge a few weeks ago to anyone who believes they can hit 100 one gallon jugs in a row at various, random distances out to 600 yards to come and prove it and he would pay your air fare. So far there have been few takers and the couple who have tried failed to maintain even an 80% hit rate. Jim claims he has shot with some of the best in the Country and has yet to see anyone who can do it. I would say step up and take his challenge and go prove it if you can. Last I knew he was still waiting to hear from you and would like to see it himself.

I have no clue what ‘Backfire’ is, nor who this Jim person is but he hasn’t been waiting on me. I’ve never made the claim that I could shoot like that but it doesn’t mean that nobody can. I have said many times here I am way more of a hunter than a shooter. I get bored very easily with paper or steel targets.

600 yards isn’t terribly far this day in age. There are a few people on this forum and elsewhere that I suspect could reliably make those shots but they’re generally the more modest and less talkative type.

I don’t know what to tell you dude, other than to keep an open mind about things.

Long Range shooting is a Hell of a lot of fun and very challenging, I feel shooting at distance will improve your shooting and equipment and loads you can practice from any position you chose at the distance you choose shooting is a diminishing skill if you don't shoot regularly your skill will diminish no matter the range, as for shooting a critter at distance that's up to the shooter hopefully they make good choices and good shots. YMMV Rio7

"Backfire" is Jim Harmers youtube channel. He is reaching out to a pretty big audience with that challenge.

I use my ethics, they are a personal indiviidual thing, I use my abilities, not yours. have taken 60 whitetails beyond 450 yards, dozens beyond 600, and a handful beyond a grand. you don't like it, don't do it just leave me be. when I do not recover one that I shoot then you can bitch,, till then mind ya business.
3 shots from my hunting rifle at a lazered 752 yards.

4 shots at 1004 in a 9mph wind

Yessir, Dwayne. Agree with everything you said.

I hope you have a Happy Easter weekend with your loved ones!

LOL.

He had one chucklehead that flinched so bad he couldn't see his shots.

Guy was shooting a 8lb .300 win mag and it was a 100round session.

He did not know how to dial his scope and didn't dial his scope. The fact you think this is an example of a mildly competent LR shooter show how clueless you are in this discussion.

I could tell he was a boob as soon as I saw what rifle he brought but I think he's probably typical of a lot the guys who THINK they're competent. I've seen way too many of those over the years to think otherwise. There's another guy that has his own youtube channel, saw the Backfire challenge video, tried it on his own at his locale and also failed miserably. He is a long time Western hunting guide and if I remember correctly was using a 7mm Rem. Mag.. I think he got 5 in a row at 600 before he missed a jug. Obviously you can't reliably place a shot in the vitals of an antelope at 740 yards. That was real impressive. Makes one wonder how many animals you've gut shot off camera over the years. Probably a lot more than you'd ever admit to. When are you or one of the other "competent" long range shooters here going to be getting in touch with Jim Harmer so you can take the challenge and prove you're up to it ?