Home Forums Gear Hunting Trucks and Four-Wheel Drives I’m mesmerized by a tire !

The road to my place is a mutha fugger. Every set of tires I’ve ever seen traverse the path, even with brand new tires, comes back the first trip with chunks, cuts, or damage of some sort. This is regardless of street, mudders, or A/T’s. The last set I used was a set of Toyo Open Country AT3, I got 25K out of them.

Just for chits, I went to the Michelin Defender LTX MS2. Upon return of my 16th trip, not a scratch. Mine are an XL load running 29lbs.

Bizarrely over the years every flat or ripped sidewall was on an LT with more plys and especially MT’s where a piece of flint cuts in between the lugs.

Its flint, limestone, gravel comprising both, and bowling ball to basketball sized boulders comprising both. I noticed the treadwear number is “820”. I don’t know how in the hell they do it but so far tough as nails.

I’ve watched other tires get ate up or sliced through regardless of what they are.

Not surprised. Michelin doesn't market like the others. But no joke:

I've seen 35 inch Michelins balance with less than a 1/4 oz of wheel weight per tire

Tires that looked "mundane", cleared mud at less than 5 mph.

I ran Michelins on a lifted/locked HDJ 81 landcruiser.

I have a set of MS2’s waiting for me at my tire store for install tomorrow. 295/70-18’s. Done with the 20’s on my truck, going back to my old wheels and 18’s.

Michelin Defenders are on a every vehicle we own. I’m an avid reader of Consumer Reports and Michelin tires are always rated #1 or #2 overall.

Had them on several SUVs and they were always top-notch for ride/noise and durability.

Maybe just a touch more sideways slip while climbing wet rock. Mud isn’t a factor for me because the mudholes are scattered with flint and other rock so you won’t sink to the frame. Also with this environment the last thing you wanna do is spin the tires up to clear them because you are likely to rip a hole in them.

They seem to climb about as well as MT’s where I go. Tire flex matters more than tread in my opinion.

Had Defenders on my 4Runner, have them on the wife's Outback, and will have them on my F150 when it's time.

Back in January on a cow elk in NM, we spent a couple of days sightseeing the ranch as we killed our cows early in the hunt. Two identical pickups, both F-350 long beds, 20" tires. My buddy was running a very popular, well known, and fairly aggressive AT tire. I'm running Defender MS2's.

Every steep draw we came out of I watched him in 4wd spin all four tires, throw rocks, slide, etc. getting up the hill. The same places I climbed out with barely a spin.......often in 2wd


Bill

Its a bizarre deal for sure. I actually get the most slip (not much) in freshly wet city streets. More than other AT’s I’ve used. Maybe the 820 Tread rating ?

I’m one of those guys that pushes things once in a while, I tried pushing a screwdriver through the Ms2 and it wouldn’t go but pushed it right into a Nitto Ridge Grappler.

They make you rethink conventional thinking especially concerning the extra sidewall tread and rim protector features.

Yall made me look these MS 2 up, I thought they would be the greatest thing since sliced bread, these would work out on my wife’s Grand Wagoneer , it’s all wheel, 4 wheel drive, but here on ranch those tires wouldn’t get out of drive way, I have the biggest 35” muds on my Power Wagon, and feed trk, not laughing at Michelin at all, but come on!

Maybe next time you break trail.

Lol, there’s only one way to know for sure.

I’ll tell ya, this goes way back but I think this might be a thing. Couple guys I used to work with swore by them also. One was non stop in hunting and rodeo scene and other was ex gm parts guy liked his big fifth wheel and boat life. So bit of a mix. You’ve spent money on worse things so see if Johnny really is loco lol...personally I think he is.

Now we had set of those thrown on an older ranger for my kids first truck here and then bought some used winters online in good shape and these defender ltx ms went back on after first drive in the snow, no comparison lol. So maybe there is something to this?

I’m only concerned with the abrasion resistance on my specific route. I have a particular 5 mile stretch going in that starts eating other tires on the first trip. My last set which were Toyo Open Country 3 AT lasted better than any other tire and they were about shot at 17k but I kept pushing them.

I’m a big fan of the Mickey Thompson Baja Boss AT and Cooper SST Max for all round tire but suffer the same fate on this trail.

The softest ride on this particular stretch were General Grabber AT3 but they suffered the same fate. The MS2 Defender does ride pretty good over this stretch of trail.

I’d love to try the Toyo M-55 but they are too rich for my blood

Installed mine this weekend. Initial impressions are great. Very smooth and quiet. My truck doesn't see much off roading and is a daily driver. For playing in the mud, I have this.................

I totally understand using a street tire that has thick ply tire and high side walls, nothing eats tires up like rock roads, but for mud and snow and any kind of clay, you have to have big self cleaning lugs, like I said I will remember this tire for car, we drive as much on dirt as pavement.

I'm a rancher too, but admittedly we are in somewhat rocky country maybe compared to you. I can see where they wouldn't work in boggy country.

That said, mine see a lot of rough gravel roads. It's 1 1/2 miles one way of gravel ranch road to the house alone, my tires don't have a single chip one in them...

Bill

Thats my point, thick plys and extra rubber on the sidewalls is absolutely meaningless for my circumstances

Trip 22, a few small cuts that resemble a sipe but no chunks or pieces missing.

Trip 22, a few small cuts that resemble a sipe but no chunks or pieces missing.

Did find a nasty cut completely through the lug and into tire a bit on my gator using maxxis big horns.

Trip 31, one small nick looks like a sipe

Thinking about shooting one of these tires to see what happens

Well, I’m gonna have to take back what I said about the Michelins. I have used the Defenders exclusively on my trucks for 10 years, and have had stellar service and good life with them. Smooth ride, quiet and great wet weather performance. The updated MS2’s, not so much. Shortly after install, about 200 miles on them, they developed some shake at 40-65 mph. Back to the tire store. When spinning them up on the balancer, you could see some pretty severe lateral runout on 3 of them. I could watch the tread and shoulders move from side to side up to 3/4” on one of them, the others about 1/2”. Tire store owner ordered another set and we tried them. Had to index them multiple times to get road force values below 30lb, still some tread squirm visible on the replacements. I told him I would try them out, as I had to drive to Miami the following day to pick up an engine and transmission.
Same deal, initially they were acceptable, but not as smooth as the old Defenders were. As I got further down the road, the shaking got worse until my only options were to drive at 50mph, or above 80. You know which option I took.
Got back to Atlanta the next evening in a foul mood and went back to the tire store. Ken, the owner, called the Michelin rep and put him on speakerphone. I think Michelin knows there is a problem. The rep told Ken “Make your customer happy. Get him out of those tires and put something on that works, Michelin will compensate you for the tire work.”

On the store’s recommendation, I had a set of Nitto Recon Grapplers installed. I watched the road force balancing, and there was very little runout on any of the tires. The best one road force balanced to 11lb, and required no weight at all. I got the truck out on the interstate this morning and felt no vibration all the way up to 100mph, so I’m happy.

The Nitto’s are noisier (To be expected, more aggressive tread pattern A/T tire), and the Michelins had a much softer ride on irregular surfaces. But I’ll easily give that for the smoothness at any speed.

So, my confidence in Michelin tires (At least their truck line) has taken quite a hit. I have them on my BMW 5401 and my M635Csi (Sport 4S’s) and they are superb, but for me, no more on my truck.

Badger, How much pressure are you running in your tires? I had trouble w/2-ply sidewall (E-Rated) tires and running 65# or less. I have an ‘11 F250. The sticker on the door says 65PSI. I need to run 70#+ to keep the shimmy-shake down. We tried a new steering stabilizer @ 30K Mi, didn’t help, finally service guy asked me to run the tires up to 75#, smooth as glass.

2-Plu sidewalls were giving me too much “Sidewall-Flex” @ lower pressure.

Take it for what it’s worth.

70 front and 65 rear, unless towing. Then 70 front and rear. The truck was glass smooth with the Gen 1 Defenders at those pressures, this was immediately evident with the MS2’s. Same pressures now with the Nitto’s, and no vibrations. Both brands are “E” load range.

I can run Nitto Exo Grapplers @ 65PSI due to their 3rd sidewall belt.

A few more trips and tires are still holding up, no chunks or slits upon inspection.

Maybe because of the rubber compound I do get an extra spin on freshly light drizzled pavement in town.

They also do not have an off-road look, if they could make an AT or MT with this compound I’d buy them tomorrow.

I did notice BF Goodrich has the K03 now ?

The oval Michelins, and their replacements............



Tire store owner called me on Wednesday to tell me that Michelin doesn't want those tires back for warranty inspection. "Scrap them" was their instructions. I guess they must know that this particular run has issues...............

Drove to Richmond Va from Atlanta last Thursday hauling my old BMW on a trailer for a car show. Came back Sunday. It was a much more pleasant trip than the Miami run. A little noisier, but smooth. I'm happy.

They look like truck tires now, nothing worse than tire problems, especially wobble, you look at everything on highway trying not to start the shimmy.

Lol leave it to a Texan to make this a deal...lol

Naw, leave it to my tire eating flint rock ranch road to make this a deal. I’m astounded these tires aren’t taking any hits. I’ll give any tire a fair shake.

I still wanna shoot one to see if its bullet proof.