Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Do You Believe the Earth is 6000 Years Old?

Native Americans also have legends of medicine men turning into birds and other assorted bullschit. So detailed accuracy isn’t necessarily their thing. The point as to the flood legends is that they exist. It would be a stupid and foolish exercise to attempt to look for detailed accuracy in Native American legends about events that if they happened, were five thousand years in the past.

We have the DNA and archeology which demonstrates the American Indians came from other parts of the world and has inhabited the Americas for much longer than 6k years.

You guys should hone your argument and reasoning skills. You always assume things not argued or in evidence and then try to jump twenty seven steps ahead to refute some point only made in your own minds.

To be clear, I believe that there is a Supreme Being. Call it God, or whatever makes sense in the language that you understand. The Bible has several names for the same Being. As to the alien part of the previous post, God, Angels, the Devil, all are from somewhere other than earth, Thus Aliens in our current language. How the come and go is mostly a mystery, Space ships are a possibility. Did Angels have wings? Or to the uneducated of thousands of years ago, they flew, so they must have had wings. Trying to make sense of how things were back then, compared to life now, takes an open mind, study, and faith that you have it correct. miles

What you fail to grasp is that there is no real evidence that anything happened, that it's not just another one of the embellished tales told by the ancients, written by people who had no interest in critical inquiry, where the purpose of the writers was to promote the faith, build a religion.


What we have written decades after the described events, contradictory as it is, doesn't establish anything. And the fantastic claim of the son of God coming to life and ascending into Heaven needs more than contradictory accounts to support it.

The fact is, we have no means of determining what really happened, and there is no reason to believe in fantastic claims because somebody wrote it two thousand years ago.

Your little dummy spit tough guy act shows just how immature you are.

That’s fine and completely immaterial from my assertion that there is plenty of physical evidence for a massive flood or floods and many legends of such around the world.

You guys should hone your argument snd reasoning skills. You always assume things not argued or in evidence and then try to jump twenty seven steps ahead to refute some point only made in your own minds.

And you too, base your argument solely on unproven, unknown, hypothesis and theory....and proceed to proclaim the belief in God, Jesus, the Bible, is unproven, unknown, hypothesis and theory. Go suck start a Glock and prove once and for all to us there's no Heaven and Hell.

Joe Bob, it's you who's creating a straw man. No on is arguing that floods don't occur. We are discussing the Biblical flood of Noah that allegedly covered the entire earth with water higher then the highest mountain, and wiped out every land born creature expect a single family and the critters they could fit on a single boat.

To any reasonably objective person the Noah Flood story as portrayed in The Bible is clearly not literally true, and by extension, any theology that depends on its literal truth is not true. The same can be said for the Garden of Eden, The Exodus, and Mythicist argue the same can be said about the life, death, and reresection of Jesus.

You just can’t help yourself can you? I simply said that there is ample evidence for a gigantic flood or floods on a massive scale and that for Christians these could serve as evidence of Biblical truth and for others as evidence behind the Biblical flood myth. That’s it. I’ve said nothing else. I’m not here to argue minutia with you. I’m not here to give anyone my subjective opinion of what makes an “objective” person. Now, carry on with your personal crusade.

That’s fine and completely immaterial from my assertion that there is plenty of physical evidence for a massive flood or floods and many legends of such around the world.

You guys should hone your argument and reasoning skills. You always assume things not argued or in evidence and then try to jump twenty seven steps ahead to refute some point only made in your own minds.

Lake Bonneville was the largest Late Pleistocene paleolake in the Great Basin of western North America. It was a pluvial lake that formed in response to an increase in precipitation and a decrease in evaporation as a result of cooler temperatures. The lake covered much of what is now western Utah and at its highest level extended into present-day Idaho and Nevada. Many other hydrographically closed basins in the Great Basin contained expanded lakes during the Late Pleistocene, including Lake Lahontan in northwestern Nevada.


Shorelines of Lake Bonneville are visible above Salt Lake City along the western front of the Wasatch Mountains and on other mountains throughout the Bonneville basin. These shorelines appear as shelves or benches that protrude from the mountainside above the valley floor, are visible on the ground from long distances and on satellite images, and have both depositional and erosional segments along their lengths. Three shorelines of Lake Bonneville that can be traced throughout the basin, have been given names: Stansbury, Bonneville, and Provo. The Stansbury and Bonneville shorelines formed during the transgressive phase of Lake Bonneville; the Provo shoreline formed during the overflowing phase. Numerous other unnamed shorelines, which cannot be mapped everywhere in the basin, some of which formed during the transgressive phase and some during the regressive phase, are also present on piedmont slopes and alluvial fans. At its maximum, when Lake Bonneville was more than 980 ft deep and almost 20,000 sq mi. in surface area, it covered almost as much area as modern Lake Michigan although its shoreline was more complex with many islands and peninsulas. Great Salt Lake, Utah Lake, and Sevier Lake are the largest post-Bonneville lakes in the Bonneville basin.

Lake Bonneville was not a proglacial lake although it formed between about 30,000 and 13,000 years ago, when glaciers at many places on Earth were expanded relative to today during the last major glaciation. For most of its existence (that is, during the transgressive plus regressive phases) Lake Bonneville had no river outlet and occupied a hydrographically closed basin. Changes in lake level were the result of changes in water balance caused by climate change (a simplified version of the water-balance equation is inputs equal outputs plus-or-minus storage changes). Storage changes are equal to volume changes, and changes in volume are correlated with changes in lake level. When inputs (e.g., precipitation; runoff in rivers) were greater than outputs (e.g., evaporation from the lake surface; evapotranspiration in the basin), lake level rose, and when outputs were greater than inputs, lake level fell. Changes in global atmospheric circulation led to changes in the water budget of Lake Bonneville and other lakes in the Great Basin of western North America. Mountain glaciers in the Bonneville drainage basin stored less than 5% of the water that Lake Bonneville held at its maximum and so even if all of the mountain glaciers in the basin melted at once and the water flowed into the lake (that did not happen since it took thousands of years for the mountain glaciers to melt, and Lake Bonneville was falling by that time), it would have had little effect on lake level. Lake Bonneville had no river connection with the huge North American ice sheets. While Lake Bonneville existed, the patterns of wave- and current-forming winds were not significantly affected by the Laurentide and Cordilleran ice sheets in northern North America.

Lake Bonneville began to rise from elevations similar to those of modern Great Salt Lake about 30,000 years ago. During its transgressive phase in the closed basin (an endorheic basin), lake level oscillated because of changes in climate but the lake gradually rose until about 18,000 years ago when it reached its highest elevation, marked by the Bonneville shoreline. At that level the lake had risen to the lowest point on its basin rim and had begun to overflow into the Snake River drainage near Red Rock Pass in what is now southeastern Idaho. The overflow, which would have begun as a trickle across the dam formed by the Marsh Creek alluvial fan, quickly evolved into a tremendous flood, the Bonneville flood, which charged down the Marsh Creek valley to the Portneuf River, into the Snake River and then into the Columbia River and Pacific Ocean. Groundwater sapping on the north slope of the Marsh Creek alluvial fan, which began long before the lake had reached its highest level, added to the instability and ultimate collapse of the fan-dam.

The Bonneville flood probably lasted less than a year, during which time almost 1,200 cu mi (5,000 km3) of water flowed out of the lake basin with a maximum discharge of about 35,000,000 cu ft/s. Downcutting during the flood through the Marsh Creek alluvial-fan deposits and into the underlying Neogene sand, mud, and landslide debris, caused lake level to drop about 430 ft. River flow from the lake across the Red Rock Pass threshold and out of the lake basin continued non-catastrophically for about 3000 years after the flood ended; the Provo shoreline formed during this overflowing phase. The Provo shoreline is distinguished from other shorelines of Lake Bonneville by its topographic position, strong development, and thick accumulations of tufa. At the end of the overflowing phase, about 15,000 years ago, climate change and a shift to a negative water balance (more water evaporated off the surface of the lake than entered by rivers or direct precipitation) caused the lake to return to its closed-basin status as it declined to lower levels during the regressive phase. By 13,000 years ago the lake had fallen to an elevation similar to the average elevation of modern Great Salt Lake. During the regressive phase lake level declined approximately 660 ft in about 2000 years because of a change to warmer and drier climate. 660 ft is roughly 2/3 of the maximum depth of Lake Bonneville). Although Lake Bonneville and the Great Salt Lake are collectively one lake system, the name “Lake Bonneville” is applied to the lake during the period from 30,000 to 13,000 years ago, and the name “Great Salt Lake” since 13,000 years ago.

Lake Bonneville was anomalous in the long-term history of the basin. As the largest of four deep lakes in the basin during the past 800,000 years, Lake Bonneville plus the other three deep Pleistocene lakes, persisted for less than 10% of the time. The conditions experienced in the basin today are typical of over 90% of the past 800,000 years: a dry desert basin with a few scattered low-elevation lakes, the largest of which (Great Salt Lake) was hypersaline. For most of the time between the end of the youngest of the deep pre-Bonneville lakes (the Little Valley lake cycle, about 150,000 years ago) and the initial rise of Lake Bonneville about 30,000 years ago, the lake would have resembled modern Great Salt Lake in surface area and depth. A short episode of slightly higher lake levels during the Cutler Dam lake cycle occurred about 60,000 years ago; at this time a moderate-sized lake rose above the level of Great Salt Lake, but not as high as Lake Bonneville.

“With respect to Jesus, we have numerous, independent accounts of His life in the sources lying behind the Gospels (and the writings of Paul) — sources that originated in Jesus’ native tongue Aramaic and that can be dated to within just a year or two of His life (before the religion moved to convert pagans in droves). Historical sources like that are pretty astounding for an ancient figure of any kind. ...the claim that Jesus was simply made up falters on every ground. ... like it or not, Jesus certainly existed.” - Bart Ehrman, world renowned Biblical scholar, and atheist

So your position is essentially that of Arthur C. Clarke, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.", or gods.

Somebody skipped kindergarten and learning how to play nice with others.

That boat, aka "The Ark," was a really big boat. Was it a sail boat, or did Noah just shut it up tight when it started to rain, and he and his family just floated around hither and yon for a year or so, until the waters receded?? If it were a sail boat, did Noah and his kids know how to sail such a huge vessel, and where did they get the experience to sail a large boat in very serious weather and seas??

Just curious.

L.W.

My bad, I have very little tolerance of Godless heathens like you and that kangaroo humping nitwit from "Aussie". I'll never deny being a Believer, but I'll never brag about being good at it.

Satan knows the Scriptures.