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Originally Posted by ldholton
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
I don't have enough experience with mine to love them yet. I suspect it will take a while. I have been thinking about a Shadow Systems. I am interested in how you like it.
well as you can see mine is just the Foundation line so it's nothing fancy. it's pretty much a Glock with a dress on I guess you could say.. the slide and all's nicer the interchangeable back straps slide on you can get Miguel's form that easily go on but also included in the fancier models.
standard cut rifling not polygons.
the rifling is deep cut looks good looks real good.
so far I haven't shot it and have to make a fair assessment.
the trigger is flat-faced but feels exactly like a Glock.
the elite and better series are supposed to have better triggers and the shoe was also aluminum on the higher end stuff where this one is just plastic.
to my understanding and the appearance of all internals are interchangeable with Glock. the optic cut on the slide as well thought out and well done with lots of options. the owner's manual is probably the best owner's manual I've ever seen come with the firearm. the back side is metal and just blacked out the front side is metal with a white dot. and they are tall enough to still use with the optic on.
really don't know what else to say tonight I'm going to shoot it and try to get the optic adjusted and sighted in..
that might give me a better idea on how accurate it is or maybe I should say how accurate I am with it cuz I'm sure that's the limiting factor.
well I got around this afternoon to zeroing the optic on this Shadow systems..
I'm calling this good enough for now might slightly fine tune it if I can put better groups together later or if it checks out different at a further distance..
I did lots of research on the best place to zero a red dot on a handgun and of course there's all kinds of stuff out there but I decided to try 15 yards..
I will probably stick with that on the little sig 365 and I might experiment with going further with the shadow system gun.
and of course I screw up the last shot or it would have been better than it is..
it's very windy here today so I'll use that is the excuse... I haven't really shot paper groups with a pistol and quite some time so I don't really know how good or bad it is..
the groups with the little p365 last night weren't quite as tight as that but close with the same ammo.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Last edited by ldholton; 04/16/24.
GB1

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[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]


this gun shoots this particular load here which is different in the first picture better than anything else I've got shoots it. looks like maybe a little bit of fine-tuning might be pretty good...

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I'd love to be able to do that off hand at 15 yards. I call that pretty darned good shooting.

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Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
I'd love to be able to do that off hand at 15 yards. I call that pretty darned good shooting.
thanks Paul, it's nice to have a civil conversation with you..

I'm going to go outside and make sure hell ain't froze over.
😁😁

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Originally Posted by ldholton
Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
I'd love to be able to do that off hand at 15 yards. I call that pretty darned good shooting.
thanks Paul, it's nice to have a civil conversation with you..

I'm going to go outside and make sure hell ain't froze over.
😁😁

You are alright in my book brother, but let's not stop giving each other hell over bicycles.

IC B2

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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
I'll take a high speed, low drag, option, personally, rather than attaching all kinds of electronics to my defensive handgun in the hope of compensating for lack of skill.

In my opinion "dots" are still the new "thing", and a lot of people who are just getting into handguns or who don't shoot a lot, have to have one. They probably will not ever use them enough to become proficient with the dot sights. If you go to an indoor range and look around its easy to verify that this is a strong possibility within the shooting public.

OTOH I believe that they do make a good shot better, and are easy to use for those that practice with them and learn how to use them.


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The common problems people have, or often just fear having with red dots are pretty much negated by buying quality and mounting so the sights co-witness with the irons.


What fresh Hell is this?
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I have a Holosun 507Kx2 on my P365XL. I really like it. When I was a younger man (mid 20’s to mid 40’s) I was deadly accurate with an open sighted handgun. I always qualified Expert. Now that I’m in my 60’s, I just can’t focus in the sights and the target at the same time. From zero to 21 feet I’m still very accurate with open sights. Once I get to 50-75 feet my accuracy suffers. That’s my main reason for the 365 with the optic. As for having to worry about the battery, changing the battery in your handgun optic is a matter of being responsible enough to keep track and change it on a regular basis. Just like you need to clean and lube your auto pistol on a regular basis. Or change you carry ammo from time to time. That’s my take on it. IDHolton, I think you will come to love your optics.

Ron

Last edited by Ohio7x57; 04/17/24.

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Originally Posted by ldholton
Originally Posted by domit
tell us what you really think only after say 1000 rounds,
I kind of figured that
my preliminary thought they will be quite fun on a range/match/fun gun.

the CCW type gun I'm a little bit don't know..

I bought a g45, dropped in a Glock performance trigger, and mounted a holosun scs. I’ve got a couple thousand rounds through it now and carry it everywhere. I absolutely love it. From 3 yards to 50.


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Originally Posted by Pappy348
The common problems people have, or often just fear having with red dots are pretty much negated by buying quality and mounting so the sights co-witness with the irons.
Not really. Once you condition your brain to look for that dot, that's it. When the "balloon goes up," therefore, you will look for that dot and, not finding it, will keep looking till your conscious brain figures out something is wrong, which is a waste of vital seconds durig a life or death struggle.

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Originally Posted by Ohio7x57
As for having to worry about the battery, changing the battery in your handgun optic is a matter of being responsible enough to keep track and change it on a regular basis. Just like you need to clean and lube your auto pistol on a regular basis. Or change you carry ammo from time to time. That’s my take on it. IDHolton, I think you will come to love yiur optics.

Ron
What you're saying is that it's one more thing that could possibly go wrong, so it becomes one more thing regarding which you need to take measures designed to forestall its occurrence.

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The Holosun 507K and 507C that I have the battery last more than a year. Just change the battery on your birthday and good to go always. If the dot fails for some reason then just use the co-witness sights.



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The same guy that doesn't see the dot won't see the iron sights.


Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Ohio7x57
As for having to worry about the battery, changing the battery in your handgun optic is a matter of being responsible enough to keep track and change it on a regular basis. Just like you need to clean and lube your auto pistol on a regular basis. Or change you carry ammo from time to time. That’s my take on it. IDHolton, I think you will come to love yiur optics.

Ron
What you're saying is that it's one more thing that could possibly go wrong, so it becomes one more thing regarding which you need to take measures designed to forestall its occurrence.

Brother, I have no bone to pick with you. You seem like a nice, intelligent man. I have carried a sidearm every day since 1985. In situations where my life depended on it. I have total faith in my ability to use the optic in a tight situation, and my ability to use the backup sight. I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Take care and be safe!

Ron


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Just human nature, my friend. Thanks for the kind words.

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Originally Posted by Ohio7x57
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Ohio7x57
As for having to worry about the battery, changing the battery in your handgun optic is a matter of being responsible enough to keep track and change it on a regular basis. Just like you need to clean and lube your auto pistol on a regular basis. Or change you carry ammo from time to time. That’s my take on it. IDHolton, I think you will come to love yiur optics.

Ron
What you're saying is that it's one more thing that could possibly go wrong, so it becomes one more thing regarding which you need to take measures designed to forestall its occurrence.

Brother, I have no bone to pick with you. You seem like a nice, intelligent man. I have carried a sidearm every day since 1985. In situations where my life depended on it. I have total faith in my ability to use the optic in a tight situation, and my ability to use the backup sight. I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Take care and be safe!

Ron
Change batteries (rifle and handgun optics) when the time changes, even though they probably don't need it.
Then.........train.
There is no downside to optics in the real world for folks who spend the time and ammo learning them.


�Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.�
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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Pappy348
The common problems people have, or often just fear having with red dots are pretty much negated by buying quality and mounting so the sights co-witness with the irons.
Not really. Once you condition your brain to look for that dot, that's it. When the "balloon goes up," therefore, you will look for that dot and, not finding it, will keep looking till your conscious brain figures out something is wrong, which is a waste of vital seconds durig a life or death struggle.

Realistically speaking, during a “life or death struggle” no sights will be needed.

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Oh it would be so nice if the fight we got was one we were ready for….

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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Pappy348
The common problems people have, or often just fear having with red dots are pretty much negated by buying quality and mounting so the sights co-witness with the irons.
Not really. Once you condition your brain to look for that dot, that's it. When the "balloon goes up," therefore, you will look for that dot and, not finding it, will keep looking till your conscious brain figures out something is wrong, which is a waste of vital seconds durig a life or death struggle.


You know how I know that you have not been properly trained with a red dot equipped handgun, without you even saying so?

This statement right here: "Once you condition your brain to look for that dot".

Doing that is 100% doing it wrong. This is why people struggle, shoot them for a year or two, waste tons of ammo, then give up. Learning properly from the start would save you hundreds of dollars in ammo and countless hours of frustration.

Think of it like your computer screen and the cursor is the red dot. You don't grab your mouse and look at the cursor and follow the cursor to where you want it.

You look at your target, then you grab your mouse and move your cursor (red dot) to the target. When it is there, you click. Boom.

I have been shooting handguns with iron sights in a professional capacity for decades, and it did not take me long to make the transition to an RDO. The advantages are not deniable and they are not a fad. I can grab a handgun with iron sights or one with an RDO and feel comfortable carrying either. Today, I had an iron sighted G19 on, but tomorrow I may be carrying my G22 with RDO and I am fine with either.

The fact is that with good (proper) training from someone who knows what they are doing, it is not hard to pick up the skill set.


THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL.

The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world.

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Yup.

Was just doing some drills yesterday with the dot occluded with masking tape. Made little to no difference.

But some folks that don’t know will continue to write volumes how bad they are lol


MAGA
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