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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2011
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I have only shot High Power target faces in Kongsberg, however their newer systems allow for animal targets. https://www.kongsbergtargets.com/hunting/Good but expensive targets. The Silver Mountain E-Target allow for animal targets also.
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Joined: Aug 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37 |
To my question, I like this scope but have not used it for hunting, some same non-illuminated, FFP not so great for hunting, can't say myself but I'm most interested in what would be considered max range for a 10x scope, speaking target here, not live game (that to come later with practice, dialing for MOA and MOA trajectory confirmation).
I've heard all sorts of ideas/formulas, such at 1x per 100 yards, etc... That also depends on the reticle and the type/size of target. It will work beautifully for targets this size:
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37 |
You never answered my question how do you know how well your gun shoots doing load development if you can't even hold center or close to a 5" in circle on a paper target? You have easily induced 3-4" of error in your groups That is something a lot of these stupid mother fu ckers don't think about. Good post.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37 |
I guess I challenge anybody who thinks a 10x scope is all you need put up s 5" bull on a 1,000 target ant see how man times you can hit it or exactly how your shooting. After all 5" is .5 moa at 1,000 or 2.5" at 500. They won't take you up on your "challenge". Trust me. I'd use my NF ATACR 7-35x56... Just sayin. Jordan likes to think he knows a little about this schidt. A 10x scope is at a disadvantage for hitting small targets at both 500 and 1,000 yards. Trust me on this one..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37 |
You never answered my question how do you know how well your gun shoots doing load development if you can't even hold center or close to a 5" in circle on a paper target? You have easily induced 3-4" of error in your groups First, I did answer. Second, I can certainly resolve a 5” circle on paper at 1000 yards using a 10x scope with good glass. I don’t do load development at 1000, but I do shoot groups at that range. You were talking about a 10x SWFA earlier. Is that really "good" glass. Asking for a friend..
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,302 Likes: 37 |
This is an old discussion here in the LR forum
Sherm is right and that’s exactly what I do
If I’m shooting a target or an animal at LR, I want the highest power my scope provides.
Most of the time, I’m at max power and I don’t have problems finding the target in the scope because I know how to point a rifle with my naked eye first
Every big game animal I’ve shot at long range has been the scope’s max power. And that means 20 to 25X I agree.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,576 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
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I guess I challenge anybody who thinks a 10x scope is all you need put up s 5" bull on a 1,000 target ant see how man times you can hit it or exactly how your shooting. After all 5" is .5 moa at 1,000 or 2.5" at 500. They won't take you up on your "challenge". Trust me. I'd use my NF ATACR 7-35x56... Just sayin. Jordan likes to think he knows a little about this schidt. A 10x scope is at a disadvantage for hitting small targets at both 500 and 1,000 yards. Trust me on this one.. Show me where I said otherwise.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,576 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
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You never answered my question how do you know how well your gun shoots doing load development if you can't even hold center or close to a 5" in circle on a paper target? You have easily induced 3-4" of error in your groups First, I did answer. Second, I can certainly resolve a 5” circle on paper at 1000 yards using a 10x scope with good glass. I don’t do load development at 1000, but I do shoot groups at that range. You were talking about a 10x SWFA earlier. Is that really "good" glass. Asking for a friend.. Yes. Good, not great, but good enough to get a lot of LR work done.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,576 Likes: 8
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,576 Likes: 8 |
You never answered my question how do you know how well your gun shoots doing load development if you can't even hold center or close to a 5" in circle on a paper target? You have easily induced 3-4" of error in your groups That is something a lot of these stupid mother fu ckers don't think about. Good post. Aren’t you frequently posting pictures of 0.5 MOA groups you shot with a Burris 3-9x at 500 yards? As long as you can consistently resolve your aiming point, 0.5 MOA capability is 0.5 MOA capability. In the last few days, I used 9x to shoot a few groups that went way sub-0.5 MOA, while aiming at a POA that was ~0.5 MOA.
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,943 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,943 Likes: 2 |
They won't take you up on your "challenge". Trust me. I'd use my NF ATACR 7-35x56... Just sayin. Jordan likes to think he knows a little about this schidt. A 10x scope is at a disadvantage for hitting small targets at both 500 and 1,000 yards. Trust me on this one.. Here’s another “stupid mother fu cker” that won’t take up a challenge. Trust me on this! It sounds like your die is sizing the necks down too small if it's pulling that hard. Also do you lube the inside of the necks? I had a FL die that sized the necks down so much that they split on the second or third reload if they weren't annealed. Sent it back to RCBS with a couple of fired cases and they honed it out. You also may want to take the stem out and gently chuck it in a drill and polish the expander ball. Best suggestion here. Along with setting up the expander for the proper depth. Guys saying you need special bushings and chidt are clueless. Unless you are shooting benchrest, our of a benchrest rifle, and demand some kind of extreme precision. I'm assuming not, since this is a "big game rifle" reloading forum. A regular ol RCBS die will suffice. That is all that is even required for most precision longrange shooting as well. I watch guys like the OP struggle, because they think they need unnecessary chidt. Keep it simple and you'll have less problems.. I guess I'm one of the CLUELESS ONES. last time I looked dropping the proper bushing in a die and sizing your brass was about as simple as it gets. Hell with making the expander in 'just' the right spot. Anytime BSA you wanna see how me and my CLUELESS rifles shoot come on by Havre way well go to the 900 yard range you bring yours I'll bring my CLUELESS ones.
Last edited by SLM; 04/30/24.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,266 Likes: 9
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,266 Likes: 9 |
They won't take you up on your "challenge". Trust me. I'd use my NF ATACR 7-35x56... Just sayin. Jordan likes to think he knows a little about this schidt. A 10x scope is at a disadvantage for hitting small targets at both 500 and 1,000 yards. Trust me on this one.. Here’s another “stupid mother fu cker” that won’t take up a challenge. Trust me on this! It sounds like your die is sizing the necks down too small if it's pulling that hard. Also do you lube the inside of the necks? I had a FL die that sized the necks down so much that they split on the second or third reload if they weren't annealed. Sent it back to RCBS with a couple of fired cases and they honed it out. You also may want to take the stem out and gently chuck it in a drill and polish the expander ball. Best suggestion here. Along with setting up the expander for the proper depth. Guys saying you need special bushings and chidt are clueless. Unless you are shooting benchrest, our of a benchrest rifle, and demand some kind of extreme precision. I'm assuming not, since this is a "big game rifle" reloading forum. A regular ol RCBS die will suffice. That is all that is even required for most precision longrange shooting as well. I watch guys like the OP struggle, because they think they need unnecessary chidt. Keep it simple and you'll have less problems.. I guess I'm one of the CLUELESS ONES. last time I looked dropping the proper bushing in a die and sizing your brass was about as simple as it gets. Hell with making the expander in 'just' the right spot. Anytime BSA you wanna see how me and my CLUELESS rifles shoot come on by Havre way well go to the 900 yard range you bring yours I'll bring my CLUELESS ones. Wouldn't hold my breath waiting on a BSA follow through! Just sayin, ha ha.
Too close for irons, switching to scope...
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,943 Likes: 2
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,943 Likes: 2 |
I definitely wont be holding my breath.
Trust me on this one.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,679 Likes: 47
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,679 Likes: 47 |
TOUGH crowd. Have some compassion,she's STILL trying to get 108's in her fhuqking 6x45 upper. Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!...............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,474 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,474 Likes: 3 |
Didn't Hathcock make his legendary 50 BMG shot with a 10X?
Did he know you can't possibly make those shots with a 10x?
He must notta had the interwebs to keep him honest.
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General John Stark.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,991 Likes: 7
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,991 Likes: 7 |
Didn't Hathcock make his legendary 50 BMG shot with a 10X?
Did he know you can't possibly make those shots with a 10x?
He must notta had the interwebs to keep him honest. In the book I thought he used an 8X Unertal
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,815 Likes: 1
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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The original question was: but I'm most interested in what would be considered max range for a 10x scope, speaking target here, not live game (that to come later with practice, dialing for MOA and MOA trajectory confirmation) My answer would be out to 800 to maybe 1000 yards. The reticle looks good (if I looked up the correct one) it is .2 MOA Dot. The accuracy of the rifle and ability to read wind will be bigger factors. I like doing load development at 300 yards. Far enough to see what is going on and not far enough to have too many wind induced bad shots. Those things being said would a 24 power be better at 1000 yards? Shooting targets, absolutely. Same holds true for 100 yards or 200 yards also. With quality glass and proper reticles I will always take higher magnification for targets. No different than using a sling in High Power vs using a rest in F-Class. You will shoot better on a rest. My view on hunting is a little different, lighter scopes are little better I guess, and even though I regularly shoot long distance I limit myself to around 500 yards on game. First picture is iron sights at 600 yards with a .308 bolt gun. After the first record shot (or two) the last 18 or 19 are sub 2 MOA. This was shot using a sling no rest. Windy day, had trouble bracketting the wind. The second picture is a 4.5 power scope on a service rifle. Again sub 2 MOA and had I paid a little more attention to my position (shot 9) and the wind (shot 18) it would have been much smaller. No sighters (EIC) match with 12X's. This was shot with a sling. Wind not too bad, but switchy. I don't shoot my 6MMBR and 24 power scope much anymore, but with it the group would definitely tighten up If I would take the 6BR and put it on a rest with the 24 power scope it would be easy sub moa at 600 yards on 20 shots. The point is the better the equipment, the better the magnification, the better the rest you will shoot better at any range. But that does not mean a 10 power scope will not work well at 600 or 800 yards, or further.
Last edited by Mike70560; 04/30/24.
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Joined: Sep 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,474 Likes: 3 |
An 8x? what was he thinking!?!?!?!?! Didn't Hathcock make his legendary 50 BMG shot with a 10X?
Did he know you can't possibly make those shots with a 10x?
He must notta had the interwebs to keep him honest. In the book I thought he used an 8X Unertal
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General John Stark.
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Joined: Jun 2005
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 2,266 Likes: 9 |
Thanks for posting Mike. Just for discussions sake, not seeing much difference in vertical between scope vs. irons in those two groups. Toss out the worst two for elevation on each group and the irons group may even hold vertical better. Horizontal is a variable due to different wind conditions. Nice shooting for both.
Too close for irons, switching to scope...
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,365 Likes: 13
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,365 Likes: 13 |
You never answered my question how do you know how well your gun shoots doing load development if you can't even hold center or close to a 5" in circle on a paper target? You have easily induced 3-4" of error in your groups First, I did answer. Second, I can certainly resolve a 5” circle on paper at 1000 yards using a 10x scope with good glass. I don’t do load development at 1000, but I do shoot groups at that range. You were talking about a 10x SWFA earlier. Is that really "good" glass. Asking for a friend.. Yes. Good, not great, but good enough to get a lot of LR work done. The 6 and 10 SS’s work dandy for me. I’ve done quite decent with both of them. Decent glass and a great reticle help alot. I’ve never ran out of hunting light with the 6x either.
Semper Fi
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,991 Likes: 7 |
Weaponry. "Hathcock generally used the standard sniper rifle: the Winchester Model 70 chambered for . 30-06 Springfield cartridges, with the standard 8-power Unertl scope."
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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