Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics Nightforce vs. Swarovski, S&B, Zeiss?

As an owner of a few Leupy's, I have to wholeheartedly agree....

Let me see if I get this right. Leupolds illuminated reticles are very troublesome, and not state of the art ? In spite of the fact that they sell no less than 11 models so equipped ? If they were no good, how come they sell so many ?
You say you are going over to Conquests. I didn't see any Conquests equipped with illuminated reticles the last time I checked. If it such a great idea and Conquests are such great/better scopes, how come they aren't so offered ? E

I'm agreeing with the "Leupold is always about the hype, never about the performance." I don't give a rats ass about illuminated reticles from anyone. Leupy is the marketing king, not the optic king.

That they are. Not because of razzle dazzle ad hype, but because they offer something practical that works. And keeps on working, any where, any time and have for many years. Ever wonder why S&B's aren't more popular ?
I don't care about illuminated reticles either. That's becuse I have no use for them. Even at night. E

You are right that the reticle is critical for shooting in low light,I learned this the hard way. Being able to clearly see the target and not able to see the reticle is not any fun. One of the worst offenders is the regular duplex style.

I prefer the Euro style 4A,heavy enough to see,fine enough to shoot at longer distances.


Britt

There are also more Honda Accord's sold than Lexus LS 430's......

And the best selling music is hip hop by far. Care to argue that this reflects quality? If so, yu be trippin' bro!

John

Hard to be of higher quality than Lexus.....

Yup, that's correct. A couple examples of "state of the art":

Give them time E.The Conquest line expands all the time.Rest assured that when they do it will be more useful than anything lupie makes.
dave

E, the only reason you don't need illuminated reticles at night is because you have never shot against someone using a good one.

I have a couple of S&B's and a Nighforce and there is no way to compare a standard reticle to any of them. It would be like flying a biplane against a P-51. You could have fun in the bi-plane but don't start a fight with a guy in a P-51. You'd hate what happened next.

By the way, the illumination is great during the day, also.

SS

Ever hear of advertising & lack of knowledge. In the European market where illuminated reticles are very standard(of course, the European hunter knows nothing about this technology) Leupold has no market. Most US hunters purchase this type of scope simply because it appears to be a gimmick & I doubt few actually use it for night hunting. Zeiss makes many scopes with illuminated reticles & I have used them. Have you? The reason Conquest are not available is obvious if you read lines 4 & 5 above. Why can't you discuss a topic you know something about? I do a lot of night hunting including predators in Texas & elsewhere, & assorted big game in Europe & Africa. Yea, I know you parrot JJ Hack(whom I respect & has extensive experience) but Thur out Europe hunters use this technology. If they only knew how to fo--- a Leupold. Guess I just can't type the word. Would love to be able to afford a S&B Flashdot for an upcoming African trip. I will be doing some culling day & at night.

E if you ever hunt at night the USO is one to take a look at as well. If you hunt in the field at night which I know you don't do because of where you are you would find this very useful... If you compare the S&B PMII or the USO to the Loopy you will be in for a suprise. Of course you do pay for performance...

Here we go again, wanting to actually test something first hand for an informed opinion.

Here's the thread where JJhack was asking about a Scopes for night hunting coyotes.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...&topic=0&Search=true#Post1958422


His old Leupolds didn't have the resolution to make out coyotes against a brush background. Maybe he didn't adjust them properly .

E, please quit misquoting people.

The truth is that Leupolds are good scopes for the money. However there are other scopes that are better.
Reticle choice is very important for low light shooting. I prefer a 4a reticle to a 7a but that's just preference, both are excellent when done well..............................DJ

I don't need an illuminated reticle simply because I have no trouble targeting whatever I need to do w/o them.
Now, if you want to have fun, or more fun with them, fine. But I have spent lots of time out in the dark. My usual tactic is to arrive in my hunting area after a long hike, often better than an hour, in the dark. Then I wait for a half hour or so until it is legal to shoot. That means lots of walking and potential predator shooting long before twilight. My scopes work fine w/o the fancy illuminated reticles. Including areas and times so dark that I can't see more than 5-10 yds. in front of me in full darkness. Lots of others have found the same thing.
So say what you will. You can't convince me I need something else simply because what I have works. E

I sure hope those interested read that post again very carefully.
His problem was at very long ranges during twilight. He needed advice on a scope that would show him his target w/o resorting to the very expensive scopes. That' why he posted it here. He knows all about the fancy euros and their capabilities. It's the cheaper scopes with equal capabilities he wanted to hear about. We'll see, I hope, what he chose and how well it worked. E

Last I heard, Leupold's export models scopes are not their fully multicoated models. They export a special version, aimed at the bottom of the european market with VXI level of coatings. They do this because of the very high tariffs on quality scopes. Looks like the euro politicans don't want any competition. I understand they are very popular over there. E

So, there's a tariff on "quality" scopes, but not lesser scopes? To what documentation could you point me so I can learn more about this issue?

Incorrect. Leupold does export some scopes not made in the US (and these are VXII level for the most part, not VXI), but they also export all their latest top models too.

They are not rare, but I would not say they were popular either.

Also, the tariff is 4 to 8% (there is additional VAT, but that applies equally to the Euroscopes so this is irrelevant).

Americans seem to always assume that the rest of the world has high tariffs against their products, but it varies greatly with different products and optics are in the lowest category.

John