Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa yet another commentary on the .375. Prior users will yawn and say "well, duh".

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr><p>I saw about 10 Winchester failsafe bullets hit game on this trip and saw evidence of only a couple which opened. This is consistant with my past experience with the failsafe as well. The other Failsafe bullets went in, and out leaving holes identical in size. <p><hr></blockquote>
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<br>Went back to this old thread to look something up and found this comment -- which is one of the things I find fascinating about hunting & shooting talk.
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<br>Ross Seyfried keeps calling the FailSafe "the perfect bullet" and has apparently shot quite a bit of game with it, from aoudad in the most recent Rifle to at least elk -- what would you suggest accounts for the dramatically different assessment of FailSafes?

I was reporting exactly what I saw, no more no less. I have no reason to discredit the failsafe or promote any other bullet instead. I cannot say why two different people have come to such different conclusions. I did find a strange coincidence just now. I was at the " stopping power" web site and read this post from a guy and just laughed when I saw it. Then I came here and see Ross being mentioned again. Maybe this will shed some light on credibility, Or not?
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<br>Here is the post:
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<br> Once upon a time Ross Seyfried took a .45acp to Africa. Used 230 FP loaded to 850fps ,
<br> got compleat penetration on Cape Buffalo.
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<br>Either the poster who wrote this took the text completely out of context or Old Ross is just trying to drum up controversy! If that post was infact correct and Ross claimed this, nothing else he says will ever mean squat to me!

I have no reason to doubt either your or his observations -- as I said, it's just one of the interesting things in this field that people can have opposite but convincing experiences.
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<br>I know from his other writings that RS does value penetration rather highly -- he's also very fond of the Hornady 160-gr. 6.5mm RNSP, etc. -- and so I wonder if perhaps he's just happy to get the through-and-through penetration even if the bullet doesn't expand.
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<br>I also wonder if FailSafes may perform differently in different calibers -- I know in his most recent article he was shooting them in a .270 WSM. What caliber were the ones you observed not to open?
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<br>As for the .45 ACP -- for some reason I do vaguely recall some piece where he shot a buff with a pistol but I don't trust myself or the anonymous poster to remember details 100%.
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<br>John

I seem to recall reading the article about shooting a buff with a pistol and I'm sure it was a .45 but it wasn't a .45acp. He was using a single-action (beefed-up) and I think his point was the same as those who use Garrett's bullets in the .45/70...cast a bullet correctly and you will get plenty of penetration even with relatively low velocity.

Yes, I to remember having it brought to my attention one Saturday afternoon while being with some friends. I thought it was a 45 long colt, beefed up as you had previously mentioned, shooting some of those Garret bullets also. Those type experiments don't do much for me these days. I just consider it a lot of jibberish, a much more polite way of putting it quite frankly and go with what I know to be actual fact. I can't to this day figure out why certain people would even think, let alone do such an off the wall stunt with a dangerous game animal.

JJHack......I must say that the only way you, myself the gunrag Ross or anybody else will ever penetrate a Cape Buffalo completely with a 45acp, would be to shoot one through it's ear lob. Now that I know it can accomplish without a hitch. To send one into the body area and expect it to have complete penetration is ludicrous.
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<br>I have shot over 50,000 rounds of 45acp ammo through a bunch of pistols, worn out several barrels and no way does it have that kind of penetration, velocity needed, or knock down power for such an animal in its weight class. That weapon was designed first of all an formost, for stopping a human being in close combat at 3 to 20 yards, not a ragging buffalo tipping the scales at 1800 pounds up.

I have killed everything from Impala and Feral hogs to Bison, Eland, Wildebeest, and Zebra with my .375 (about 90 animals between the US and Africa), but I always preferred a bigger gun for Buffalo. I just returned from 3 weeks in Africa where I used it to take a Blesbok at 270 yards in South Africa (I shot everything else there with my .308), as well as a Zebra, Buffalo, and Grant's Gazelle in Tanzania. The Tanzania portion of my trip came up with only 2 months notice, and I had just sent off my .416 to be made into a custom rifle, so I just used my trusty .375 on Buff. I knew if I did my part, it would work just fine (although I still prefer a .416 for Buff), and it did. It was dead on the first shot, but I paid the insurance.
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<br>If you do your part, the .375 will work just fine. In fact, many PHs tell me that even though they prefer a bigger gun, they would rather see a client who is confident with a .375 than a guy who is scared of his .416. The .375 really is the S***. If you aren't going to shoot more than 1 or 2 Buffalo in your life, I can't think of a better do anything gun.

Greg, I am on JJHack's list to go to Africa with him this Spring but we are waiting on more peoople to sign up for the hunt. I am thinking about two of my rifles in particular for the hunt but will only take one of the two with me. The first is a 358 Winchester in a M-7 Remington. I use 225 Nosler Partition bullets in that. The second is a 7mm Wby in a Remington M-700 using 175 grain Nosler Partition bullets. JJHack prefers the larger calibers and I understand that logic. I will have nothing larger or more dangerous than perhaps a kudu in my sights. Which of the two rifles I have described above, would you prefer for plains game if you could only take one. With someone with your experience, I'd appreciate your opinion.

Rolly,
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<br>I would pick the one you're most comfortable with. For the ranges you'll be shooting in that area, you really don't need the 7mm. The .358 sounds fine to me, but once again, go with the gun you shoot the best. I know that that kind of sounds like a cop out, but I know that any gun of reasonable caliber with a well-constructed bullet like a Trophy Bonded, A-Frame, Partition, etc. will do the job if you're shot is placed well.
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<br>I've cleanly taken quite a few bigger animals like Eland, Wildebeest, Gemsbok, and Zebra with a .308 loaded with 165 gr. TBBC. By the same token, I once had to shoot a Wildebeest 4 times with my .375 because the first shot wasn't so good. Shot placement and bullet construction are the two most important factors in cleanly taking game, so pick the gun you shoot the best, load it with good bullets, and go have a ball in Africa.
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We were hunting feral goat, in some hilly yet open country.My friend Jim was carrying his Valmet Hunter .308. Before they were BANNED. I was carrying my BRNO .375 with a 1.75 to 5 scope. It was loaded with 5 rounds consisting of 235 gn speers and 4064 powder. About 200 metre on the other side of the steep valley stood a mob of goats. I asked Jim to have a go. He emptied the mag of nine rounds to no avail. I let go three rounds for three goats. Jim now swears by his .375

There was a discussion on the performance of Failsafe bullets, that they would have near identical entrance and exit holes. I experienced this myself with a moose that I shot in Alaska a couple of years ago. the moose was at a 45 degree angle at approximately 150 yards. The 300 FS out of my 375 did full pentration through the ribs exiting the far shoulder , the moose dropped in its tracks, dramatic results. What I am told and have read this bullet was designed for max penetration with high projectile weight retention. What happens to cause near identical hole is the front half of the bullet mushrooms and then loses it "pedals" so to speaks leaving a flat faced "solid" to further pentrate causing more damage and breaking bones. If you see how the bullet is constructed you will see what I mean. It was my choice when I went to Alaska because of this designed performance, since I had ample power in the 375 I needed a bullet that would not fail no matter what angle shot I needed to take. I really did not expect a dramatic knock down that I got, I would have expected that from a bullet that would release its energy quicker.

There's no accounting for how an individual animal reacts to being shot. I personally believe the Fail Safes are too tough (maybe not for Buff). I have shot game up to Eland (.375) with them and they have not impressed me, although the Eland only ran about 20 yards. You could eat almost up to the meat. It was as if he was hit with a solid, but it must have expended some energy because he went down so fast. I got both shoulders and lungs and the top of the heart, and the wound channel was pretty darn clean. Other, much smaller animals shot the same way ran a long way with almost no blood trail.