Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles berger vld seating depth

i got a new 280ai and want to try some berger 140 vld's that berger sent me.
so far i have tried touching, with rldr 22 and vv n 165. shoots 1 inch groups.
tried barnes tipped tsx's with same powder and same results.
benchmark barrels, made the barrel and did the barreling. it's a 1-9 twist 3 groove.
ron, called me the other day after telling him i am frustrated, and suggested imr4350. had a little for 12 rounds laying around and went 56.0 grains.
set the bergers at 0.010 off and fired 5, group was 1 1/4 x 1"..
tried 3 ttsx's set at 0.50 and got a 1/2" 3 shot group. then i fired 3 set at 0.25 off and put 6 rounds into 1/2" at 100 yards.

where are you guys setting the bergers to get the best groups.
i only have 1 box, and don't wanna burn am all up trying to find a sweet spot.
i just bought 2 cans of imr 4350 and will try 57.0 grains tomm, with the ttsx's.
gonna take the chrono to see velo's.

They like to be jammed. However you find the contact point, add .020" and see what you get.

Do what Tim said... That's why I don't use them in my .308--- Loaded that long, they won't fit in the magazine...

now for another question.
when seated out that far and "jammed" . what happens when i want to remove the unfired cartridge, to say get in the truck, get in camp , etc... ?????

answer... bullet stays stuck in barrel and powder scatters all over the inside of the recvr, mag box, etc...
now get cleaning rod and knock out bullet and clean gun.


correct ??

WRONG... I do it all the time. I've never had that happen. Of course, if your neck tension is sloppier than Paris Hilton after the Grammy's... that may happen once or twice. Should take a lot more than a bullet .020" in the lands to yank it out of the case.

I would not hunt with a load forced into the leade. I shoot the 155 VLD in the 308 and the 168 in the 7mm WSM and both are short of the throat. Both loads shoot well.

I was working up a load for the .358W with 180 SSP's and one of the long ones pulled out of the case and stuck in the throat. That was not good. What would you do then in the field?

Seat some of those 140's deeper. They may shoot. If not move on to another bullet. Also try some of those at longer range. You mentioned 1" groups so that may have been at 100 yds?

Once again... theory from those who haven't... trumps experience by those who have... classic!

DDP,

Its splattermatic who is not happy with his groups with the VLD bullets touching the lands. Not only that, but indeed, I have tried bullets touching many times in loading and in fact I have breach seating tools for my schuetzen rifles!

My suggestion to not have the bullets touching the lands for hunting comes from practical experiance going back to 1953. It is just not worth the chance of a problem in the field just to shoot a VLD bullet.

My experience with the 115g VLD in .25-06 mirrors DDP. I seat the bullet 0.020 inches into the lands. I have chambered/unchambered those loads very often and I have never had a problem with the bullet being stuck in the lands/rifle. I must have enough neck tension.

Ditto above for the 140g VLDs in 6.5.

Both bullets only shot OK touching the lands, but really shined pushed 0.020 into the lands.

My experiences only.

i have 5 loaded 0.20 into the lands.
tomm is gonna be range day, if work doesn't call.
we'll see.
also going to try 140 gr. accubonds, and 160 gr. tsx's.

so far the tipped 140 tsx's get the nod. loaded up 5 more with 57.0 grains of imr4350. going to see if pressure is present and accuracy.

Ok, so for those of you Jamming them into the lands, how much are you lowering your powder charge to offset the rise in pressure?

Kaiser Norton

I am working up my loads like normal. I start with minimum loads and work up in 1/2g increments until I find the velocity/accuracy that I am looking for and then go shoot stuff.

I have had no pressure issues, my velocities have been what I expected, and accuracy has been excellent.

Honestly, if I couldn't get them to shoot backed off the lands, I wouldn't bother. I don't load for any of my rifles touching the lands. My 22-250AI is the closest at .005" off.

Back to the original question...I remember reading that Berger stated to try them backed off the lands quite a bit, if they don't shoot well closer in. I would try them at what your TSX is seated. Sounds like they need to be close, or not close at all.

Those that know they like to be jammed work up a load as such, no crawfishing this way.

I`d say to back your regular load off 1 grain in a 280AI case and work back if possible.

Some rifles just won't respond to VLDs. I know I have tried many that won't.

VLDs can shoot away from the lands:

My two 257 Weatherby chambered rifles like .070" jump with the 115 Berger VLD. My friend's two 257s like .100". All were made with a Pacific Tool and Gauge reamer.

More recently: a 7 STW shoots with a .170" jump and a 7 RUM that was just put together likes .160" Both are shooting the 168 VLD.

I would suggest that you try progressive seating depths with a powder charge that showed promise in your earlier tests. I chose .010" increments to see if there was a change in group size. Once you get close further fine tuning of powder charge and seating depth could be done if needed.

Let us know what happens.

I conclude you are testing these for Berger? Also sounds like they are not user friendly in your rifle. Guess I would pass that along to Berger. I don`t think one should have to fool endlessly to get a bullet to shoot well.
My best luck with them has been just off the lands. 6mm, .25, and .308`s.
Someone also mentioned trying at more than 100yrds. I concur. 300 will give you a good picture.