Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting 338 Federal - 160 gr vs 210 gr

VG,
That big ol' grin at the end of the sentence implies that I was just kidding around! I have no doubts that you're not a poacher. No worries!

Jordan

Par for the course.... You couldn't follow a trail of logic marked with surveyors tape.

You're the guy that started a thread asking if a 120 grain BT in a 7/08 would kill a Deer.. Priceless

Ive got an Encore in 338X284 Win and it shoots really well with the 210gr Partition. While i have not shot an elk yet, thats the load i'll use. It's moving along at close to 2600 FPS..ought to work fine.

Has anyone experimented with RL17 and the 338 Federal? I would be interested in hearing some achieved velocities. Seems like everyone who has used it has benefited with gains

For those searching and come across this: I'm using Win. 748 in Encore .338 Fed with 28" barrel with 48 grains Barnes 185 gr.TTSX In single shot, bullet can be seated out to OAL of 2.950" still .050 off lands. Through Oehler 35, showing 2750. Quickload program shows RL17 too slow, RL-15 more in ballpark of 2700. 748 works up nicely, 50-100 fps per grain starting at 44 grains. No signs of overpressure this rifle at 48 grains. Holds 2000 fps to 300 yds with@ 2700 muzzle. Which was goal for proper expansion with this bullet. TTSX is shorter then 185 GMX ?? can get more powder in without compressing... Encore allows 28" tube without rifle longer then bolt with 22". Don't have group info yet have to reload next round for groups..

28" barrel on a 338 Fed. You ought to be able to get much more than 2750. I get that, or just under,are on a 22" with TAC or 8208 XBR. AA2230 and AR Comp have published loads that are quite good as well. In fact, AR Comp states 2847 for a 180 Accubond in a 24" barrel. I have some loaded up, but have not shot them through the chrono yet.

I'm only telling you what the 35 Oehler tells me, with my barrel. Even with the bullet out to 2.950 OAL, 48 grains of 748 is at the starting point of a compressed load in FL sized, necked down .358 win cases. I was able to size down .358 with no thickening of neck brass,calculated, 55376 psi, 99.16% burn.
Hodgdon tests on their data site, shows a max of 49 grains of 748 in 24" tube getting 2665 @ 53,400 psi. And with 8508XBR, a max compressed load of 47 grains getting 2721. @ 59,000psi. both at OAL of 2.80 My results are more in line with the predictions of my Quickload program plugging in a 28" barrel and OAL of 2.950.
As I said before, with the 185 Gr. Barnes in Encore OAL of 2.950 puts bullet .050 off rifling. And, with 748, a max fill of 48.3 grains. If bullet was set to SAMMI 2.80" 44.9 gr. of 748 would be 100% fill. Seating bullet out further allowing more space in case, is allowing me to get more vel. with less pressure. And, that's what I want in a break action Encore. 2750 fps with .432 BC 185 TTSX is quite acceptable as it lines up exactly, (on paper)until I finish tests, with the BDC range hash lines on my Vortex 2-7X scope. 300 yds. is my personal range limitation for Elk in the Idaho Black timber areas I'll be hunting. Drop difference at 300 yds. between 2750 and 2800 is only 00.6". In Quickload calculations, 8508XBR appears to build more pressure faster at near max loads then 748. Still have to load more rounds for accuracy testing. During velocity tests, most groups had bullets touching at 100 yds. But, groups were in different places by 2 to 3 inches as powder increased. And, had brand new scope adjustments to contend with...And just about out of one old lot of 748,(in metal can), will have to start with new 748 lot at some point... Quickload calculates highest vel. with this combination using IMR 3031 @ 46 grains getting 2850 fps. 57407 psi & 100% burn in 28 in. I only have a little of that powder left in a very old can (20+yrs), have not been able to get any new.

Not questioning your readings at all. Just seems like 748 is not ideal. I think you would get quite a bit more with other powders, that's all. Not that you need to of course! 2750 with the 185 TTSX is not going to stop in an elk based on my experience. I've never seen results from a 338 Fed in anything other than a 22" barrel so I'm very interested in what you can get. Let us know what you work up! I'll bet you'd be well over 3100 FPS with the 160 TTSX with <max load of AA2230 (I get 3020 with one grain under Barnes max load).

Not interested in pushing to max pressures and vel. in my Encore, because of frame stretching. Thats what my custom Savage/PacNor .338 RUM is for with 225 gr. Barnes TTSX. Plugging in other powders into QuickLoad only shows me pressure spikes near max case capacity, whereas 748 stays even....that's why I chose it and I have some to use. If this was a bolt gun and my only one, I would experiment more, but right now interested most in accuracy.......I have one bottle of 8508XBR if I don't get exactly what I want with 748 will try it next.

I plugged in your load into Hornady Ballistic calculator: 160 gr TTSX with BC of .342 at 3020 and my 185 @ 2750 with BC of .432 at 300 yds. sighted at 100 yds, yours drops 12" my load, 14". At 500 yd a 6" difference in favor of 160 gr. and both doing near same velocity, 1800 fps. but 185 has 200 more fpe. IF 2000 fps is needed for proper expansion of these bullets, it appears 400 yds. is max for that expansion with both above loads.

185 does well with retaining energy. As an FYI, I asked Barnes about the .338 185 TTSX and the 1800 FPS min opening velocity and the answer I got was that the bullet actually opened at lower velocities just fine but they published the 1800 to be on the safe side. Did not clarify the test material or what constituted "opening". So far it's been a great bullet for me. Only trying the 160 for variety.

Read OP ?, not replies, here are my choices for the Fed:

185 Barnes
200 - pick your flavor, Federal has a few
210 Partition.

I'd personally use the 185 over 210 Barnes - More capacity for powder, faster, hopefully better impact speed for expansion. The 210 PT is I am sure shorter, so more powder than a Barnes 210, so get more speed up, soft nose, proven very solid.

I'd not think twice than to run Federal's best 200 grain softpoints for everything I pointed that Sako at, but the Barnes 185 and Noz 210 have a stellar reputation. The modest speed will allow good penetration and integrity w/200 cup core.

Let me add, a bud bought my 350 RM, airline failed to allow him to take his ammo - 225 partitions b/c not properly boxed. He freaked out, I said, stay calm, he had a 280 also but really wanted to use the 350, I said buy some Remington 200 Corelokts - his only possible option. He found some, proceeded to knock the snot out of a HUGE Bull that presented w/in 200 yds.

So point is - when I told him SHOOT well and hunt with confidence, in the end it worked. We can over analyze some of the data.

Use one of the above 3 and you will do fine. A 160 I think just peters out faster w/less BC and wt. Prob will work, but I'd rather a 308/165 at that point.

In order of MY preference:

185 Barnes
210 Partition
200 Softpoint

Last info I saw from Barnes May 2012 says 2000fps for most TTSX:

"The LRX (Long Range X) bullets are flying out of here faster than we can make them. These are an optimized version of the Tipped TSX bullet and they have unique qualities that may make them better for you under a few circumstances.

An improved nose and boattail to be even more streamlined (higher BC value). This will again add to the distance you can shoot and still achieve bullet expansion. On top of that, we have lowered the minimum impact velocity to achieve expansion from 2000 fps (for most of the Tipped TSX calibers and weights) to 1600 fps for all of the LRX bullets. Again this will add about another 200 yds to your maximum effective range. In some larger cartridges this will allow the bullets to expand out to distances of 1000 yds or more."

Here in CA. as I hunt Boar all year round, I'm, by law, limited to no-lead bullets, so try for one accurate Barnes load in all my rifles used for big game..