Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Harley or Africa?

So which is it? Africa or Harley? can only afford one [/quote]

You seem to have in depth hunting experiences while being new to motorcycling. My alter ego lives on bikes; if I had a bike safe it would be about as full as my gun safe and the latter is overflowing. I've studied accident investigations involving motorcycle and vehicle accidents and have been called to testify as an "expert" on several occassions (incidentally the meaning of expert? "ex" is a hasbeen and "spurt" is a drip under pressure, or so I have been reminded.) I ride 50 to 60K a year. When I was 11 my dad got upset for finding motorcycle and gun magazines under the mattress, so he bought me my first Playboy, hoping to reorient the demons. That was 50 years ago and I am twice divorced. Sorry, Dad.

Riding motorcycles can be safer than driving cars! But to reach that level of skill and awareness takes experience and formal safety programs , otherwise riding is statisically 13X more likely to produce serious injury or fatality. Thats a huge difference and emphasizes the value of formal training. The Motorcycle Safety Foundation offers comprehensive courses in training from entry level to advanced. There are a number of providers of added training that can carry a rider into specialized areas. Experience in applying the training is up to the rider.

Unless you have the time and the dedication to obtain the formal training prior to riding, I'd recommend going with what you know, the hunt. Africa. Far too many riders view motorcycling as a recreational endeavor and gloss over the training and safety gear; either way there are dues to be paid or extracted.

If you decide to go with the motorcycle, welcome to another endeavor that will compliment and enhance so many aspects of life. But, by all means buy your Snell rated helmet and gear before you buy the bike. Get the MSF training before you buy the bike. Finally as a long time owner of many brands, including H-D, allow that there are motorcycles and there are Harleys but you should never confuse the two.

Shoot often, ride often, but not at the same time.

PS Some area biker gangs carry guns but are not adept at using them resulting in innocent bystanders being injured. I have been promoting the idea of Ride By Shooting Ranges so they can be more accurate. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Make some friends in Africa, and get a USED Kawasaki. IPSC has many adherents in S. Africa, for instance. If you know the farmer, you get to take animals for a lot less cost. So go to the IPSC (International Practical Shooting Confederation) home page, and get some email addys of African regional directors. From those guys, get the names of a lot of local shottists. From those guys, get the phone numbers and addys of guys who can host you a hunt. They might even let you use the pistol, muzzleloader, etc that you've always wanted to take big game with.



Go NOW. Bikes are not being used up, the animals ARE. The political situation in Africa could deteriorate completely in a year or two.

I'd look at one of the Vulcan 800's at www.kawasaki.com and a jaunt to Africa!! If you really want that Harley sound put some aftermarket pipes on it like the Harley boys do and look to eventually move up to a Classic 1500..

Heed the above advice of not buying too much bike to start with..

Mike

Ditto on the safety gear. If you ride enough, sooner or later you will put it down. Mine happened when I hit an oil slick on a curve. Don't know if someone blew a brake line or what, but it took the rear wheel out from under me in a heartbeat, a very strong, load your pants kind of heartbeat. To make a long story short, I walked away with a couple of bruises. The elbow pad on my leather jacket was ripped off, as well as the screw for the face shield. Without the proper gear, it would have ruined at least the summer, maybe more.

Tour Africa on the Harley, sell it there, fly home and you'll probably pay for your trip and still have the coin to replace it with a new Harley once home. I've got a co-worker that did Europe that way. I think there are even brokers that set the trip up for you, cuz his trip certainly sounded like an organized plan, not just a "I think I'll try this" kinda thing.

For years I rode rice, had fun, went fast, got tickets, lost money. Went a few years w/o a bike, then invested in a King.

There is something "different" about a Harley. I don't know what it is, and "it" defies all logic. I realize they are basicly 1945 technology, they don't do anything better than any of the other makers. At least they don't drip oil like the old ones. Still the ride is like no other.

Within the year I parked a Classic next to the King. Now there's sumptin' for Touring and sumptin' for Bar hoppin'.

If you want a Harley, get a Harley. No Vulcan, Shadow, Victory, Virago, Intruder, or other "copy cat" will do.

You can hunt Africa later. Zebra tastes like [bleep] anyways <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Statistically your mid-life crisis may be a lot later in YOUR life than you think if you buy a bike with no prior riding experience. I'm sure it is not common, but I know of 2 mid life crisis first time bike purchasers that very shortly left a widow and children to fend for themselves due to miscalculations of their riding abilities. I've been to Africa twice for longer than average periods and while its a great time I'm not as addicted to the concept as some. Your call, but I'd go bird hunting/shooting in South America and still have most of the money for the bike. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

PS want a life style get a Harley, want trouble free fast riding, get a VTX. This is just to stir up the Harley guys, <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> don't even consider getting a VTX as a first bike.

Well, I'll throw in here on account of I've had motorcycles AND been to Africa (Peace Corps <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />).



For twelve years and 200,000+ miles all I owned was a motorcycle (a series of Jap bikes mostly). Of necessity I rode in all weather and traversed most of the US and into Canada.



Harleys are different, a very similar bike with "Kawasaki" or "Honda" on it probably won't scratch that particular itch, especially later in life, get a Harley.



On the other hand I second Redneck and others' advice to start with a Sportster. Screw the idiots (and there are a LOT of idiots on Harleys) who call 'em "half-hogs", buy a Sportster and you're getting the latest incarnation of the original 1950's American superbike.



Take a MSF rider course first thing and then put in all the riding hours you can. The real dangerous time on motocycles is in the first year AFTER you get confident but BEFORE you've had enough close calls that scare you sh&tless. Leather and boots a must, helmet up to you (in a crash, I'd rather be wearing a helmet). Remember even a survived wreck can still leave you in a lifetime of pain.



Still want that Heritage? RENT one after you learn to ride and see if it makes that much difference. I had a classic bike once myself (BMW R100GS Paris/Dakar) which drew admiring glances from riders who knew motorcycles (even many Harley riders) but found that I could really care less if people liked my ride or not, so sold it and went back to my Kawasaki KLR 650.



After a year or two, if you STILL want that Softail sell the Sporty for close to what you paid for it and get the Softail.



Meanwhile it will not fail to escape your attention that you paid about $10,000 less for the Sportster than you would have paid for that new Softail. Hold onto the money for the first six months of daily riding in case you need it for motocycle-related medical expenses, and then use it as part of the payment to go to Africa the following year (sure thats more money than you thought, but geeze!, you and I are both around fifty, how many years you got left anyway?)



Four years from now you'll have a motorcycle AND trophies and stories from Africa <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.



Oh yeah, as others here pointed out, motorcycles are powerful social tools that attract women (which may or may not be a good thing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />). Also, if you're gonna be on a bike you MUST travel, even on that Sportster. There are few things finer in this life than climbing on a good motorcycle loaded up with saddlebags, tool kit and bedroll and heading out for distant horizons.



Like all earthly things though, neither the motorcycle nor the Africa trip will bring you happiness if ya ain't right with your Creator.



Birdwatcher (AKA Yoda <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />)

Well, you guys are a great help...lol....go to africa! get the bike....or do both.....one thing I know, it's a Harley or nuthin. Was at a dealer open house yesterday, lotsa bikes and a beautiful spring day.

But, that sundowner in Africa with sounds and smells and acacia trees, damn near anyone can own a bike, but relatively few get to experience Africa.

I still don't know....I do know that I'm gonna doe sumthin before I get too damn old to do either. BTW the wife votes Africa....guess she wants to keep me around for awhile...lol..I talk bikes and she just shakes her head.

Why go to Africa anyway. What you are allowed to kill is available for much Less cash at many Ranches in Texas.
The thing with shooting the BIG FIVE is the license costs, Trophy Fees.and cost of th Hunt and Transportation fees will
Cost you well over Thirty Thousand dollars. The problem is getting the license to shoot the animal as many Countries don't allow certain "Endangered" animals to be shot. This means you will have to go to a Couple different Countries to do it. I always dreamed of going on a Cape Buffalo hunt and saved my nickles and dimes for it. In 1984 I went and did it.
I would compare it to shooting an Angus Bull and was about as exciting. The Game Ranger shot a Bull that had been eating some villagers garden with a 30/06 loaded with Military Ball ammo. It dropped like a rock in its tracks.
Too make a long story short. FORGET Africa, lke fine Wine, it is highley overrated and highly overpriced.
The Africa of Ruark and Hemingway are GONE and have been gone for Forty years.
It depends on what you want to tell your Grandchildren. I would just as soon give them the Money for College as use it to shoot holes into some Hapless critter in Africa. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

That's another part of the equation. I really don't want trophies as such. I don't have the room and don't want to spend the money on the mounts. I guess I'd like some representative horns and would really like a leopard. I'm guessing some kind of cull hunt would be in order. A hunt where some shooting takes place and the meat gets utilized.

I want the experience, the country flavor, the culture. Can't get that in Texas. I've been to Europe, Central America and Asia....now maybe Africa.

But, the Harley is a tangible asset when all is said and done, and the African hunt is certainly intangible....oh, the choices!

Advising him to get a "Skirtster" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> You gotta be kidding me. That's like buying a new rifle in .243

If you want a Harley, get the Big twin.

The only real measure of skill on a motorcycle is in corners. Of all the Harley offerings, or anyone's offerings for that matter, nothing can be wrung out down a twisty backroad quite like a Sportster. Never mind what the dyno says, it makes torque everywhere and, leaned over, the pegs wont drag until you're about to crash anyway. Throw in aftermarket suspension, carb and pipes and you'll be embarrasing Jap sportbike squids in no time AND looking good while doing it.

After that ya can stop in at the local watering hole. Or else get that Springer Heritage first, and cruise sedately to that same watering hole in formation with the other identically-dressed rebels from the Preparation H crowd (Official Harley leathers: Made in Korea. Official Harley boots: Made in China. Patriotism: Priceless <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />)

Me, I'druther ride the Sporty.

Birdwatcher

Let me know when you want to race your Harley against my Yamaha. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> If you throw in a new suspension, exhaust, engine, and frame, to the tune of about $20,000 you might get close to the Yamaha. I haven't seen the Harley's knocking off the Jap and Italian bikes on the pro race circuit. Matter of fact, haven't seen a Harley out there in years.

Some friends of mine bought a Humvee (military stype) and drove it all over. They went up to Alaska and then all around Australia. I would do something similar if I were you.



I would add South Africa to my adjenda. I would build an off-road trailer so I could have a comfortable place to sleep were ever I want to stop. I would also add fishing and hunting gear, and do a lot of that. You could visit and hunt with your friends from 24 hour.



Alternatively, you could do a lot of this on a sail boat and rent cars to travel inland.



Conrad

Evilgenius,

Try the Harley dealer down the road in Jackson, MS. He sells his bikes at MSRP. The catch is that you have to order them and wait a few months for one. He has a camp-out twice a year (spring and fall) where folks come from all across the country and set up camp in a big field. He sends a sign up list around and folks put their names on the list, then he calls you inside to order your bike. You could be there for three or four days until you get called, but I'm told it's a great time getting to know all the folks waiting just like you. Plus, you don't get ripped off for "added value charges" like 99% of the harley dealers do.

257 wby,

Personally, I'd do africa first, then buy the bike. The bike can always be done, Africa might go away in a few years and you ain't getting any younger (neither am I).

If you are going to get the bike, I'll go against some of the others advice here. Get what YOU want the first time. Don't buy a sportster if you really want a softtail or a road king. I hear the advice of "get something smaller and work up" all the time and I don't agree with it. The problem is that after a month or so on the small bike you'll be ready for what you really want and you're stuck with trying to sell the smaller on, most likely at a 3K loss. Just get what you want to begin with and if you're concerned about your riding skills buy a 15 year old beater gold wing for $1000 and ride it until you're comfortable on the softtail, it'll be a lot cheaper than buying a sportster and upgrading after six months. Nobody ever learned to fly a jet by tooling around in a cessna.

Hiya Rick <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I myself happen to have extensive experience with riceburners, rode 'em for years in fact. One sits patiently in my garage even as I write. A careful reading of my posts will reveal that I never said a Harley was FASTER than your conspicuously plastic Yamaha, just better looking.



Let us be cognizant of the fact that the racetrack is one thing, and the street is quite another. If we agree that corners are everything, it seems to me that there are very few challenging curves on backroads that can be negotiated at speeds faster than around 80, hence all a bike really needs is useful acceleration up to about 90 mph (speeds much above that provide the rider with an odd combination of fear on the one hand and boredom on the other, my '88 Ninja topped out at about 140).



Without checking, I dunno the cost of aftermarket springs, carbs, and pipes on a Sporty but $2,000 (not $20,000) oughtta provide for a pretty complete makeover. Granted there's still the frame but then we're talking street here.



Once back in my Ninja period I was rinding with a guy on a 250 cc dirtbike, just to be fair I held my own speed down to 80 in the straights, he just left the throttle pegged. I could NOT shake that guy in turns, no matter WHAT I did there he was in my mirrors. Once in Connecticut (road trip) I was on a 650 dirt bike when a color-coordinated leather-clad rider on a Suzuki 1100 sportbike blew by me. Just out of curiousity I got on his tail, through the next five miles of gloriously winding mountain road that knee-dragging fool couldn't shake me either.



A race-quaility Jap sportbike is readily purchasable by just anyone who can afford the insurance, and lots of guys buy 'em. Most of 'em don't have a clue as to how to ride them well. Take an average guy on a Jap bike, match 'em up against a guy on a Sportster who has enough smarts to a) buy the Sportster and b) install the correct aftermarket upgrades and my money's on the Harley rider.



I suspect that you yourself know your way around motorcycles, match YOUR Yamaha against that Sportster (or my 650 thumper) and who would win? I dunno, depends on the rider mostly.



After the ride, stop by the local watering hole to join the Preparation H crowd ("Live to ride, Ride to get hemmorrhoids from riding with your legs stuck out front"

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />). Cruising on a beautiful day TO that watering hole, the guy on the Sportster is sitting up listening to the rumble of that motor, me I'm listening to the companiable thump of my thumper. The guy on the sportbike is leaned over in a compromising position, and the motor on his bike sounds and feels like an electric lawn trimmer.



Once we get to the watering hole, I submit that the guy on the tricked-out Sportster would win all the style points, next would come me on account of dirt bikes are SUPPOSED to be dirty <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> and then finally the guy on the tupperware sport bike.



Fast forward a few years when it comes to rebuild/resale time. Harley motors have gotten excellent now, so a rebuild ain't likely anytime soon, anyway Harleys can be kept running forever and parts will ALWAYS be available. The Sportster guy can sell his bike for nearly what he paid for it, or else keep it running for the next 20 years.



Me? My thumper has but one piston, four valves and one carb. Kawasaki has been selling the same motor since about '85. I SHOULD be able to get parts for my faded, dented, rode-hard-and-put-up-wet mount, if not I can get a brand new one good for another 60,000 miles for the princely sum of $5,000.



Now the Jap sportbike (brand irrelevant): My, that paint sure faded fast, and then there's those cracks in the fairing from the time it fell over in the parking lot. Parts?.... "I'm sorry Sir, that motorcycle is over ten years old. Instead let me show you the new 1200 Yamaha Wangertwanger GX, good for 246 mph on the street".



Geeze! I love motorcycles.

Birdwatcher

Birdwatcher,

STOP IT RIGHT NOW!

Do you show off the dessert tray to fat people? Do you revel in the virtues of scotch whiskey to alcoholics?

I was once a 22-year old on a 250cc CanAm...

Can we really go back?

JOG... we live in a new era: three words... Botox, Viagra, and Harley-Davidson.

After you kill yourself on the third, the first will make the mortician's task so much easier, and on account of the second after you're pronounced dead at the scene they'll likely have to beat your member to death with a stick <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Birdwatcher

Birdwatcher,

Your scenario is not the way my luck has been running. The odds are:

My Viagra inspired pal would get snagged in the spokes of the Harley. The Harley of course, would win the tug of war.

Babes in need of a tune-up would flock to my Botox�d and beautiful mug, but that would be too frustrating with my tool serving as the Harley�s second kickstand.

I�d be all dressed-up with no place to go.

[color:"red"]STOP IT, YOU GUYS ARE KILLING ME![/color]