Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles who has a .25 wssm???

i have yet to hear much about them, other than press releases, and hype...
i feel like the criticism of the round is semi deserved... what with nominal factory velocities matching the 25-06, bullet for bullet....

still, it amounts to a 6 lb. from the factory .257 do-all rifle, in a pretty nice package if you chose the featherweight classic.....
i don't know of anyone who wouldn't have chosen a WSM instead, myself included, but i feel like the rifle might sell..... john w

why not just a 260? Not a flame, an honest question.

actually it's a fair enough question, and the same question is applicable to the 25-06.....

and the primary answer is that the m70 classic featherweight, which is ARGUEABLY the finest production sporting rifle on the planet, is not available in either the .260, .25-06, or the .257Robts.... it jumps from .25wssm to 6.5 swede..... the swede is a good option, but needs handloading to achieve it's potential.....

i think that most will grant that the 25-06/.25wssm is a better long range option than any non-magnum factory available 6.5 cartridge... with the wssm cartridge in the quarter bore slot for the m70 classic featherweight platform, and with the inducement of an even lighter featherweight at 6 lbs., i think that the combo will sell.....

among plains deer and pronghorn hunters, the 25-06 has long reigned as the long range popularity champ... once again, looking at the wssm's total package, i think that winchester has a natural..... john w

Why didn't they choose the WSM platform? Wouldn't the ballistics have jumped over the 25-06, and nipped at the heels of the 257 WBY? To me this is a lot more exciting than just trying to duplicate the most popular 25 caliber round.

that's the real question among dedicated riflemen....

i think that the answer lies in rifle weight, and total package perception... the WSM featherweights are heavier than the standard action featherweights chambered for the 30-06, and the .270 Win.....

the wssm, with a 22" barrel, is a full pound lighter, and 1" shorter than the short action featherweights...
given the popularity of the 25-06, and the fact that the wssm's ballistics equal it, bullet for bullet, in a lighter, handier rifle, i think that people will use it.....

Here are a few counterpoints to consider.

Marketing dept ballistics aside, the 25 wssm case holds about the same amount of powder as the 257 Bob. Therefore, at equal pressures and all other variables being equal, the top end potential of the 25 wssm does not equal the 25-06. It is far more akin to a 257 Bob +P. Don't get me wrong, that is a very good thing, it just ain't a 25-06 nohow. The smaller case does not hold any ballistic magic just as all the other short magnums fail to equal the balistics of their larger brethren when pressures are equal.

I have been an avid 25-06 shooter for over 20 years but I do not acknowledge that is any better than the 260 Rem as a plains rifle. I know this sounds like heresy but compare max loads with 100 gr. bullets from Nosler #5.

260 Rem 24" top load = 3365 fps.
25-06 24" top load = 3352

Wanna try 120's?? OK.......

260 Rem 24" top load = 3049
25-06 top load = 3090

I fail to see any dramatic difference here..............

I think these are some of the reasons why the 25 wsm will be very challenged to survive in the marketplace.

JimF

Jim - I agree. The 25 wssm interested me but I found an A-bolt in 260 and jumped on it. I wanted a short action in or around that sized caliber. I agree with you all that the wsm is more appealing than the wssm. It will be interesting to see if either cartridge (wssm or 260) survives. I am astonished at the 260's ability at holding a bullet's (120 or 140 gr.) energy to more than 1000 ft.lb's over 500 yards. I also have a 270- and am beginning to wonder which is the more effective round. That A-bolt is light and I put a Sims recoil pad on it - still kicks a bit. Wonder how different the 25wssm might feel. BTW - my 270 has a decellerator pad and my first impression is contrary to everyone else's - I find it better than the Sims. Admittedly the 270 is heavier and as I said, it was my first impression but from all the hype about the Sims pad, and the hype about low recoil of the 260, I was expecting recoil akin to my unpadded 6mm ADL. Big difference and big surprise. Not awful by any means but I might reconsider if buying one for a flinchy, or newbie, shooter. As for other wssm rounds - I think they offer the varmint shooter an alternative to older cartridges like the 22-250, 222 and 223 (which is 40 years old - do you believe it !) Are the wssm's, or for that matter the new WSM's like the 270wsm really needed or wanted? Great rounds - maybe. Neded or wanted? We will see.

kenjs 1:

As I said, I'm a long time 25 cal guy. But I have to admit that the 260 is something special. It is an absolute shame that the marketplace has not embraced it more fully. When you look at the ability to shoot a 100 gr bullet faster than a 243 or a 6mm and then you add the 25-06 comparable 120 gr. ballistics it is easy to see great merit. When you add the 140's that the 260 can handle so easily, it becomes (in my mind at least) a 90% gun for North America. Going from big varmints all the way to Elk......I can't say the same for 6's, 25's or my equally beloved 7mm's.

That is quite a package in many of the short light rifles that it is offered in these days. I'll bet uncle Jack would have approved......... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

JimF

hey JimF,

i agree that there is not a lot of difference, but what difference exists, favors the 25-06/wssm, in factory loads..... i think that you will agree that factory ballistics have more impact on rifle sales than do loading manuals... ???

in addition, bullet for bullet, weight for weight, the .257 has a better B.C. ..... and the .260 is not available in a 100 gr. factory load, that i'm aware of...

i agree that the 25-06 is not significantly better as a plains rifle, than the .260... i would insist though that the 25-06 is immensely more popular.....

i think that winchester is following the right course in making the .25 wssm the only quarterbore available in the m70 featherweight..... as least as far as ensuring sales of the new cartridge goes..... john w

why didn't remington offer an 85-90 grain factory varmint load in the .260??? there's a missed boat..... john w

Boat missing is a highly refined art in the American firearms industry..... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />...... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

JimF

They also missed the boat by only offering the 120 grain in a ballistic tip. Seems to me that would be a better suited bullet for the 140 grain, and the core-lokt, perfect for the 120?

While I don't have a ton of confidence in Btips as big game bullets, I do think a 120 Bt is okay for light bodied deer. However, a 120 gr. ultra core lokt........ <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.........Now that might get the nod as the all rounder for my 6.5x284.

JimF

I picked up a 25 WSSM the other day in a Win Featherweight
and was very impressed with the ergonomics of the rifle. That short(er) 70 action has a great fit and feel to it. It would make a great deer rifle with energy to spare.
I could go for one if I didnt already own a 260 in a 700 TI.

And, as JimF brought up, the 260 is a really "do all" round.
It does indeed have higher BC's than the 257s.
It also matches the 25-06 in the 120 weight class, on paper anyways. If I wasn't concerned with angle shots on elk it could easily be my go to elk rifle. But then, the more I think about it, a 130 TSX or a 140 NP just might fit that application and that puts the 260 on the heels of the venerable 270.
The 260 also sends Sierra 85 HPs down the tube at 3,500 fps with .5 accuracy, It is my coyote calling rifle, with those speeds it does'nt take 2nd place to any in that catagory. Fun to shoot as well.

I have yet to find the 25 WSSM worth talking about. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> It's boring, and it's new! Sad.

I don't have the 25WSSM, but I did win a 243WSSM.

Don't know what I'll do with it yet, but I see they do offer a 100gr. bullet.
Should take it out west for some "lopes" but right now it's still just sitting in a box.
Just can't get excited about these new WSSM, maybe I'll trade it off for the one new round that does have my interest, that's the 30WSM.

Hey, that rifle looks just like mine! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> But mine is a 270 WSM.

SU 35,

my impressions pretty much matched yours..... and it seems to me that the rifle ought to be the basis for selecting the cartridge.....
i do not know of anyone who owns a 700 Ti who regrets his choice, and likewise the model 70 featherweight...

i do think however, that the various .257's are suitable for any game in the 48 states.....

thats a pretty bold statement for a guy who does not, and never has owned a .25..... i have, however, used a couple of them on various game animals through the years..... the first centerfire rifle that i ever fired was an uncles winchester .257 robts. ..... and i have a neighbor who owns one of the finest shooting ruger #1s that i've ever seen, in a 25-06... i have used his rifle, at various times to take a few coyotes, and a couple of deer.... i was with him when he used it to take the largest hog that i've ever seen come out of Arkansas's delta country... it is the only smokeless powder firearm that he owns, and he has used it far and wide with complete confidence.....

i feel like i could buy my son a .25 wssm with the expectation that he would have a rifle that he would treasure, and use for life.....

JimF,

how long, do you reckon, til the wildcatters start punching the wssm case out ?

7mm wssm ?
.338 wssm ?

Oh.......a few days maybe........ <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />



BTW, you should not take the impression that I dont like the case or its potential. It is just not equivelant to '06 (or 284) capacity or performace regardless of bore size.



What it certainly (IS) however is a repackaging of the 7x57 case capacity and performance which is one of my favorites. Among the finest cartridges of moderate powder available are the Bob, the 6.5 x 57, and the 8x57 along of course with the parent round.



It does remain to be seen what the magazine length etc. will allow with these other bore sizes. Sombody will undoubtedly build up a WSSM wildcat on a std length short action in order to gain mag length. That concept reminds me of swimming upstream with your boots on.



JimF