Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Predators and Varmints help me campfire which do i want 204 or 223?

What VG is saying about the 20's is true. The .223 used to be my work horse in the Prairie Dog fields. But I didn't take it this year. Took the TAC 20 didn't miss the .223 for a moment.

I also have both and wouldn't part with either but then I've been a classic "Rifle Looney" many years before Mule Deer coined the praise. So, just a thought, buy both barrels and have your smith make up a switch barrel rifle. Bolt head size and magazine is the same for both cartridges. For the 204 barrel, do go with a 11 inch twist or faster if your even thinking about 40 grain bullets or heavier.
See for yourself which you like better.
Doc

Somehow this got turned into a prairie dog forum when the statement originally was...



If you really want to blow up prairie dogs a 220 swift and a 6mm Rem. with light bullets will do about the best. Terminal ballistics to vaporize prairie dogs still need some mass in the bullet as well as velocity.

This prairie dog was shot with a 220 Swift, to get that kind of lift and destruction at extended ranges a .204 Ruger won't get 'er done. Sure a .204 can kill prairie dogs at these ranges, but so will a .223.



Answering the question about a .223 or a Ruger .204 and turning it into a full blown prairie dog gun when it was mentioned that one day you might get to South Dakota and shoot prairie dogs, the best caliber where you are and what else you may want to do with that gun still points overwhelmingly to the .223.

Really? LOL my TAC 20 will do this all day long and outlast you .220 Swift barrel more than two for one.

Shrapnel: YOU really need some trigger time with a 204 Ruger in a Prairie Dog Town!
I am into my sixth season of shooting Colony Varmints (Rock Chucks, Prairie Dogs and Ground Squirrels) with my various 204 Ruger calibered Rifles!
The 223 Remington in no way shape or form can best the 204 Ruger for Prairie Doggin!
The 204 Ruger shoots flatter and straighter than the 223 Remington out to ranges where 99% of all Prairie Dogs ARE killed and does so with less recoil.
And remember "speed DOES kill" - go get online with a ballistic program and run some real life numbers to prove these things for yourself!
There are many other attributes of the 20 cals that endear them to Prairie Dog Hunters as well.
As far as your image of the skyward bound Prairie Dog, that is a cool picture, one that appears to me to have been taken at relatively CLOSE RANGE - not at an "extended range"!
I own and actively shoot 6 (six) Varminters in caliber 220 Swift, in addition I own 7 (seven) more in caliber 22-250 Remington I would MUCH rather get into a Prairie Dog Town with one of my 5 (five) 204 Ruger Varminters than any of my 22-250's or 220 Swifts! And not just because of the diminutive recoil of the 204 Ruger (allowing me to see my bullet impact among other things!) but they are also much slower to heat a barrel and like someone else mentioned the 204's are indeed a much slower cartridge to wash out a barrel than one in 220 Swift!
My close friend, Varmint Hunting partner and former NRA Director Irv Benzion took a brand new Remington 40X in 220 Swift and washed the rifling out of its barrel for nearly two inches in 1,200 rounds fired during a season of Prairie Doggin!
That incident cost him a 400 dollar bill to rectify!
I have that many rounds down a couple of my 204's and my bore scope shows VERY LITTLE wear to them.
Maybe some folks want to flip Prairie Dogs way into the air with their Rifles and then take close up photos of that - thats fine with me. BUT I would rather kill the Varmints with a "quieter", less recoiling, more economical Rifle than a 220 Swift!
Now, I am going to delve into a subject that you or others may think I have no proof to justify my saying it.
Well I have enough proof to convince myself that the following is true and to publicly state it - I have been shooting 220 Swifts and 22-250 Remingtons for about 44 years now - I have owned a bunch of both of them and based on the 5 (five) 204 Ruger Varminters I now own and shoot I contend that the 204 Ruger in comparable Rifles is more accurate by a noticeable margin than either the 22-250 Remington or the 220 Swift!
And, based on similar criteria I am also convinced the 204 Ruger is slightly more accurate than comparable Rifles in caliber 223 Remington!
Increases in accuracy means, more hits - more fun - more success.
You are so right in one thing though - "sure the 223 can kill Prairie Dogs" but there is no doubt the 223 Remington can't do that as well as the 204 Ruger!
I have been proving that to myself for quite some time now.
I just got back from an extended and intense Prairie Dog Hunt and the 5 (five) 204 Rugers we 4 (four) Hunters were using on that trip sure made a lot of Praire Dogs "mistified"!
Your musings on the 6mm Remington are interesting but NOT really germane to the "204 or 223" question posed here initially.
Again I heartily suggest you get some extended trigger time in a Dog Town with a 204 Ruger Varminter!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

A dead prairie dog can be made with a 22 magnum, but it won't give you the destruction the Swift does. You guys can go on with your data on 204's and Tac 20's but the argument is moot. I didn't try and tell him to use a Swift or 6mm, I used that to make the point that there is always something better, no matter what the caliber or game hunted.

As to prairie dog safaris, I am happy you have had them with your 204 Ruger, but I have been shooting prairie dogs with a .222, .223, 220 Swift, 6mm PPC, 6mm Rem. all at the same time, keeping cool barrels and shooting 100's of rounds of ammo.

When my Swift barrel gets shot out, guess what, I can put another one on it. Meanwhile, I keep pouring hundreds of rounds of ammo down the tubes of all those rifles and still have no need for the 204 Ruger. It just doesn't do anything I can't do already. Furthermore, I am sure I have more invested in that arsenal than any of you do in your 204's and I could own and shoot one if I wanted, I just don't need to.

The original post was about 204 Ruger VS .223 with the thought of a trip to South Dakota to shoot prairie dogs, and somehow you have tried to make a total case on that alone. The .223 still remains the best starting place for varminting and small game due to physical aspects of ammo availability, components, economy of reloading etc.

Keep your 204's and enjoy the heck out of them. I will not say that someday I wouldn't own one, but that day is not today, and I can guess round for round I have spent more time and money in pursuit of varmints than you will ever know.

22-250AI with 36gr Varmint grenades started at 4300+ ... Fun, fun FUN!

My vote regarding this thread though is 223. Start with that then add other rifles as needed / desired.

Shrapnel, LOVE them rifles of yours and the reloading room. My rifles and gun room look remarkably similar! Quite the affliction.

That sir, is sick -- and I like that!

Could somebody post some charts of the ballistic performance of the two calibers with both a relatively heavy and light bullet in each? Hopefully including wind drift...

John

223......Savage Low Profile series...repeater or s/shot..9 twist...for a great factory varmint/target rig.....although I use 223 AI...20 Vartarg & 20 Practical with Pac Nor heavy bbl's on Savage s/shot actions...along with others.....

I've got five .204's. They get .22-250 performance but less barrel heat and less recoil (call your own shots much of the time) and at similar cost of reloading as the .223 (once you have the brass in hand anyway). If you're not a reloader, by all means stick with the .223. And, yeah, you can throw me in the Rifle Looney bin also. Don't lose too much sleep over it though. You'll love either one!

.223 They're accurate. They're fun to shoot. With a little discipline, the barrels last forever. Brass is cheap. Bullets are cheap. I've yet to see bulk .204 bullets on sale. You can buy pulled milsup bullets for practice. Buy 8# of H335 and your kids may inherit some of it.
The only downside is you can't run around and say: "look, look I've got the latest toy." (that ought to be good for about 20 pages of BS from VG. 65 dedicated varmint rifles,indeed. The question is Why? are you a pawn shop? Also, where did you come up with this "distance at which 90% of the Pdogs are shot."?

What he said...223!

I guess some of you fellas never heard of Midways' or Midsouths' bulk 20 caliber bullets . Same price as the 22 s .

Commercial brass is virtually the same price , 204 or 223 . The supply of milsurp brass has pretty much dried up around my neck of the woods . During the last year , I've found it easier to find 204 components in stock at local stores than 223 . Many times I've seen the 223 brass bin empty while there were 204 s on the shelve . It can be a bit of an advantage to own something the legions of black rifle shooters don't use .

You can buy the 8 lbs. of H335 and shoot it in a 204 also . In general , the same range of powders work well in either . And at about the same volume of powder per shot .


Bottom line , the difference in cost of shooting between the 2 calibers (assuming handloading) is virtually nil......

I like the 204 myself. I started with a 223 and needed another rifle to shoot as the 223 barrel cooled down. I got a Savage 12 VLP in 204 for strictly shooting off the bench at sage rats at long distances. I now have 2 Savages in 204 and the 223 does not even go anymore. It shoots faster and flatter than the 223 and has a better BC which means that there is less wind drift. Ballistically it shoots with the 22-250 for the first 250 yards. It costs the same to reload both. Faster means more red mist effect! You can see most of your shots which is nice to correct the next shot on a miss. We tried out the 17 Fireball on the last prairie dog trip and it did very well out to 400 yards. If you do not reload, go with the 223, however you can get bulk loaded 204 now but it is not as plentiful. I'm sure you will enjoy either one you get. Why do you think that we get so many toys to play with????

I don't own a .204 so I really can't say anything about it. At closer ranges I use a .22 Hornet. For longer range, I use a .223. For really out there, I use a .25-06

another vote for the 204. I have both and have taken both on the same pd trip. Switch out when one gets hot. The 204 to me definitely has the edge in range ,lack of recoil in a light rifle(see your hits, or misses), and splat factor.