Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns Which 45 acp?

+1, I also have a Springfield. They hold up very well

Springers are as rough as you let them be. They make a very nice upper end pistol as well.

My Colt 45 was bank vault tight - shot very well and the shipmate I sold it to loves it still. Were I to get another, I doubt it would be a Kimber. Prob a Springer.

Used a Remington Rand 1911 that belonged to my father-in-law for a while. It was well used, but was a lot of fun to shoot. I have a Springfield Loaded; nice pistol for the money.

"Today I still have Springfields, but no Kimbers. Enough said."

Ok, enlighten me and explain please? Did you buy one tricked out of have it tuned? I played with the GI model.

I own an Officer's sized Kimber .45 and have had great luck with it these past several years. No FFT anything, looks great, fits well.......GTG.

Many of the earlier Kimber .45's were manufacturered with external extractors and they had a very large # of issues with them.....very large. I'm aware of some here that don't promote Kimbers now due to their experience then with their older external extractor models. For years now, Kimber has only offered their .45's with internal extractors. This wasn't done on a whim and cost a bunch of $.....there was good reason to change and they did (after losing several LE contracts and the military wouldn't consider buying their .45's unless they changed back to the IE's). Never understood why they ever went to the EE after success with their initial offerings in IE.

Kimbers, with the internal extractors, have few, if any, of the issues directly related to those earlier Kimber .45's.

Any and all models and makes of most anything will have issues, some more than others. It is good to do your homework as you are, but when asking such questions, it is prudent to be specific when negative responses cause you some concern. Oftentimes the age and/or manufacture date of a firearm can and does have a great deal to do with how they now function....generally speaking.

Look at the Kimber rifle threads. Many of the current and previous owners themselves say that if you purchase one nowadays, your chances are much greater to have a more reliable and accurate rifle than if you had purchased one sometime ago. Good info, but only because more specifics, such as date of manufacture, were obtained.

Good luck.......

I have one Springfield Loaded Model and one TRP. Both are excellent and completely reliable.

I had one Kimber Ultra Carry and one CDP Compact. Both were basket cases.

Case in point........

TRH had, I believe, a Kimber with the external extractor. He and I (or Rost and I.....?) discussed this sometime ago and I'm pretty sure he said that it was the EE'd version....to the best of his recollection......and now mine.....

I'd be somewhat surprised if the majority of those not promoting Kimbers in this thread, didn't previously own EE'd Kimbers.

Then again.........

Kimbers were originally made with internal extractors. They went to external ones, and got burned by the traditionalists. There are some benefits to external extractors, believe it or not. My Kimber is only 3 or 4 years old (won it at a Friends of the NRA dinner) and has the EE. It functions just fine, although I have not run as much ammo through it as I have through any of my other 1911s. Customer demand forced them back to IEs. My main concern is getting it fixed later - not its functionality. (Don't the Sig 1911s come with EEs?)

You can't compare a base model GI Springfield and a higher-end Kimber - compare apples to apples.

I agree completely with Cali Hunter's last statement. I've never owned a Kimber-have always heard lots of good stuff about them, but don't recommend them because I've owned lots of others that I do have firsthand experience with and can recommend. The only reason I've never owned a Kimber was they just never tripped my trigger and I always thought they were high for what they were. Not saying that is right, but just saying...I've never felt the need for a Wilson or Les Baer either. I'm quite sure the latter two are fine, fine weapons.

I've owned lots of Springfields-probably half a dozen. My current one is a Loaded model. It gets less use than my Taurus simply because it lacks a rail on which to mount a light and I've been walking a lot at dusk lately and also shooting at some Prairie Woofs. I recommend either highly. In fact, I sold a Colt Government after obtaining these two simply because I felt it was inferior to both of them and I didn't need three .45 autos, especially one that wouldn't reliably feed hollowpoints.

Yes, Kimber's were first offered with the IE's and for whatever reason, they transitioned to the EE's. Whether yours runs fine or not, that obviously wasn't the norm. I'm glad for you, but it's quite evident that many were not as fortunate. While being a member of the Kimber Forum as well, I was able to pick up alot on what happened to cause such transitions in their approach to making their pistols. I'm no expert, far from it, but with a little reading and paying attention to documented links from articles discussing such changes, it is irrefutable as to why Kimber changed back to the IE.

As is quite obvious, Kimber now manufacturers their pistols to employ IE's instead of EE's. They did this for a reason. Waaaay too many issues attributed to the EE's. They were unable to enter into contractual agreements with the military after tests, using their EE'd pistols, failed to make the grade. After the Tacoma PD in WA state took delivery of a # of their EE'd pistols, they returned them soon thereafter after determining that they failed to function properly and on a very regular basis. Kimber was told that if they chose to transition to the IE, they would reconsider entering into a contract with them. Many of their more senior LEO's had older IE'd model Kimbers and had very satisfactory experiences with them, which is why their dept., in part, chose to go Kimber initially.

Kimber did not totally reverse course because it was cost effective for them to do so, it was a huge financial burden for them to do so. They did it because the issues with their EE'd pistols had gained such an infamous reputation that all but the least wary and or ignorant, chose to spend their $ elsewhere......who wouldn't? "Customer demand", as you say, would be better described as "customer dissatisfaction"......big time. But not only from the private/public sectors, but from the more financially important LE and military venues as well.

Kimber did stand behind the issues the EE's brought about. From the statement of many Kimber Forum members alone, many "send backs" came back with IE's replacing their previous EE's. The vast majority then stated that their initial problems had all but dissappeared. Good CS after a bout with bad QC.......a very prudent approach.

Sure there are great, reliable, put your life on the line pistols out there which employ EE's.......never suggested otherwise and wouldn't. Glocks come to mind....... I haven't and wouldn't disparage EE's, absolutely no reason to do so. It isn't an EE issue, per se.....it's the entire package issue. Kimbers with EE's are simply suspect, at best. Kimbers with IE's.......not near as much.

IE'd Kimbers currently seem to be realizing the same positive results as many other .45's are......quite a change from several years ago. There will never be a mass produced or custom firearm manufacturer that doesn't have one or more "send backs" for reasons related to a failure to..........whatever. This applies to both IE'd and EE'd pistols. But some will see alot more country and a gunsmith's bench time than others.

Doing a little bit of homework as the OP is doing can only help to reduce the potential anxieties that many before him have experienced.

Helping him to make the best decision he can, whether he accepts the help or information, is all that one can do.

Calif. Hunter - where was this King's Gunworks that you had your Colt put together.....if you don't mind?

Thanks............

My Kimbers were earlier IE editions. Nice and all but the reason I wouldn't get another isn't that. Just that now, for the money, it's hard NOT to get a nice 1911. Wasn't always so and that's how Kimber became who they are. They offered something few were doing at the time without sending it to a 3rd party gunsmith.

King's Gun Works is a rather famous gunshop in the Los Angeles metro area. It is in Glendale, kind of in the northern portion of said city. It has been around a long time. I used to have a Colt SAA in 32-20 which had been modified by them from fixed to adjustable sights. Such mods were common on 32-20's back in the day. Skeeter Skelton spoke of having one, and it wasn't the only one I've ever seen. Jan Libourel, former editor for Handguns and currently the main man for Gun World, has spoken of them. IIRC, one of his most interesting projects involved King's modifying a Norinco 1911 into a fine example of the breed.

A couple of points that is were mentioned briefly if at all by others.

I like Glock just fine but don't like the 2x4 grip of the 21. I do like the slim 36 for carry and shooting. You might want to try one.

Another nice weapon is the S&W M&P. Lots of people I know have gotten them for free lately and love them. I shot a couple of examples and like them a lot also. I would take one gladly.

I do like 1911's and own several including a base late production Kimber and a base early production Springfield. The base Springfield was worked over by a very good gunsmith and is an incredible shooter now.

I like them all. If I was buying one now it might just be the S&W M&P.

Thanks CY - I asked because a gunsmith friend of mine in town owned a shop with the same name....his last name being King as well. This was many years ago. He was a very fine gunsmith, albeit young for having such a stellar reputation.

People from all over the country sent him work and I thought that perhaps we were talkin' about my buddies shop.......

Cory took his own life many years back so it's rare to hear of anyone anymore that owns a firearm that Cory had actually worked on.

I guess I was just tryin' to reconnect a little........

Thanks again CY.......

I bought the Commander from my older brother when he needed cash. He has tried to buy it back several times... Mine has a S&W revolver sight installed as an adjustable rear sight, expertly fitted. It was "state of the art" for an action competition gun at the time in the 1970s, IIRC.

As stated, King's Gun Works is in Glendale, but they no longer do any gunsmithing. They also used to be a major manufacturer/supplier of after-market accessories like ambi-safeties, beavertail grip safeties, bushings, etc.

Poor QC and customer demand (or dissatisfaction or unhappiness or whatever) doomed the EE Kimbers. People who shouted "John Moses Browning did not design it that way!", at the same time putting Commander hammers, beavertail grip safeties, full-length guide rods, etc. on their 1911s. Kimber also provdided poor QC in other areas at that time, contributing further to loss of sales. They woke up and fixed their issues, but it cost them sales as well as serivce dollars fixing the issues. Their service policy is that you pay the postage and get a free magazine if they determine that your issue is valid and their fault. (At least that is the way it was when I checked into returning my EE Kimber to them. I would have to lie and say the gun doesn't function in order for them to replace the slide with an IE one.)

2 of my buddies sent their EE'd Kimbers back and sent along descriptions of their continuing malfunctions. One was returned with a new IE, the other was returned with the EE intact and the issues supposedly fixed.

The returned IE Kimber ran fine and continues to do so, while the "fixed" EE'd one was again returned for the same issues. Kimber has since replaced that pistol with an EE and no further problems have occured.

I expect that they take each occurance individually, which makes sense, but seems that more often than not, replacing the EE's with IE's is where most end up. Besides my 2 friends experiences, many others have reported the exact same sequences of events which led to their Kimber EE's being switched out. No lying necessary when the issues were so obvious.

Again, there are those that report no issues with their EE'd Kimbers, but there are many more I've read about that report the same with their IE'd Kimbers. Of those that had their extractors changed out, you couldn't convince many or perhaps any of them that the change out didn't solve the problem.....IMHO.

Not a cheap endevour for Kimber, but much cheaper than the alternative. That they're still in business wasn't always a given. Not all venerable firearm manufacturers have been so fortunate.........

I'd take a look at the STI Trojan. I currently have a Colt but if I were to get another the STI is what I'd get. I do have the STI Ranger II and it's great so I could really recommend it as well.

i don't care for he trigger,hammer sear geometry on the Kimbers

Well, I finally bit the bullet and bought a Springfield 1911-A1 GI and could not be happier. Just excited and figured I would tell those who might care. The wife just does not understand!