Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Muzzleloaders Hard time with T/C 50 cal Hawken precussion

For the life of me I can not get my T/C Hawken with 1-48 twist to shoot RB with any degree of accuracy. What should I expect at 50yd out of a gun vise or a set of setting shooting sticks?
What thickness of patches should I be using? I am currently lubing with rapeseed oil, or olive oil (cooking oil) and using 490 balls with ,022 linnen patches. My current load is Remington #11 caps and 90-100gr of Hodgdon Select Pyrodex. I am loading Pyrodex as BP is too hard to get here in Canada otherwise I would be shooting Goex. I understand that a 1-48 twist is a RB compromise as well as a minie ball compromise. RB shoots best with a 1-60 and Minie likes 1-28. Anyway once again what should I expect group wise at 50 yards with RB and 360gr Minie?

Cheers & Tighter Groups: Eaglesnester

May I suggest you try the Hornady "Great Plains" .50 385 grain bullet starting at 80 grains and increase your charges in 5 grain increments up to 90 grains and possibly 95.0 grains.

Never saw a T/C Hawken that would not shoot that combo.

I filed down the front factory front sight beads to a blade on several T/C Hawkins and it made helped holding a fine "BEAD" on the target.


Doc

don�t always plan on those twist rates . I shoot a 435 grain mini in my 54 and it has a 1 in 70 twist .

Without going into a lot of detail and historical reference ,how well a big conical will do depends more on the conical design and type of rifling over twist rates

Off the bench I would say 1 inch groups at 50 yards with the PRB
Unless of course your fighting that special , Q counter bore TC did .

I would fro the charge back to 50 grains and then work up by 10 grains at a time doing 3 shot groups . Until the pattern opens up
Your probably going to find something in the 80-90 grain mark. More then acceptable hunting load and in the ball park of 90-100 grains of 3F black .

If you still have problems , you need to check you patch . Go pick some up after you fire a couple rounds . They should look just like you could reuse them . IE no holes and not torn or burnt up .
If you find they have tears in them . Look closely on the patch . The powder will leave the pattern of the bore rifling on the patch . If the tear or holes is next to one of those , you have either a rough or sharp rifling
This can be resolved with shooting or by lapping the bore .
If the patch is burned or torn by t the center where the ball can be seen to set . Then either your not using good patch material OR you material is to tight and you compromising the patch in loading .

While patch thickness is important . So is the weave .
What is the linen you using . IMO pillow ticking is about the best patch material you can find . Its cheep and is normally in .018 thickness .
This is my wife�s normal load for her TC
Its 80 grains of 3F goex 490RB with .018 pillow ticking patch . She holds 1 inch groups benched even at 100 yards with that load in her rifle

I have a PA, Hunter TC and shoot RB. I too was having trouble and A member here told me to cut blue jean material for patch the size of a quarter for a patch for 50 cal. BINGO it worked great and shunk groups big time. For what it is worth ,,,,,,,,,,

Tacksmacker

a load of 80 gr of any powder is about right for these guns.mine was out 2 days in a row with 100gr then 90 gr then at 80 it started to group again its in the gun not books or what your told

My TC Hawken and Renagade both shoot their best with 80gr. of Goex.

Can you shoot a sabot? My 1:48 Hawkens all shoot a 240gr. XTP over 100gr. T7 very well, indeed. Important that you swab between shots, too, when sighting in. Afterwards, I always shoot a string without cleaning, to see how the old girl acts. One of my .50's uses a Hornady 385gr Great Plains over 90gr. 777, and it is very accurate in the 80 - 90 gr. charge range.

Clover leaf patterns with holes touching should be your standard with roundballs out of that gun.

T/C 1:48 twist barrels in most cases prefer 70-80 grains of Goex FFG, a .490 ball and .015 patch. I have owned many and that has been the case. It also jives with what T/C reccomends.

I have several TC's as well as Lymans and some custom flinters as well. However I am strickly a goex shooter. Pyrodex will work for you I am sure. For me I would prefer to take the extra time and hunt down the goex and build a supply of it or swiss. As far as your gun goes stay with the .490 ball. Use a pillow ticking patch ( 100% cotton ) and back off to about 60 grains. shoot 3 to 5 shot groups. Swab out your barrel and then increase in 5 grain increments. You will see when you have gone to far as the groups will be opening back up. Each gun will be different and will want to shoot at a different load . but my guess is you will get the best grouping at about 80 to 85 grains. Hope this helps and good luck to you.

I can say t/c barrel early years will tack drive R/B with heavy charges of goex 3F but these barrel were not made by t/c .The early barrel were made by Sharon and Douglas.The early Sharon barrel run with a spade under the barrel in the rear of the barrel wedge.The Douglas barrels are barrels in the late 70's 5 and maybe 6 digits serial numbers.The barrels made by t/c have the model stamped into-the barrel the older barrel do not have the name like hawkens,renegade.
I have 2 barrels one a hawkens the other a renegade in flintlock
the renegade is 54 cal. kit gun the hawkens a 5 digit number.The both barrels with tack drive round balls with 90 to 100 grains of goex 3F out to 100 yards.I like to use a wad under the patched round ball,the pillow material out of walmart runs .017 to.018 I Also use my own pure beeswax/lard @ no salt) and a few table spoons of olive oil.

There are a lot of possibilities, a lot of different things to consider. That gun should shoot.

With that twist, you might want to try a lighter load with round balls. For instance, in my first TC .58, turned out round balls shot best with only 60 grains of FFg, max was 120. I don't know for sure it'll help, but it's worth a try.

You say minie ball. Do you mean a true minie ball, or just generically a conical? I have shot TC's "factory" 370 grain conicals in a .50 TC with the 1-48" twist, n o problem with stability. However, a hollow based minie ball might be too long even if it's lighter.

1) I'd suggest is upgrading caps. I never had good luck with Remington caps. RWS always worked best for me with CCI as my fallback. I've generally had better luck with a magnum cap than a standard cap.

2) I'd suggest picking up a box each of TC's "factory" conicals, 275 ish grain and 325 ish grain, I forget what the actual weights are in .50 right now.

3) If you are not using Speer or Hornady round balls, get a box of them. Some off brands may not be as concentric. Get a pack of TC's "factory" pre cut, pre lubed patches.

4) If you can, try getting ahold of a pound of real FFg black powder. Some guns shoot it drastically better than they shoot the synthetic black powders, some don't care.

Oh ... a question I forgot to ask: how old is this gun? Some of the newer guns have a rifling-less section about an inch long at the muzzle TC calls QLA .. Quick Load Accurizer. I've had 2 guns with it so far and neither shot nearly as well as the older guns I had without it.

As far as accuracy, I'd probably settle for 2" at 50 yards, that'll kill deer to practical sidelock ranges, same with conicals or round balls, but if everything is working right it should be under an inch. I don't know about by-vice, I use Caldwell bags front and rear, same as I do for my centerfires. I am not good enough with sticks, lack shot to shot consistency, so I would not judge a gun by the results of that.

Your gun with your twist should be handling round balls and TC's 'factory' conicals well. TC doesn't currently offer a lead bullet that a 1-48" twist shouldn't stablize.

Tom

Purchased my T/C Hawkens in 1985. No QLA at the muzzle. I can put 3 .490 round balls with the T/C pre-lubed (t/c bore butter) patches in under an inch at 100 yards. 1-48 twist. My powder is GOEX 3X / charge is 90grs. These muzzle loaders will shoot. Open sights, no scope. I can't remember the name of my caps without digging them out but they're made in Germany.

I can also shoot the T/C 370gr maxi ball and the 350gr hunter with the same load, 90grs of powder, under an inch at 100 yards. 1-48 twist is what works for both the round ball and conical bullets. This muzzle loader still looks like new after all these years except for the little dings in the stock from the antlers hitting it while I drag the buck and sling it over my back.

Ken