Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters What do you think of the .300H&H

I've been reading everything possible about the .300H&H since aquiring mine, and it makes me wonder why it's not a more popular round.



I understand the .300 Winchester can be used in a standard .30-06 length action, whereas the .300H&H requires a true "magnum length", but IMHO, the whole purpose of a "magnum" is to push heavy for caliber bullets at upper-end velocities. It looks to me like the .300 Winchester is ideal with bullets up to and including 180 grs., but the longer 200's and 220's eat up powder space.



As far as the various ".300 short mags" go, I understand the appeal of a short action, but from what I can tell, they're best suited for lighter bullets, probably along the lines of 150 to 165grs, which to me, defeats the purpose of a magnum in the first place.



Everything I've read about the .300H&H says it's a handloaders dream and that it feeds as smoothly as any cartridge possibly could. With modern powders it appears to really wake up and runs right on the heels of the .300 Winchester, and actually out paces it (velocity wise) with the above mentioned 200gr and 220gr bullets due to it's longer neck (case capacity), so what are the drawbacks?



I think the .300H&H has a definate nostalgic (sp?) following, especially when chambered in the pre-64 Model 70's and Remington 721's, but I think it's a dying breed, which is truly a shame.



Despite it's limited following, I'd be curious to see how many rifles Winchester could sell if they chambered a run of their "Classic" Model 70's in .300H&H.

I'd say you've summed it up pretty darn well, and can't add a thing to it!

Although I already own one in a Rem 721, if Ruger started chambering the No.1 S ( 26" w/irons ) in the 300 H&H, I'd buy one in a second.

Jeff

The .300 H&H is a truly terrible cartridge:

1) It has a belt. This means it won't group inside a paper plate at 100 yards.
2) It's too long. Most hunters can't even lift a cartridge that long anymore, as the extra leverage tends to tip the boys forward onto their noses.
3) The shoulder angle is far too shallow. This means half the powder burns outside the muzzle, lighting forest fires.

Seriously, the only thing wrong with the .300 H&H is that there isn't much selection in factory ammo. Oh, and that it's OLD, OLD, OLD.

You are mistaken about the powder space thing, though, whether in the .300 Winchester or .300 WSM. Both handle heavy bullet just fine. In fact the .300 WSM will match the .300 H&H bullet for bullet. If you don't believe me, look up both in a modern manual, such as Nosler's No. 5. You'll find the 200-grain Partition running about the same speed from all three. I have tried the same bullet in all three, and it does work just fine, at 2900+ fps.

The reason the old handloader's myth about "long bullets in short-necked cartridges" continues is that too many gun writers believe that somehow a .30 caliber bullet's base takes up more room inside a short-necked cartridge than in a long one. This simply isn't true.

Let's say a heavy .30 caliber bullet needs to be seated .2" deeper in a given case. That extra .2" takes up exactly the same amount of space in any .30-caliber cartridge, whether a .300 WSM or .300 H&H. And that little bit of "lost powder room" has almost no affect on ballistics.

In fact, if you care to section the case--or do the math--the 200-grain Nosler Partition (or any other extra-long bullet, such as a 180-grain Barnes X) protrudes just about as far below the .300 Weatherby's neck as it does the .300 WSM's.

This doesn't mean the .300 H&H isn't a fine cartridge. It is, the reason I went to the trouble of having a new Model 70 Classic in 7mm STW rebarreled to .300 H&H. But it simply does not have all the sexy new features (beltless, fat, sharp shoulder angle) that make newer .300's mythically superior. All it does is produce the same ballistics and accuracy, and kills big game just as dead.

MD

I can't understand any purpose at all to having a 300 H&H. Ream out the chamber and you get a 300 Weatherby. A lot of people used to do this with REmington 721s. More power. Nostalgia? The 300 Weatherby is 60 years old.

MD, you revealed a lot of truths with your excellent post.

Quite honestly, the .300 H&H, .308 Norma, .300 WSM, and .300 Win. Mag. all deliver about the same level of velocity, and all will do pretty much the same thing on game. I have not seen that velocity past 3000-3100 fps. with 180s out of any .300 is necessary or adds anything in the way of killing power. The bigger cartridges (.300 WBY. and above) are harder to shoot. The .300 Win. is the most available.

But the .300 H&H combines a good many desireable things in one package: Less recoil than the .300 WBY. with more than adequate velocity for any task you'd but a .300 to; increased magazine capacity over the WSM and Ultra-Gag versions; better feeding than the WSM and U-Gs, plus superb inherent accuracy.

This next point is sometimes overlooked, but the .300 H&H has exactly the same bolt throw as it's blood-kin, the .375 H&H, and about the same as its well-bred British cousin, the .416 Rigby. For a two-rifle safari, you can team a .300 H&H with a .375 H&H or a .416 Rigby, have rifles with the same bolt-throw (less chance of short-stroking), yet your .300 H&H light rifle will kick less and for practical purposes kill stuff just as well as a .300 WBY. would.

Not a bad set of advanatges in my estimate............

AD

If the public wanted the 300 H&H then someone would make them. The M70's were so chambered for a long time and the 30-06 outsold the 300 H&H by a ten to one ratio.

The eight degree shoulder is inaqequate to headspace on so case life and insipiant head separtations are always a concern.

The 300 WSM and 300 WM are both better cartridges.

I happen to have a 300 H&H and use it. It's a nostagia thing and not a practical situation. A buddy shot a nice buck last year with his Super 30 and it makes a nice story rather than saying you used a 30-30.

Thanks fellas, the input is greatly appreciated. Mule Deer, your information was especially eye-opening and welcomed. I completely misunderstood about the "short mags".



I've yet to even fire this rifle, but can't wait to do so. I still can't believe my father-in-law actually gave it to me. He's a heck of a guy!



Believe me, I have no intention whatsoever of rechambering to .300 Weatherby. It'll remain as is until I'm pushing up daisies.



Savage 99: "If the public wanted the 300 H&H then someone would make them. The M70's were so chambered for a long time and the 30-06 outsold the 300 H&H by a ten to one ratio."



I agree with this to a point. I don't think it should be a regular catalog item, but I'll bet a special run of "Classic's" in .300H&H would sell like hotcakes.



Thanks again.

The only person who is concerned about short bolt throw is the mfg. or some writer who has run out of real info. The lack of factory ammo will kill the super 30. You can load on a par with the other big 30s. My favorite varmint load is 125gr at 3600. Kenny

I love em..... The design of the case, even with knowing about inherant short life, still makes one of the slickest feeding rounds in existence. Most of the belted rounds will comfortably last only about 3 reloadings anyway. This is a caliber that one usually doesn't shoot a ton of per year anyway so I don't think that's much of a detractor, and cases are still easily available at companies such as MidwayUSA.

Loaded up to modern day standards, it's a solid thumper for most anything in NA...

The short case life isn't a problem in a custom chamber, set up to actually headspace on the belt, the way the cartridge was designed to work. That's why the .300 H&H (and the .375 H&H) have belts! Their shoulders are too shallow for headspace control.

My own .300 H&H was rebarreled by Dan Pedersen at Classic Barrel and Gunworks in Arizona (www.cutrifle.com). Dan makes cut-rifled, hand-lapped barrels and also rebores and rerifles. I've had him do 3 jobs so far and they have all been excellent. The .300 H&H was a rebarrel of a 7mm STW factory rifle and he matched the contour of the factory barrel perfectly. The .300 H&H is easy to load, and in the real world will do anything the 7mm STW will.

Case life in this rifle is excellent. Haven't strictly counted, but must have fired some cases 5 times or more without a hint of separation, with new, full-length RCBS dies. And in actuality bolt throw is exactly the same as it is in any Model 70--or Rem. 700 or long-action Savage or Weatherby or about any modern bolt action that isn't designed around the .30-06 length of loaded cartridge. These are rare these days. The Ruger 77 "long" is about it.

I also have .300 Winchester and .300 WSM rifles, and have owned a couple .300 Weatherbys, so am not riding some hobby horse. For anybody who likes classic cartridges and .30 caliber the .300 H&H is a fine one.

I love mine--165 NP are fast, flat shooting, 200 NP will handle anything that does not need a .375 H&H or better.

The H&H has the awe factor built in--it is cool. 26" barrels are the best. I have seen Rem 700 300 H&H Classics with 22" barrels--this seemed to me to be a mistake.

I love the 300 H&H. I don't have one right now but am ready for my next one. I plan to build it on either a Model 70 Classic action or a Montana. Case life is fine if you set your reloading die correctly so as to not set back the shoulder. It may not be short and fat but accuracy is extremely good in a good rifle.

I hunted in Africa in 1988 with a .375 Sako Safari and a 7mm mag Ruger 77. The Sako held five in the box with one in the chamber, the Ruger less. And the safeties differed. Bad. So when I returned I got another Sako Safari .375 and rebarreled one of them to .300 H&H, making another six-shooter identically operating rifle. I have never gone back to Africa but sold the pair to a gent who has, and he has been delighted with them, especially the .300 which holds 1" for five shots with his handloads. The short magnums are too fat for the magazine to hold many cartridges, the slender H&H Magnums give you that extra capacity, and of course they feed very smoothly. I had to shoot a buffalo four times with the .375 and was quite happy to know I still had two left in the rifle if he planned to get up again - which he did not.

I just hauled my two .300 H&Hs -- a Rem Classic and rechambered Ruger #1 -- to Quebec for a deer hunt. Never got a shot -- the rut
just has not happened yet and I wanted a big buck...

They allow me to shoot .300 mags w/o further dorking up my
rotator cuff or goiong all 'flinchy' after a range sessiion. An ideal fix for me. So muc so, thta I now also own and enjoy two .375 H&Hs -- yep a Ruger #1 and a Interarms Safari

1B

It'll never make it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

THANK YOU MULE DEER!!!
If I never hear another gunwriter write any more drivel about short cartridges not handling long bullets "because of how the bullet takes up more of the available powder space" - I'll think to myself "I'm glad ol' John finally straightened them out on that old wives tale!
Don't the gunwriters that write that nonsense have chronographs? Haven't they ever noticed that velocity drops off a similar amount when you move up bullet weights - regardless of the shape of the case? It makes me wonder where their heads are - and I've read that nonsense from many of your peers who should know better.
Thanks for putting that myth to bed - hopefully once and for all.

PS. The old H&H will almost do everything the newer .300 WSM can do - in a longer action, making a heavier rifle with a longer bolt throw. It's a fine old cartridge - but (except for the mystique) doesn't do anything better than the newer designs. That's not damning it, let's just be realistic about it.

The 300 H&H is a fine cartridge. Back in the late 50s it was the premier Elk cartridge. I,ve owned a couple in 721,s and they did it all. I sold the last one to a friend who wanted it more than I did.
I have since bought a Tikka T-3 in 300 WSM. It does everything the 721 300H&H did in a much lighter package, and the t-3 has a really nice trigger.

As customary, many wrong assumptions. When Winchester brought out the 300 Win Mag and coupled with the fact that a lot of 300 H&Hs were getting long in the tooth, Winchester purposely slowed down the load to 2880fps (180gr bullet), so a lot of folks opted correctly for the 300 Win Mag. I've owned a 300 H&H for many years and relaod for it. NEVER have I had a case separation and some of my brass have over 10 loadings. Moreover, there isn't a cartridge made out there that feeds smoother than the 300 H&H. It is a very accurate cartridge and when you consider what Allen said, it makes for a perfectlight rifle for Africa. For that very reason, I am taking a pre-64 70 to Africa as my companion to the 416 Rigby. jorge