Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors 250-3000 Bullet debate in the 99

TROLL.

BP...

NO!!!!! You guys doing this to me on purpose? Speer lists their 87gr Hot Core bullet as good for game up to whitetails. The Speer TNT 87gr is a varmint bullet.

We won't mention how Hornady classifies their 87gr bullet, since I promised LBK we'd start up another thread about that.

The Greenhill formula is not infallible with jacketed bullets or monolithic bullets. It was worked out back in the days of lead bullets only. That said, it is still a good starting point for determining the amount of twist required to stabilize a bullet. Google it and plug in the specs for the current crop of 100 grain and heavier .25 bullets and see why 1-14" is on the ragged edge of stabilizing them.

The rifling machinery in use 80-100 years ago was not as precise as those used today. It was possible to turn out a rifled bore that varied somewhat in the specified pitch. One might stumble onto an early .250 that has 1-13", or 1-15", which would effect the subject up for debate. The old Pratt & Whitney rifling machines revolutionized mass production of rifled barrels but weren't fool proof.

As a variation on the definition of insanity (which is "Doing the same exact thing repeatedly and expecting different results"), I propose "Making the same false statement repeatedly and expecting different replies."

I don't care WHAT Hornaday calls it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,it's a killer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rory, we don't need another bullet thread. There's been enough of that already. I ain't makin any statements,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I'm just killin deer with my old .250's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I decided to squeeze this in and in case anyone's wondering if I understand the original intent of this thread, I do. BUT, my contention is what difference does it really make? I am looking for practical hunting accuracy. If you want benchrest accuracy don't try to do it with a hunting rifle. BTW, I had a 99 with a 1-10 twist and I couldn't shoot it worth a darn with even 100 grainers. I have 3 now that have the old 1-14 and no, I haven't actually measured any of them. These are the bullets I work with. So far it's been the Hornadys and the Winchester factorys. I took Rory's advice and bought some Speer Hot Cors. I also have 5 boxes of the old Norma 87's that I am dieing to try on deer.

If the 80 grain TTSXs didn't group in my Model 14, I was considering using up the rest of the box after pulling the tips on them and attempting to load them that-a-way for my 1920...

Is a modified 80 grain TTSX without the extra "T" a varmint bullet or a deer bullet?

Yes.

I like L.B.K. Use the Same Bullets and as others.
Hornady,speer,and even Berger when ya find them have all preformed well,,I'm not looking for hole to hole with a hunting rifle,,but it groups between 1/4" and 1inch your good to go,,after all it's a hunting rifle as Stephen-L.B.K. said and i agree, not a match grade rifle.
And i for one,like old reliable proven effective loads and bullets.As far as the point i'm trying to make,,,seems most here and i know use old "so to speak of" reliable bullets with proven track records.So why even try to re-invent the wheel?

I like seeing a little hunting in the mix. Did not consider 25's as a great deer caliber, but I'm liking what I see. Wont have to get as bloody next time getting to that heart. By the way LBK my wife loves the way you posed that forkhorn and asked me to make mine that cute from now on. Great pics, wouldn't mind a few more DEER vs. .250 pics it might help sway my .30 caliber mentality

Jack

On the nose LBK! By the way I'd sell my left nut for a supply of those old Norma bullets. The Norma 87 and 100 grainers I used back in the day in a long gone .257 Roberts M1952 Mannlicher-Schoenauer were pure death and destruction on deer.

I just haven't used them (the Normas) BUT I REALLY want to!!!!!!!!!!

It seems simple to me. The .250-3000 made its stellar and still unsurpassed reputation as a deer rifle with the 87 grain bullet and I see no reason to use anything else. Those who for whatever cause want a heavier bullet should not complain about the 1-14 twist but instead simply find a later rifle with 1-10.

[quote=vigillinus]It seems simple to me. The .250-3000 made its stellar and still unsurpassed reputation as a deer rifle with the 87 grain bullet and I see no reason to use anything else. Those who for whatever cause want a heavier bullet should not complain about the 1-14 twist but instead simply find a later rifle with 1-10. [/quote



you are all right in your own minds

Calhoun you are priceless sometimes.
norm

I am pretty sure the 87 Speer hot-cor is a "deer" bullet like Calhoun said. Regardless it is great on both "medium" game and varmits. It is what I use in my old 250-3000 and I see no reason to change. I wouldn't hunt elk with it, but it has done great on antelope and whitetails for me.

Interesting discussion with just a bit of the name calling and insults that those who KNOW they are correct too often engage in.

I still believe that the rotational speed of the bullet has a bearing on its performance. I also think an 80 gr TTSX can be pushed as fast in the 250-3000 as an 87 gr Sierra.

Various sources list 99 250 twist rates as 1 in 14 and 1 in 10.
When did the change take place. What would a tang safety 99F have?

Would love to see some real targets as I am "rangeless" until June.

[quote=oldman1942

Various sources list 99 250 twist rates as 1 in 14 and 1 in 10.
When did the change take place. What would a tang safety 99F have?[/quote]

The change from 1/14 to 1/10 was in 1960. A tang safety will have 1/10.

Now I see that I'm going to have to check my inventory of 257 bullets to see what is available for the 1-14 twist 99. I have a G and H, but have always just used my post 1960 250s for hunting with 100, 115 or 120 bullets (well, one shoots sierra 75s the best!). Now I need to find a nice EG!!! Lots of good info here!

I think that it would be wise to check the ROT on any early 1960s vintage 99DL or 99F before betting the farm on it being a 1 in 10" ROT. Although the 99DL and 99F were cataloged in 250-3000, there appear to have been very few made and I think that it is possible that those few rifles might have been barreled with 1 in 14" ROT barrels.

I do believe that all of the tang safety 99As and 99CDs in 250-3000 were barreled with 1 in 10" ROT barrels.

Jeff

Great point and I should have made a general statement about the 1960 date.

About any bullet will work on deer in the 250 Savage. I have probably used them all at one time or another in that I have been shooting that caliber in a 99EG for 65 years, even used it a bit in Africa just for fun..Shot Kudu and Eland with it...

I shot deer and elk with it in my mispent cowboy youth and it worked well with 100 gr. Silvertips and it still does..I also used both 100 and 117 gr. factory Rem Corelokts on elk and they worked fine..

Today one of my favorite loads is the 85 gr. GS Customs monolithic high vel hollow point..it sure puts deer down and always leaves a good size exit hole.

At 2800 FPS most any of the cup and core bullets in 87 to 100 grs. work just fine in the 250-3000....

Well when my F arrives, I'll be hoping it's 1 in 10.