Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Wolves Entrenched

I wasn't condoning SSS. I believe they should be listed as a predatory non game animal with a continous open season much like coyotes in most states.


ddj

Thanks for the clarification, though I didn't assume you were in favor of it. I was condoning it. Your solution sounds perfectly reasonable and would allow for plenty of wolves to live and breed. It is highly unlikely it will ever be considered by the bunny huggers and fish cops, so that leaves only one viable option, sadly.

Dpole, I stated in an earlier post that Leopold was in favor of removing wolves from the landscape and I will give another quote here that he penned in 1921. "It is going to take patience and money to catch the last wolf and mountain lion in New Mexico." Now I will fast forward to 1944 when Leopold was the Commissioner of Wisconsin Conservation Commission, he stated publically that he believed there were too many wolves in Wisconsin and was in favor of a bounty and he lent his support to a bounty bill that became effective in 1945.

So just exactly when Leopold when and why he changed his mind is not clear because of his flip flopping. First he was for exterminating wolves, then he was against it, then he was for it. This action does not lend itself to a credible vision, rather it appears he was waxing poetically over the death of a wolf.

However, in defense of Leopold his game management positions in the state of Wisconsin placed him the political arena. I am sure he felt the stinging effect of that when his deer population calculations resulted in a very liberal deer season in 1943 that was considered by the public to be a slaughter. Leopold admitted IN WRITING that his figures he used in estimating the deer herd numbers was GUESS WORK. So much for a scientific approach to game management. I do have to cut him a little slack in the political area because he was in the hot bed of the Lafollete progessive (liberal)movement in Madison. The liberals thought they knew more about game management then the professionals in the field. Leopold tried to appease this group or was forced to and he felt the wrath of the public.

My point in all this was Leopold was not without warts and because people choose not to look under the hood he is held high...saint like. I do respect the man for the changes he helped bring about in conservation and preservation of our natural resources. I looked under the hood...but, I subscribe to Ronald Reagan's philosophy. Trust but verify.

you guys are arguing too much. the wolf population in the northern rockys is way out of controll, no question about it. So lets kill the damn things. No reason at all to have them as part of the landscape.
I am going to the NWT in 2011 and I pray that I will get a shot at one of the wolves up there!!!

They are a terrific trophy in their own right.

+1

Domestic sheep have done more harm to wildlife and flora than wolves ever have. Domestics have spread so much disease to wild sheep etc and destroyed so much natural flora that we should not subsidize the farmers one bit. In fact, we should ban domestic sheep from anywhere there is a possibility of them spreading disease or eating endangered flora.

P.S. We should also be allowed to hunt wolves where their populations are sustainable.

I thought I was in a debate...not an argument.

It is a debate..only we are suppose to all aggree with the anti-wolf crowd or face name calling.

Imagine that.....a wolf is a PREDATOR....what gave it away? The forward facing eyes and big canines?

Whip SHHH no one would take matters into their own hands!!

I love listening to wolves howl. The big gray wolf hanging on my wall is beautiful to my eyes. But, here in Alaska the wolves have devoured moose and caribou populations in some areas of our state. They also get lots of help from bears. Especially right after the calves are dropped. Our Fish & Game departments attempts to manage their numbers through aerial shooting is met with law suits from well financed groups that do not live in Alaska. Some folks confuse this air plane shooting with what the majority of "sport hunting" ethics fall under. Big mistake. We are just trying to kill a meat eating predator in the fastest and most efficient way possible. Wolves belong in our wilderness areas, however, their numbers have to be kept small or they will kill and eat everything they can. I would really like to see grizzly bears re-introduced into their old haunts in the river drainages and salmon streams of California. Oh yeah, give them federal protection. They really do need some sows with cubs hanging out in some of the residential areas like we have here on the Kenai.

Its easier to quote the man than to speculate on his emotional evolution. Thought it might help.

Actually, I've been studying Leopolds' works since about 1969(?). My favorite Leopold is Luna B.

The main reason I have that Aldo quote is that its one of my favorites to present to Leopold admirers, who mostly have not heard of that side of the guy. They have a hard time believing Aldo would do such a thing.

Here is another famous Aldo-quote (I think its right) that sounds real purty, but doesn't really make much sense. In fact it seems...well...stupid:
"Only a mountain has lived long enough to listen to the howl of the wolf objectively."
I know its supposed to be an insightful thought about man's emotional reaction to wolves, but I mean, really!! "Only a mountain"? How about a tweety bird? Does a tweety-bird give a S? Maybe a tree; does a tree care? At least a tree is alive, unlike Aldo's mountain. I anally digress...

But Aldo was great and brought stuff to the public's attention with artful prose. He made folks think differently. He deserves to be "held high", despite his warts.

No doubt about it Leopold had a way with words and those words could conjure up a signifcant thought process in the minds of those who were exposed to his literary works. In many respects the world is a better place because of it.

Overall I do not have a problem of individuals speaking highly of the man but not in an idolatrous sense.

Wolves kill hunting dogs!

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2439741/posts

Bingo.
A friend of mine is the main aerial shooter in unit 13 in Alaska.
I have a photo of him with 97 wolf hides tacked to a barn.
He manages wolves very well.

That is a great start!!!

How large are the wolves he is taking? Do they compare with these brutes we have here?

Can anyone tell us why we didn't go to Minnesota for wolves instead of paying for these large artic wolves? David Mech says this is the largest of the wolf sub species.

Even with the taking of 500 wolves last year there was a spike in livestock kills. What will 2010 be like for livestock producers?

I doubt you had to pay for them.

we killed wolvrs off a hundred years ago and we need to do it again this time for good.

Built bigger fences? Cattle are the path of least resistance for a pack of wolves, seeing as there was basically no wolves before and now there is, theres going to be big impact on any species originally hunted by them.