Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics The Vortex Hype

Good points I guess but I would still love to see a pair of Swaro's, Zeiss or Leica's hold up to being launched off the roof of a 4runner by accident put back together on the spot and work like before like my old Fujinon 15x60's did on a coues hunt in Sonora. They held up and I was able to finish the hunt with them. Best part at the time they cost half of what the Swaro's costs. So I feel I got what I paid for for less money and they did all if not more than optics costing twice as much.
I do believe you can get just as good or better for less money. Reason being I think a lot of the big three cost comes from the loss of value of the dollar compared to the Euro. If the dollar was as strong as a few years ago would the big three still be outragously priced? Probably not.
So as much as I think you bring up some good points I gotta sorta disagree.

I hope some of you guys that don't believe Vortex and Minox can be as good as Leupy and Zeiss don't read the review of the Minox rifle scopes. You guys probably wouldn't believe that a little mid level company could put out scopes like that.

Kique

nuguy, if a $2000 Swaro craps on a hunt, that's the last hunt it'll see with me....like I said,fix it, replace,then dump it.BTDT

I would never trust it again....

kikque, I never mentioned brand,cost,upper tier or anything similar....I have hunted and trusted some pretty intermediate grade optics and they served me well....

What I said applies to optics across the board,and we prove little with samples of one....

Good points Bobinh,

But I don't thinnk anyone ever said in this thread that the top end Vortex were optically equal to Ultravids, FL's, or SLC/EL. And I know that is not what I meant by my post.

Sure the alphas are a hair brighter/sharper, but I mean a friggin hair! Is a "hair" worth $800-$1200 more? And yes I carry Ultravids, my dad carrys Victory FL's and some of my hunting partners carry Razors and Vipers.

From what I've seen the Vortex and Minox ( I also own a pair of Minox) are very rugged, we don't wussy hunt. The one pair of Vipers are carried by one rough SOB. He carries them with the necksttrap around the saddle horn of his horse for miles, beatin' and bouncin'. They are still holding up well.

Everyone needs to remember even Swarovski, Leica, and Zeiss were "new" at one time too. I guesss if nobody had given them a chance, they wouldn't be here today.

By the way I'd put a Meopta up against ANY Alpha for durability.

Bill

Bob--I hear exactly where you are coming from. And I agree that if a critical piece of equipment fails, it certainly no longer warrants your confidence, even if it is repaired or replaced.

Based on that premise, I suppose I should not be using my THIRD Leica rangefinder, a CRF 1200. Leica stiffed the hell out of me on the warranty of the previous units, but I had to have a rangefinder superior to the Nikon and Bushnell models that were available, and the Zeiss was not on the market at that time. Hence my continued use of the third Leica. Now we have a "new era" of customer service from Leica, and the national service manager is assuring us that things will be taken care of now and forever more. Are we supposed to believe this just because Leica is an Alpha company? Addressing current and future problems is one thing but atoning for past sins is apparently not in the business model. Alpha company or not, I have been had by them and they will not get another crack at me.

Vortex, on the other hand, is not considered to be in the Alpha class. Yet they have delivered FIRST RATE products to me that have needed NO SERVICE whatever and they have done it at significantly less cost than other brands that provide comprable performance. They have won my confidence and I will continue to use them without apology. Vortex is not about hype as they deliver value as well as performance. I just wish they made a laser rangefinder.

The point I'm trying to make and I guess should have said to begin with is the Big Three are now grossly overpriced. If Fl/Ultravid/EL cost $1400 or so (which is all their worth) I would tell everyone to save their money and buy them.

But at over 2k they have not only reached the point of diminishing returns, they have passed it.

Bill

They seem to make something to fit everyone's need...they have a lot of products for a new company. They listen to the public well so I wouldn't be surprised if they make rangefinders next year.

It isn't hype if they back it up.

Companies like Vortex or Zen Ray will get my business. Would love a pair of Swaros, but can't afford them.

.

I've a notion which brand(s) you're referring to, but would you mind spilling the beans?

Bob- I don't think the Asian optics on the market are quite to the level of the Europeans yet, and I don't believe anyone is making that claim, but it's not because they can't do it, it's simply because no one has asked them to yet. Put a set of Zen glass in a nicer made housing with a bit smoother gearing and a tad tigher tolerances and you'll have an Alpha equal for less than half the price that will last every bit as long. I'd be willing to guess we'll see something along those lines sooner rather than later.

Here's some food for thought: If you were to secretly put some Zen ED2 glass in a new Leica or Zeiss housing with a new Leica or Zeiss model name on it and show it around at the next trade show, what do you think the reaction would be?

The reaction would be.............."Wow these are frickin great......"

I have a deployed buddy who asked me to find him a good deal on a spotter. On dougs reccomendation I purchased the Vortex Skyline 20-60 spotter. After checking out the new spotter after it arrived I bought the same one for myself to replace my Kowa which had been stolen a few years ago. I found it to be every bit the equal in optical quality. I have been using it for 4 months now at the range aqnd I am extremely satisfied with it.

Its funny how these discussions on optics always seem to end up the same way.

Nuts and bolts, it doesnt matter what everybody else says about glass. All that matters is if you can find what your looking for when looking through whatever you decide to purchase. I've been guiding hunts for almost 20 years and in the majority of cases I've found that the most expensive binoculars wont make a guy find more deer. Its funny when one of my Mexican trackers with binoculars that cost $30 at Wal Mart 10 years ago out spots guys with $2000 alpha glass on a consistant basis. It happens ALL THE TIME

So, in my experience, the Vortex Kaibabs are a better buy than the Swarovski 15x binos. I have spent so damn many hours behind both that its not even funny and I prefer the Vortex. It fits my eyes better, its just as clear to me and its more that half the cost. Only time will tell if they are as tough but with the warranty thats offered from Vortex I'm not worried about it.

I am tough on equipment and have sent my Swarovskis back to the factory on average of once every 3 years. I will see how the Vortex hold up. So far so good.

Finally, have a Leica Televid spotting scope, a pair of 10x Swarovskis and a pair of 10's and 15's from Vortex. They are all nice. If you dont like Vortex then dont buy em but to bash them with little to no experience with them is simply ignorant. I especially like the stories where a guy that doesnt like something just happened to look through it once.

Drummond

Also, I live in northern CO, anybody that wants to go out and look through them just let me know and we'll go look at a few bucks and bulls close to the house here

It should happen ALL THE TIME. You�re a guide operating a guide service and your Mexican Trackers LIVE there and could out- spot the vast majority of people with two toilet paper rolls taped together...it's their home turf. They do it all the time; they know where the deer are; they know what to look for; they probably don't really need the glass. Spotting isn�t simply sticking a nice set of binos up to your face and look for a deer standing broadside 10 yards from the wood line. Better glass means less eye fatigue, better color differentiation (brown leaves or brown fur?), better depth differentiation, etc, etc, etc�. If your Mexican Trackers couldn�t out�spot the large majority of hunters you�d need some new Mexican Trackers.

Obviously the point I was trying to make missed its mark, you must have read my post through a set of Vortex glasses


You said in a previous post...


Not even close? Thats just a rediculous statement to make IMO. I think I saw where you were making your assessment based on one experience with a Vortex Razor spotter? Maybe I'm wrong but I was under the impression that this is what you said. Have you looked through the Kaibabs? If so, how many hours and under what conditions were you able to assess them? How about the Swarovski 15x's? Same question, what kind of conditions and how many hours? I'm not trying to be a horses behind but I have been blessed to spend hundreds, if not thousands of hours behind the binoculars in question and I can tell you that for the money and for what I need the Vortex is a better buy. The quality of the view through the Kaibabs are VERY close to that of the Swarovski.

Maybe I am not the right guy to compare these glasses, I have been blessed by the good Lord with great eyesight. Maybe a guy with contacts or glasses would have a different perspective but to me the 2 binoculars are optically very close

This thread makes me think of one of my hunters from California. He is the best shot of any of the hunters I've ever hunted with. He shoots an old 30-06 with a Weaver scope and I have never seen him miss a shot and some were just rediculous. His setup isnt very expensive but for him it works the best. I was out in California about 10 years ago and watched him win a skeet shoot with an old beat up pump shotgun. I wish I had a camera to capture the looks he got when he walked up and when he left, the facial expressions were priceless. Those guys just couldnt imagine how a guy with a $200 setup could outshoot them with shotguns that cost God knows how much. The point that I have been trying to make is that sometimes the most expensive piece of equipment doesnt always work the best and that the individual operating the equipment has a lot to do with the outcome.

Look, I get it, you read about Vortex on some sniper forum on the internet so you went out and used it for a bit. In your opinion they dont compare to "the big 3" as you put it. Awesome outcomes data there! If you dont like em dont buy em. For me, I'll take my experience and the experience of guys like Enrique that have literally used and compared apples to apples in optics for years in all sorts of conditions and I will make an educated decision. To me, its an easy decision to make. It is funny that on internet forums you will hear people talk down or speak poorly about the Vortex brand but the majority of the guys that I know and trust in the hunting industry that have spent some time with the Vortex brand have great things to say. None of us drank the marketing Kool-aid or got paid to sit in a circle, sing koombaya and praise the almighty Vortex, we just genuinely like the product we looked through.

Drummond

Scott, that's a fair statement,and may really be my only point..... something has to be scarificed for less money is all I'm saying...and in case I did not make myself clear,this does not always mean that what we leave on the table is important.....

Heck I've killed the overwhelming majority of stuff with lowly 4X Leupolds,mostly out of shear stubborness,and because younger eyes and tons of practice allowed me to make it work,but mostly because the things have been utterly reliable for me........at the same time I was doing this,I had a bin made by one of the big 3 hanging around my neck....so in the end I am not a real optics snob; and I knew there were better scopes out there all along......advancing age is making me change my tune a bit now,because I simply see better now through more expensive stuff....even a curmudgeon can ignore the improvements only so long.....

I can't say what the reaction would be with Zen Ray glass in a Zeiss or Leica housing,since I have never even seen a Zen binocular.....likely,at first glance,we may be fooled....but I bet the price point would be different then,too

I have to laugh every time I read this!!