Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Stock finish repair: Win. Mod. 70 Classic

I won't bore you with all the details, but I just got my Mid-90's Mod. 70 Featherweight Classic .280 Rem. back from a family member who managed to put some deep scratches in the stock.

I can't post photos, but it looks like someone drug a knurled nut from a Weaver style scope ring down the side of the stock, leaving 3 parallel scratches about an inch long. The first 3/4" is only into the finish, deep enough to grab a fingernail, the bottom 1/4" is slightly into the wood.
The finish appears to be a polyurethane of some sort.

Is there any product out there that will blend with and fill a polyurethane finish? I would really like to keep from having to re-finish this rifle as it was one of the Featherweights with the highly figured (almost supergrade) stocks, and before it received this recent mauling, was in 90%+ condition.

Would greatly appreciate any help anyone can provide.

Try to steam out any dents with a damp rag and iron. The melt on filler is what I would try for a major gouge.

If it is like a super grade stock it probably doesn't have the heavy opaque stain which is easier to re-finish. The standard stain would require a complete refinish.

I think it is a poly finish, if so the entire stock needs to be scuffed sanded very lightly for adhesion about 380 grit. I would use a wipe on polyurethane finish and apply as thinly as possible.

try minwax wipe on poly finish. it comes in gloss or semi-gloss finish..


this is now my go to finish for anything wood. .really easy to apply with no runs and blends very well


you may be able to build up the scratch areas and then level it out with a sanding block for the final finish

Thanks for the help, guys. I'll give the Minwax a try.

Might just try a rub down with boiled linseed oil first after raising the dented wood.

The Minwax is good but has a plastic look to it like all poly varnishes. Get the gloss and then rub it out to a satin finish. Or you can go over it with Boiled Linseed or mix the two for the final top coats.

I would be tempted to just refinish the entire stock with a poly oil mix or spar/oil mix. Not that much more work and it insures good results which a partial refinish doesn't always accomplish.

Putting a heavy layer over an unknown oil finish is usually a recipe for adhesion disasters...

Spot repair it (steam the dents out and fill the holes) and use an oil finish to blend the repair.

Superglue is the best filler in this case.

The finish is mostly oil, but there are color issues and sanding the surface for adhesion will do little because there are thin spots that will show much worse after sanding. A very quick wipe with some strong solvent will provide more tooth with less risk.

I like Formby's Furniture Refinisher on that type finish. Often it can be applied to the damaged area and used to move just enough finish into the area to hide the scratches...
art

Tejano,

I have often wondered if oil and polyurethane could be mixed into a good wood finishing product. Yours is the first reference to it I have ever seen. Please tell me of your experiences with it, and any recipes that have worked well for you on gunstocks. Thank you.

Tejano
Was typing at the same time and did not notice your additional post. Most BLO is ourchased as the can at the hardware store... It is the dregs of the barrel in most cases for good cure for stocks... If used alone it is risky and may never cure. At the very least a big shot of Japan Drier is a good idea.

I stick to the adhesion issue notion, pun intended.
art

Big Redhead
Most commercial "Oil Finishes" include some resins and poly is the most common. They work well and are easy to apply. Cutting poly with oil will reduce the waterproofness, but increase the ease of application and usually enhance the look...
art

Thanks Sitka. What ratio of poly to oil? Will boiled linseed work?

I cannot make plain boiled linseed get dry. It stays wet until it soaks into the wood. Then it looks like I've done nothing at all to the stock.

I lightly sand the scratch, then sweat the wood to level or above, then refinish the area to match as close as I can..

But in reality sometimes its just best to refinish the complete stock. Matching will come close if the person is good at it, but under a direct light or sunlight one can always tell where the old finish and the new come together...

Linseed oil, boiled or not will never completely dry unless you add Japanese Dryer. Linseed oil is pretty much a defunct finish today, Just too many good options out there such as Brownells GUN-SAV-OR for instance..Easy to apply and matches the best of the English oil finishes and is way more water proof and durable, comes in satin or gloss.

Oil is "boiled" to make it start polymerizing. When Japan Drier was discovered they stopped heating the oil to cure it. Original driers were lead or other heavy-metals based. Other catalysts are used today without the toxic side-effects.

Problem with boiled linseed oil is it has to have lots of shelf life... Once oxygen hits oil with catalysts it starts curing. Inhibitors are added to walk a fine line between the two needs. Adding drier is required if you are going to use BLO as a finish by itself.

A method I have used a number of times on stocks is to start with a tiny container of good poly finish. Make sure it is fresh, which means it should be very thin and runny. Adding solvents will not make old finish better...

Apply a coat of the poly finish and wipe it dry as soon as you are finished applying it. Add oil to the poly to refill the can. When the first coat is dry add another coat. Let this one soak for just a few minutes and wipe it completely dry.

Repeat this process until you are happy with the look. If you do a good job wiping it dry each time there will be no need to sand at any point before the final truing up and final coating.

If you are using BLO for oil you should go to a paint or art store and get some paint drier to add.
art

Lots of good tips, but what he said.
If I'm the one (or whatever person) is the one who finished it, you can bet a repair will be spotless as they have the same finish to use in the repair.
IF wood has been removed in the attack, best to strip, and flat sand that area out to hide after trying to swell it up. Good luck whatever route you take, but I'd say skip the attempt at repair and proceed directly to refinish.

Oh, and if you can find a GeneralFinishes product called ARM-R-SEAL, its outstanding.

The BLO I have is the same can I have used my entire life. It originally belonged to my dad. He always said BLO was a good gunstock finish. I always said BS because I never could make it dry. This is the first time I ever heard about "Japan drier." Just how fast will BLO dry if I add Japan drier?

Actually, discarding the old BLO and purchasing a modern oil gunstock finish product is probably a better idea. So far on this thread I have heard the names ARM-A-SEAL and GUN-SAV-OR. I suspect they are both good or they would not have been mentioned. Are there any other good oil gunstock finishes out there?

I would apologize for hijacking this thread, but I really don't think I have. All my questions are germain to the original thread topic.

I agree with all the others, but what works for one may not for another.

Flecto Varathan and later Permalyn and Custom Classic Oil finish are all mixes of Varnish and oil. I just mix my own with only the amount needed at the time.

Start with 30-30-30 Oil-Varnish-Turpentine add about 1-2% Japan or Cobalt drier. The oil from the art supply places is better quality than the hardware type which is the dregs.

Some claim better water proofing with Tung Oil. Turpentine will bond with the finish while mineral spirits just dilute it. The drier will make the finish more brittle and reduce storage life to a couple of weeks, so go easy on it. Search the wood finishing boards they have lots of info on this method.

For better moisture resistance use a phenolic spar varnish and polymerized Tung oil in the mix. Still not equal to epoxy but it has its advantages ( looks and ease of repair ).

As always get some wood scraps and pieces of window pane glass to test the finish before trying on an expensive piece of wood.

YMMV Good luck.

Tejano
I agree spar varnish with oil is an effective stock finish which is easy to apply well and produces good results for most stock applications.

Not sure where the turpentine thoughts come from, though, but they are not real... Turpentine is a solvent and evaporates like any other, just takes longer to do it and causes all sorts of issues when it does. It does not bond with the finish in anyway at any time. Cutting by a full half on solvent is way beyond excessive.

Finishes should be cut only as much as absolutely required... It absolutely reduces water resistance. Replacing oil which requires thinning is safer and better.

All curing oils polymerize by definition and the last thing you want is oil which has already started to cure.

Lab tests have shown repeatedly that tung oil and linseed oil are virtually identical in waterproofing... They do less than nothing... Hygroscopic in both cases.

Many years ago when I began "experimenting" with stock refinishing I realized what Art says about waterproofing qualities are spot on.

I tried all kinds of goops, concoctions, etc. In one particular flash of brilliance (closest thing to a brainstorm I've come is a drizzle) I decided to use a hair dryer set on warm. This happened to be my first tung oil experiment and was pleased how it was progressing. I happened to leave the blowdryer in one area a bit longer than necessary. Suddenly I saw water bubbles popping out of the pores. At first I thought it was something in the finish, but was able to confirm it was H2O. The stock (factory) obviously had a high moisture content and just a relatively small amount of heat and bingo there it was oozing out.

If it had been waterproof I wouldn't have seen that.

I've purchased some G2 epoxy from Industrial Formulators and as soon as I have a stock inletted and shaped will give it a go.

Another adventure begins .

Agreed that is why I hedged saying water resistant. Some claim the porous nature of an oil finish is an asset. No question that the synthetics are better in extreme conditions starting with epoxy finished wood on to full synthetic stocks.

Tung Oil has two more molecular bonds than Linseed when it polymerizes. The water resistance is very slightly higher than Linseed Oil. This and availability are why the Military switched to Tung Oil sometime around the 1940s even though the Tung Oil is far more expensive.

Looks, ease of application, repair-ability generally satisfactory for average weather resistance are the reasons that I think the oil/varnish type finish are better for tinkerers. Far better than either alone. And the biggest reason mistakes are easy to fix.

Not so with an epoxy finish. I've applied, sanded, inhaled, and eaten enough of the stuff to know I should avoid it for all but certain applications like boat building and stock bedding. Same with Lacquer finishes except Shellac just not for me.

Tejano
Not sure where your Tung oil info is coming from, but it continues to be wrong... Linoleic acid is the most important bonding unit in both tung and linseed oil. And Tung actually has a little less of it. Cuts of the main components vary considerably by area grown, particular cultivar, weather, extraction method and application, crop maturity, and lots of other variables, so there is no way to state absolutely which has more of any particular component.

There is absolutely no difference in bonding type, strength, number of bonds or anything else that affects the finish. Linseed oil is almost always a large part of tung oil finishes and is often the only oil in the finish.

The perceived differences are strictly a result of marketing disinformation.
art

Don't try the steam thing unless you plan on stripping the whole thing and starting over. I did that once on a glossy Winchester and made big opac blotches where the steam came up under the gloss finish. I would try a little 400 sand paper very carefully so as not to cut into the stain. Just roughen the surface a little, as in very little, then wipe it with 0000 steel wool, again very gently. With your finger tip, apply a little Formbys Gloss Tung Oil finish. Leave it dry over night and then polish with a piece of wool sock. You may have to put on several thin coats to get what you want, but you won't do any harm .