Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only 458 Win Mag

Hi,

I'm brand new to the forum. Been lurking for a while. Been shooting for a long time.

A few years ago I got the itch to buy some big bore rifle. I found a used Number 1 Tropical in Texas. The gentleman cut me a good deal and for $500 I got me a big bore. I bought 150 new win brass for about $70 and started loading. I shoot from mild to wild, cast and jacketed. The gun had some nice wear when I bought it so it was a perfect shooter. I used it to shoot a nice little fork buck one year with a reduced load, a speer 400g JFP over 65g of H4895. I never chrono'd it but it made a nice 1/2" hole through that buck.

If I ever get the chance to go to Africa, I'll buy a bolt gun probably in the same caliber, as I'm quite used the recoil of heavy loads. Though the 416 Ruger looks quite nice too.

None the less, I'll be posting here and there. I just recently bought a Ruger Alaskan 454. I like big bores and don't mind the recoil in limited quantities.

Great forum!!

welcome!

Big bores are remarkable cartridges for the handloader because you can both pick the bullet for the chore at hand, and also load to a velocity that is within your control.

By doing this for a period of time, the familiarity and understanding that the gun was designed by mortal man for use by mortal man, means you will gain proficiency and confidence.

I personnaly hate the recoil of a heavily loaded .458, but I love the cartridge. Most .458 rifles are too light which is why the recoil is heavy. For occasional use, most recoil can be managed in the field.

I have have many an SCI members state that they would love me to back them up using my .460 but to a man, they don't want to shoot it. It is something you learn to accept I think.

I have convinced myself anyway.

JW

I've been told (and I did so) to punch it out to .458Lott and then you have both. Never shot either but am waiting for my build and will report back.

All the hard hitters take a toll in time. The 338 hurts me about as bad as anything, and I shoot on up to 458 Lott...have for many years now.

If you shoot them long enough you'll have what I have, a bum shoulder and arm. I can hardly hold onto anything with my right hand anymore from too much big bore shooting.

But...I love the big holes they make!!!!

I think that is one reason the .45/70 has such a following. You get the big holes without the heavy recoil. Any cartridge that can be managed by the masses is going to be popular.

Where the .458 has an advantage over the Lott is in mind-set. You are more likely to load a 9 pound Model 70 .458 with 350 and 400 grain bullets and go hunting than a 10-11 pound .458 Lott which is mostly thought of as a stopping rifle for the handful, or couple of, dangerous game animals the majority of hunters will take.

It's quite personal really.

JW

I think your wise to look at the .416, its a fine combination of stopping power and recoil, much easier to shoot IMO...The std. .458 in factory persuasion does not recoil bad but it leaves a lot to be desired IMO.. Most know I am not a fan of the .458 Win. and prefer a Lott if I have to take a beating..However the Lott is no joy to shoot under any conditions, and if I have to load it down or with light bullets then I have defeated the original purpose of owning it..I should have bought a lighter rifle caliber.

Your clue to me was you don't mind recoil in "limited amounts" which IMO means you don't like recoil of your gun..I am the same way...therefore I chose a caliber that I could shoot any amount of rounds at a sitting and get by and that in my case is the .416 Rem or Ruger..Many would be better off with the great .375 H&H or 9.3x62..

I am also of the opine that the .416 kill better than the .458 Win. does on big stuff. That has been my experience based on shooting mostly buffalo and quite a few with both.

DCplumber,,, welcome to the Campfire,,, I have been here for a while and I think it is great, almost everyone will have a helpful comment if you toss out a question.
I also have a .458 win mag...I load it with 350gr Hornady RN and/or the Nosler Partition 300gr...I am still working up a load to give me the best groups, but the round is great. About a year ago I had some t-shirts printed that say .458 across to back, in large font.
Anyway, welcome again, talk to you soon, JH

I just picked up a .416 rigby from Dakota. I love it, I shot it a few times and then had problems with my piece o' crap swarovski scope, so I had to send it back to Swarovski and I have been shooting it with iron sights. I love it with or without the scope. I also shoot the .375 ultra and just picked up a .470 nitro...

Hi, thanks for the warm welcome.

The main reason I ended up with a 458 #1 is because it was only $500!! I would have gotten a lever gun in 45-70 or 450 marlin probably, but, well, you know, at the local gun club, we tend to get into pissin matches, and well, no one can shoot this nearly as well as I can. There are lots of 45-70's, which they tell me is close to a 458. I've done the math, the 45-70 falls short by about 20% given equal bullet weight. I AM NOT SLAMMIN THE 45-70! Since I'm not packin my bags for Africa yet, I figured the $500 deal was the way to go. It's cheap and fun.

All of that said, if I had the money and was heading for a dangerous game hunt, I would definitely be looking around. But for the time being, this baby is definitely making me familiar with big bore rifles.

I do like the nostalgia of older cartridges. I like the 416 Rigby alot. If I would have come across a number one in 416 Rigby, I would have bought that too.

My main target load in the 458 is a Meister 405g lead over 60g or Rel 7 with a mag primer. I load 100 at time. They last me through the summer.

I tried some Barnes 500g Triple shocks over 65g or H4895 and chrono'd them at 1950. That was nice round. I currently have some Speer Hot Core 350g over 70g of H4895 that I'll use for deer season this fall.

It definitely makes for interesting nights at deer camp. That's why we're there. For the conversation. Nuf said for now.

Thanks,

Welcome from here as well! Enjoy your time with the biggies and take the trip to Africa when you can.

good hunting,

MARK

DC,

You are right. The 458 can be a 45-70 but the 45-70 cannot be a 458. I love my 45-70 and love the performance I get from it but I will not try to make a 458 out of it. I keep hoping to stumble on to a deal like yours. I love big bores as well.

mart

Welcome. I plan on messing around more with my 458 this summer. It really needs to have the old Ruger red pad replaced though. I've made the move to downsize almost everything I hunt with, however the 458 was a gift from an old friend and I do love the way it handles. Need to figure out something to shoot with it this fall.

Aussie - you've nailed it! I shoot 350/400 grs in my .458 WM Rem 798 for those reasons. You get more trigger time w/o the snot beat out of you. I believe any 400 gr bullet, moving at 2200 + fps sufficient - after all, made the .404 Jeff's rep. Because of .45/70 usage these bullets (from a variety of mfgr's) are cheaper and easier to procure. Not many "Jumbo's" or "Buffs", needing the 500gr flavors, lurk in So. Florida. Have plenty of pythons and hogs however... Regards, Homesteader

The 458 Win has been the most popular big bore in most African countries now for over 50 years so I would say that it also deserves the "Classic" title as much as any cartidge.
I have twenty-seven years experience with it and the more I use other large bores the more impressed I am with it. Like the three bears - it's not too big - it's not too small - it's just right for any game in any circumstances.

How long of a barrel do I need with a .458WM to reliably get a muzzle velocity of 2050 fps with a 480-500gr bullet? That's the combination that made the .450 Nitro famous and if it can be done with a WM from a short barrel that's enough for me.

22 inches will do it easily. Just get a standard Model 70 and you are there. I have actually chronographed 22 inch tubes that were faster than factory ammo with 450's at 3300fps and some 500's at 2100-2200fps, also 550's at 1950-1975fps.

It is a great cartridge and makes a wonderful heavy brush hunting cartridge for larger or potentially dangerous game and is equally efficient with 45/70 bullets loaded for pigs.

With 350 X bullets, it will shoot flat to 300 yards and more if you learn how to utilize its potential. The 400 grainers are great for large US game and most African game.

JW

Interesting...

The only scope I have had fail in 48 years hunting with scoped rifles was a Swaro on a 9,3X62. It self-destructed inside, and I had them give me a refund, not another scope. I had a Bushnell Banner on an old 458 for 25 years, and it was still "ticking". I bought it that way with the older Weaver mounts, as it was very inexpensive, and the former owner had several cases of "magnum eyebrow" from it.

Welcome. I don't have a big bore nor do I particularly want one.

Well.... I have shot a truckload of deer with my old 6 pound Ithaca 37, 12 gauge. Now that little gun shooting 3 inch magnums will reposition my hat. Does that qualify as a big bore?

Anyway, welcome.
May you derive much pleasure from time spent with the guys on the forum. They tend to not be shy concerning their opinion and levity may, at times, trump facts.
Enjoy and Best to you.
Jim

I would like to go down to an 18" barrel. For the long range stuff I have a .416 rigby but the .458 would be for bears and such. Stopping rather than hunting so short is a major bonus.